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Yep. I will absolutely be more likely to like, comment etc on a track made by a woman (or non-binary person, or other under-represented person), simply because of that. We need more diversity in

In the grand scheme of things, women have had a much more challenging time establishing themselves as creatives in the music industry (let alone just about every other industry).   also...

fuck all these bitches imo we out here PENIS GANG

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31 minutes ago, TheBro said:

I welcome women here of course 100% and I think women get my point too. 

I mean, I don't think this topic is particularly welcoming toward women. Priorities, right?

Yes there are women that exploit men drooling over them for their own profit. Is it their fault for exploiting them? The men's fault for enabling them? The deep-rooted dysfunctional gender dynamics that created this tedious and distracting situation in the first place? For every one of these, there's another woman earnestly working her ass off to make cool shit, and I'm a hell of a lot more interested in what she's doing.

29 minutes ago, Alcofribas said:

to suggest that young women receive attention precisely for their relevance to men as sex objects ("biological reasons") is not a verboten topic among liberals lmao

This post is like that picture that keeps flipping between duck/rabbit, ouch my brain.

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Well I think my original point was a fair point. 228 plays on this girl's tune and over 28 comments in just a day!!! My tune by comparison has a mere 18 plays and has been up for 8 days and received no comments on Facebook. It may sound like I'm jealous but my only point was how unfair the bias is. I'm just asking for equal treatment - what's wrong with that?

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1 hour ago, Amen Lare said:

It's not fair and you're right in noticing and your nickname is cool, yet we should be more specific in such cases as feministic/left-liberal view of the world is dominating the minds, so no generalized common sense discussion is possible as it's immediately viewed as macho/sexist etc. Just a matter of opinion fashion.

So, your example is chick got way more attention to her social media post than you would with the same sort of material. And i guess it has little to do with music in this case and more with attention allocation in social media -- yeah, chicks get way more attention when they're young for biological factors. Say there's approx the same amount of women and men, and, broadly speaking, men age 14-70 will be on a lookout for women age 12-35 approx for baby manufacturing appeal, the higher the age distance the less intersection but you get the math. And this sort of lookout is way more deep than looking out for a cool track from fellow peniser.

Where i suggest you to find fairness is you will get the same treatment throughout your life and chicks have more narrow window of getting attention. When she's like 50, it's unlikely she will have this kind of advantage over you. Be safe!

Chicks, eh? Trolling in this scenario works better with a flat and academic presentation.

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4 minutes ago, TheBro said:

Well I think my original point was a fair point. 228 plays on this girl's tune and over 28 comments in just a day!!! My tune by comparison has a mere 18 plays and has been up for 8 days and received no comments on Facebook. It may sound like I'm jealous but my only point was how unfair the bias is. I'm just asking for equal treatment - what's wrong with that?

Here's a small article on the difference between equality and equity: https://www.mentalfloss.com/article/625404/equity-vs-equality-what-is-the-difference

625404-iisc_equalityequity_300ppi.jpg

Women are just as capable of being talented producers as men are, but they often don't have the extra forces (encouragement or the lack thereof) that would give them an equal playing field right at the start. Women have historically be underrepresented in the arts, music especially.

Your observation also needs to answer a few questions like "who are the plays and likes coming from?" And if this is on social media then what hashtags are used? How big is her audience? Has she engaged her audience in a meaningful way? Et cetera.

There are a lot of factors at play and it's not fair for you to assume that you should have the same thing for multiple reasons.

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Just now, xox said:

@TheBro

dont be naive man! You just can’t complete 😂 get over it

I know man but it just makes me sick to the stomach when people talk of equality and this kinda stuff happens just illustrates my point. Anyways I'm cool but just figured I'd vent as it was something that was eating me up a bit. You know I'm pretty laid back so I'll sleeping dogs lie lol.

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Just now, TheBro said:

Well I think my original point was a fair point. 228 plays on this girl's tune and over 28 comments in just a day!!! My tune by comparison has a mere 18 plays and has been up for 8 days and received no comments on Facebook. It may sound like I'm jealous but my only point was how unfair the bias is. I'm just asking for equal treatment - what's wrong with that?

you haven’t established a bias. social media doesn’t even work that way - it is not some neutral social medium in which all posts are measured fairly to scrupulous standards thus ensuring everyone gets their fair share of likes. there are many factors that go into the level of attention given to specific posts and i don’t think fairness ranks very highly among them, nor do i think there is a pervasive bias that affords women more attention for posting music online. 

 

that being said it sucks to feel like no one cares about music you make when you work hard on it and try to show it to the world online. if that’s the core emotion, I feel you. but if you’re suggesting the only reason some track gets more attention is bc a woman made it, you’ve lost me if for no other reason than that the world is filled with extraordinarily successful male producers who are absolute shite. 

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Braintree with respect man I don't see there being anything getting in women's way of making good art. Least from my viewpoint there isn't. The only thing that makes a whole fiasco of it is when men start acting like they do for it undermines what women are trying achieve. Anyways that's how I see. 

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7 minutes ago, TheBro said:

Well I think my original point was a fair point. 228 plays on this girl's tune and over 28 comments in just a day!!! My tune by comparison has a mere 18 plays and has been up for 8 days and received no comments on Facebook. It may sound like I'm jealous but my only point was how unfair the bias is. I'm just asking for equal treatment - what's wrong with that?

I think you are being an ass if your first thought is "hey they are listening and commenting on her tune ONLY BECAUSE IT'S A GIRL". Her track might just be better too and more to people's taste.

That said I am sure girls (especially good looking IDM girls) will get more attention than doughy dads or pasty nerds, but is this attention because their tracks are good or is it because there are 1000 million horny men on the internet trying to creep and hit on them every time they post something. Like, they are not commenting because they like the track really.

 

Regarding appearances though - you are damn right this matters. No matter how good your tune is, you got to create the visuals or something else that will lure people to hit that play button. And not just lure people, lure the RIGHT people. Yeah maybe hot girls have it easy (or make it look like this), but nobody is entitled to people listening to their stuff just so.

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2 minutes ago, TheBro said:

Braintree with respect man I don't see there being anything getting in women's way of making good art. Least from my viewpoint there isn't. The only thing that makes a whole fiasco of it is when men start acting like they do for it undermines what women are trying achieve. Anyways that's how I see. 

There are many obstacles that prevent women from getting the same things as men. Pretending like the playing field is level is foolish.

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1 minute ago, thawkins said:

Regarding appearances though - you are damn right this matters. No matter how good your tune is, you got to create the visuals or something else that will lure people to hit that play button. And not just lure people, lure the RIGHT people. Yeah maybe hot girls have it easy (or make it look like this), but nobody is entitled to people listening to their stuff just so.

Also, if it's easier for women to make stuff look good it's because they have PRACTICE doing this. Standing in front of the mirror with a pile of cosmetics, fine-tuning their look, every day. Because that's expected of them.

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2 minutes ago, thawkins said:

I think you are being an ass if your first thought is "hey they are listening and commenting on her tune ONLY BECAUSE IT'S A GIRL". Her track might just be better too and more to people's taste.

That said I am sure girls (especially good looking IDM girls) will get more attention than doughy dads or pasty nerds, but is this attention because their tracks are good or is it because there are 1000 million horny men on the internet trying to creep and hit on them every time they post something. Like, they are not commenting because they like the track really.

 

Regarding appearances though - you are damn right this matters. No matter how good your tune is, you got to create the visuals or something else that will lure people to hit that play button. And not just lure people, lure the RIGHT people. Yeah maybe hot girls have it easy (or make it look like this), but nobody is entitled to people listening to their stuff just so.

Look man her tune was good but it wasn't great. It was decent but all that attention by mostly guys just undermines the art imo. I've seen it time and time again. I will totally respect a women's art if its good. Not only that I'll accept if she's more talented than you or I and I can think of lots of female producers out there who are better than me of course. My point is the bias you have to be blind not to see it now these days. 🙂

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35 minutes ago, TheBro said:

Well I think my original point was a fair point. 228 plays on this girl's tune and over 28 comments in just a day!!! My tune by comparison has a mere 18 plays and has been up for 8 days and received no comments on Facebook. It may sound like I'm jealous but my only point was how unfair the bias is. I'm just asking for equal treatment - what's wrong with that?

Maybe she has a big fanbase already? Maybe she posted it in loads of places other than on watmm? Maybe its a better track?

Can you post both tracks in this thread, I need to form an unbiased opinion on which track is better.

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5 minutes ago, TheBro said:

Look man her tune was good but it wasn't great. It was decent but all that attention by mostly guys just undermines the art imo. I've seen it time and time again. I will totally respect a women's art if its good. Not only that I'll accept if she's more talented than you or I and I can think of lots of female producers out there who are better than me of course. My point is the bias you have to be blind not to see it now these days. 🙂

Well, be the change that you want to see in the world and stop complaining about a girl getting more likes than you. In time we can only hope all 27 of those other guys also stop being creeps on the interwebs.

 

Also wtf are expecting, posting your stuff on Facebook of all things? All that is left there is senile old people and right wing idiots. Neither have a good appreciation for music.

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@TheBro

You see that eeeeven ppl on watmm don’t get you and you’re expecting the world to get it?! Just chill man! Do your music for music’s sake and live long and prosper

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Yeah IMO the way to make it is 99% hard work 1% luck, just do the hard work and don't waste energy on complaining, encourage others even if you think their stuff sucks* and be ready to grab onto that 1% of luck when it winks at you.

And even in the end if you did not get lucky, you can always say you did your best and worked for it.

* - people whose stuff sucks will end up being good at another genre that you dislike which means you won't be competing for fans or attention anyway.

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3 minutes ago, xox said:

@TheBro

You see that eeeeven ppl on watmm don’t get you and you’re expecting the world to get it?! Just chill man! Do your music for music’s sake and live long and prosper

Thanks man. I do do my music for myself and for my little fanbase. Peace. 😉 

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tbh i don't even feel like there's much of a reason to want strangers on the internet to pay attention to your music in 2020. all you'll be doing is making some tech ceo slightly richer & helping to finetune his algoritm. your music will be one of the five thousand random-ass tracks that some kid streamed that month & instantly forget. if you get any sort of public image someone will go & find an embarassing comment you made somewhere 10 years ago & as a result you'll get cancelled from your job at the soap factory. is anyone even making money off this shit anymore?

better just to have a few friends who you talk shop with from time to time, where primarily what you're sharing is mutual love of the game, and it doesn't even really matter if they hear your stuff or not

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1 minute ago, Cryptowen said:

tbh i don't even feel like there's much of a reason to want strangers on the internet to pay attention to your music in 2020. all you'll be doing is making some tech ceo slightly richer & helping to finetune his algoritm. your music will be one of the five thousand random-ass tracks that some kid streamed that month & instantly forget. if you get any sort of public image someone will go & find an embarassing comment you made somewhere 10 years ago & as a result you'll get cancelled from your job at the soap factory. is anyone even making money off this shit anymore?

Point taken but one of the most beautiful things in art is a stranger finding something new they connect with!

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