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8 hours ago, thefxbip said:

Yeah i guess its one of those things with Zebra...i did use it a bit to make some colundi stuff but the damn interface just turns me off.

Somewhat superficially of me I found Zebra to be a lot more usable with the Neumann Pro skin ( https://plugmon.jp/product/neumann-pro/ )

neumann-pro-main-scaled.jpg

Same with Bazille, found it a lot easier with the Tokyo Ghost skin ( https://plugmon.jp/product/tokyo-ghost/ )

tg-main-mq.jpg

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VCV Rack can be great if you select a handful of modules. I bought Rack 2 for the MI and Instruo modules alone. Otherwise it's easy to be lost / overwhelmed by the countless options.

WRT Bazille, which is certainly my most used synth, I love the Gearporn UI.

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I don't want to start a thread for this so I'll ask here instead;

Does anyone know of a good/alright windorgan (the cheap kind from the, I think 70's that have a little motor in them that sucks air into the organ) or harmonium sample pack or vst? I'm looking for something that sounds kind of creaky. Might try something with an additive synth and some added noise later maybe that'll work.

WRT plugins I bought, besides some of the stuff already mentioned I bought the Soundtoys suite/pack/lot a few years ago during a sale. No regrets at all. If you wanna dip a toe in I can thoroughly recommend the lil little plate reverb (think it is or was free, maybe 25,- 99,- now)

Edited by user
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On 6/14/2022 at 3:05 AM, mcbpete said:

Somewhat superficially of me I found Zebra to be a lot more usable with the Neumann Pro skin ( https://plugmon.jp/product/neumann-pro/ )

neumann-pro-main-scaled.jpg

Same with Bazille, found it a lot easier with the Tokyo Ghost skin ( https://plugmon.jp/product/tokyo-ghost/ )

tg-main-mq.jpg

same. i like the plugmon skin a lot. his skins for uhe stuff are awesome. 

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20 hours ago, user said:

Does anyone know of a good/alright windorgan (the cheap kind from the, I think 70's that have a little motor in them that sucks air into the organ) or harmonium sample pack or vst? I'm looking for something that sounds kind of creaky. Might try something with an additive synth and some added noise later maybe that'll work.

I don't know of one but I would try tweaking a single reed stop from an accordion or Indian harmonium sample pack (detune a little, EQ it to approximate the ugly low-mid reonances that make old air organs sound the way the do, maybe add a little noise to approximate a fan. The main differences between chord organs and accordions (other than overall build quality) is that most of the left hand of the accordion is completely omitted and the bellows are replaced with an electric fan, otherwise it's pretty much the reeds from a cheap accordon (without any of the unison or octave reeds that accordions use for their differend stops), and the bare minimum number of chord buttons they can get away with (I've seen more than one really cheap one that only had enough chords to play in C Major or minor, and a couple that didn't have any).

 

You could probably do a good job starting with a melodica sample set, too.

 

I assume you're talking about a little Magnus/Bontempi type thing, like these:

s-l300.jpg

 

il_fullxfull.311615012.jpg

 

I've owned both of those exact models and 3 or 4 other small plastic ones over the years, they all sound different but the fancy wooden kind don't sound significantly different or better than the plastic ones to me.

 

If you mean a big, European harmonium like this, then you can probably find something more easily (but the trouble here is emulating the way the foot pump changes the timbre, pitch and loudness if your pumping isn't consistent  which is a big part of the sound).

 

H11311-L202490794_original.jpg

 

If you want to get really into the weeds you could emulate one of these:

il_570xN.779872521_taij.jpg

I picked up the even smaller keyboard-only version at a thrift shop years ago and the fan is too loud to record with (plus it only works with batteries and takes 6 D cells), but the cool thing about these is that the mechanism is so crude that you can actually use key pressure to bend notes a little bit, so it actually accidentally has polyphonic aftertouch.  If you tune your samples about 25 cent flat and set it up so poly aftertouch bends them up to very slightly sharp (maybe 5-10 cents above pitch at aftertouch=127, if that) with a reverse log response since most of the action happens at the lowest key pressure on the real thing. Then for authenticity mix in a LOT of noise, maybe 75% as loud as the actual notes, and then don'tuse it because it's too noisy - that's been my experience with the one I have.

Edited by TubularCorporation
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22 hours ago, user said:

Does anyone know of a good/alright windorgan (the cheap kind from the, I think 70's that have a little motor in them that sucks air into the organ) or harmonium sample pack or vst? I'm looking for something that sounds kind of creaky. Might try something with an additive synth and some added noise later maybe that'll work.

I used to have one of these, used it loads, it was brilliant to work with

image.png.744780a567146dd7ea953b43446e0422.png

I'd say it's not the kind of thing that can be emulated or even sampled, because you tend to adjust mic position etc to get the tone/room sound to fit with your track.  and in any case it's all the odd sounds, half-pressed keys, stressing/bending the case and wierd interactions you get with chords that get you the good stuff.  infact the best thing I did with it was when I just recorded the motor spinning up and down over and over again

back to OT (plugins) - i've spent plenty of £ on plugins.  everyone has their own personal list of favourites and a lot depends on what host you prefer, but here's what i've got the most use and value from:

synths/MIDI: Harmor, MassiveX, MSoundFactory, Bidule, XPand2, VCV Rack, TAL Sampler, Scaler 2, Phrasebox, all HY-Plugins sequencers

fx: MAutoDynamicEQ, Presswerk, Ohmicide, MTurboReverb, Raum, Chipcrusher, Tantra2, Ubermod, MCabinet, Replika XT, Satin, The Drop, The Scream, SpecOps

 

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@TubularCorporation@xy_politics

Thanks very much. Even though yeah, indeed one will likely end up finding samples way too noisy and/or unable to capture what makes these things so great in the first place your posts made me glad I asked the question. Cheers!

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I'm far from a pro studio engineeror anything, but as a committed hack I'd say they're hands down the most difficult instrument to record that I've ever encountered.  It's like trying to record a harmonica 6 inches away from the fan on your computer, the only way to really make it work is to either mic it from far away like mentioned above, or just embrace the fan noise and lean in to it. But that's not so easy to do if you're recording a sample set.

 

I think the only way to make it work would be to do something along the lines of rigging up a long hose that would connect the intake vent to an air compressor in a different room and using trial and error to figure out the right amount of airflow to make it play in tune, sample the notes that way with the motor turned off, and then get a nice, long loop of isolated fan noise to blend in.

 

But even then it would probably sound more like the accordion sample in an old ROMpler than an actual air organ, because of all the stuff xy_politics said.

 

Seems like they're getting hard to find, too, I haven't seen one locally in years and I definitely regret not having one now

 

As far as the big, console harmoniums with the foot pumps go, if you have a van and are willing to travel long distance you could probably still find one for free with a bit of work. They're like cheap pianos and Lowry organs - 99% of people who have one don't want it, but also don't want to pay to have it taken away so if you can do it they might even give YOU money. An old friend of mine started a moving company back in the mid 2000s and for most of a year he had a couple big box trucks but wasn't open for business yet so they were just parked in a lot.  All summer he answered every Craigslist and public kiosk "free piano (you move it)" type ads, picked up the pianos with one truck and then stored them in the other.  I have no idea what happened to them but at the end of it he had I think 9 uprights and two baby grands stacked up in there, and his only expenses were gas and paying a couple of the freelance movers from his old job that he'd already hired for his company anyhow, so it doubled as employee training for piano moving.

 

Actually, the first IDM I ever heard was a Squarepusher was a CD-R of Burningn'n Tree he gave me back in 10th grade, too. Unrelated, but it sort of makes sense that the person who introduced me to IDM would go on to own 12 pianos in a truck. Nobody I knew used the term IDM in the 90s, though - we just called it music, "IDM" was a bullshit music critic term that was used to show you were in the know and gain pre-Internet clout as far as any of us knew.

 

Not really sure where I'm going with any of this, but I'm out all I could find to eat today was about half a cup of dry museli and a cup of coffee for breakfast, a small bowl of museli with almond milk for lunch, and a bowl of yogurt with museli in it for dinner, so I think all things considered I did OK.

 

EDIT: back in 2003 or 4 I picked up a weird little Magnus or Bontempi for $10 at an outdoor flea market somewhere in the upper West part of the East Village and carried it back down to Chinatown where my girlfriend and I were catching the bus, and somewhere kind of near maybe 4th and A (I don't know my way around Manhattan very well, if it isn't somewhere along the walking route from Chinatown to the original Kim's Video location and then back down Bowery and over to Green Point then I'm lost, and I probably couldn't even pull that off anymore, which is fine since nobody I know has been able to afford to live in Green Point since like 2006 (because the cost of living in early 2000s Brooklyn was than the cost of living in, like, Fall River or something today and in the entire time I had a bunch of friends there I can only think of one person whose rent was over $400 (and that's becasue he was sharing a nice single bedroom place with a private courtyard garden in back and a remodeled kitchen, so his share of the rent was more like $525).

Anyway I was carrying that Magnus somewhere in Alphabet City and this middle aged guy in an expensive suit who looked quite a bit like Uncle Phil saw us from across the street and waved and yelled something about air organs and we waved back.

 

That's my story.  It wasn't short and it wasn't good but I think the punctuation's OK.  I should probably have an actual meal before I got to bed...

Edited by TubularCorporation
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