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luke viia

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if you're comfortable with it,

pls tell watmm your gender (and/or sexual) identity, it would be interesting to know what we all see ourselves as.

editing this bc (if you read the original version) it's pretty clear i conflated a few concepts

to start by introducing myself:

gender: cis male.
sexuality: ace, not aro, i can get close to pretty much anyone, have had a number of what i'd consider deeply close male friendships over the years (that achilles-patroclus / david-jonathan / gilgamesh-enkidu type, idk if that description actually helps lol) that i will always value and remember, and have also dated / been close to absolutely wonderful women in my life (including the most holy-shit-i'm-in-love-lemme-write-a-song unforgettable sorta thing), and i appreciate all of these experiences. longest relationship was with a woman who also identified as ace, it was nice to be on that page with someone else for so long and to be able to talk about it in the open. willing to explain myself more if anyone cares or asks.

gender is a hard thing to nail down and tbh i've sometimes struggled (as a "gray ace") to understand / be understood by most other orientations, but as a cis male i have a pretty thick layer of "passing privilege" and fly under the radar most of the time.

i'd love to hear about everyone's experiences. i'm lucky to have known and made friends with a variety of people of different genders and sexual identities, trans, bi, straight, enby, pan, etc, and they have all been patient and kind with any conversations i've asked for so i'm hoping watmm will be just as tolerant


Edited by luke viia
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21 minutes ago, toaoaoad said:

Ace/aro would be considered a sexual orientation rather than a gender, wouldn't it?

that's fair, but wicky:


Many who identify as asexual also choose to adopt other identities, which often include gender identity and classification of romantic orientation.[26] These are often integrated with a person's asexual identity, and asexuals may still identify as heterosexual, lesbian, gay, or bisexual regarding romantic or emotional aspects of sexual orientation or sexual identity in addition to identifying as asexual.[21] The romantic aspects of sexual orientations may also be indicated by a variety of romantic identities, including biromantic, heteroromantic, homoromantic, or panromantic, and those who do not experience romantic attraction may identify as aromantic.[14][21] Individuals who are both aromantic and asexual are sometimes known as "aro-ace" or "aroace".[27] The term "gray asexuality" refers to the spectrum between asexuality and non-asexuality (also referred to as allosexuality).[28] Individuals who identify as gray asexual may occasionally experience sexual attraction, or only experience sexual attraction as a secondary component once a reasonably stable or large emotional connection has been formed with the target, known as demisexuality.[14][29]

with that spoiler jotted, i'm a boring cishet mf if you wanna slice it that way, how bout you?

and @cruising for burgers yeah its quantum, i'll do ya in packets

Edited by luke viia
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Btw I wasn't trying to do an "acktchyuyually" there, it was an honest question, because as far as I know the idea of "gender" has ballooned into a huge field of theory that I personally haven't delved into all that much, so I figured there was something here for me to learn. I still don't see how asexuality is both an orientation and a gender, as you can be any gender and be asexual; i.e. they are two distinct aspects of an identity. For example, being non-binary and being asexual are two different things (obviously). But I might just not be aware of everything that the term "gender" covers now.

Edited by toaoaoad
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trust me, i'm just as confused as you are. thus: this thread

edit: also i didn't at all mean for this to be a thread about aces lol, people of all types please feel welcome, i was just introducing myself :cat:

Edited by luke viia
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14 minutes ago, luke viia said:

trust me, i'm just as confused as you are. thus: this thread

Generally I wouldn't expect watmm to be the place to seek enlightenment about modern gender theory but hey prove me wrong guys :dadjoke:

Edited by toaoaoad
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if your sex drive is dying because of physical exhaustion, emotional numbing, alienation, weltschmerz, ennui, etc, does that come under the umbrella of asexuality?

or is that just male menopause lol

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Most boring male. I wish everyone a happy whatever they identify as.

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1 hour ago, usagi said:

if your sex drive is dying because of physical exhaustion, emotional numbing, alienation, weltschmerz, ennui, etc, does that come under the umbrella of asexuality?

or is that just male menopause lol

Sounds like beta male




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13 hours ago, luke viia said:

i'm cis ace, not aro,

This is the first time I’ve heard these terms so I had to google. 

According to the OULGBTO+ SOCIETY… 




Abroromantic / aro flux: someone who fluctuates between experiencing romantic attraction and not experiencing it, and/or experiencing romantic attraction to different strengths.
Abrosexual / ace flux: someone who’s experiences of sexual attraction fluctuate; they may go through periods of asexuality and periods of experiencing sexual attraction. The strength of their attraction could also fluctuate, going through phases of weakness and intensity.
Ace: an abbreviated term for ‘asexual’.
Akoiromantic/lithromantic: a person who experiences romantic attraction but has no desire or need to have their feelings reciprocated. Sometimes an akoiromantic person’s attraction may fade if a romantic relationship is established.
Akoisexual/lith(o)sexual: someone who experiences sexual attraction to people but has no desire to have those feelings reciprocated. For some, if the attraction is reciprocated, their feelings may fade and they will no longer be attracted to that person. ‘Lithsexual’ is also sometimes used to describe someone who does not like to receive sexual contact but may be happy to give it.  
Alloromantic/zedromantic: someone who does experience romantic attraction. An alloromantic person may be allosexual as well, but not necessarily.
Allosexual/zedsexual: someone who does experience sexual attraction, and therefore not on the ace spectrum.
Apothisexual: someone who is asexual and sex-repulsed.
Aro: an abbreviated term for ‘aromantic’.
Aromantic: someone who does not experience romantic attraction.
Asexual: someone who does not experience sexual attraction.
Autochorissexual/aegosexual: someone who is aroused by sex that does not involve themself; it is a disconnection between oneself and the sexual object/activity. Someone who is autochorissexal might have sexual fantasies, or enjoy reading erotica or watching porn, but will have no desire to be involved in the activities themselves. This identity did not arise within the ace community and isn’t necessarily an ‘ace’ identity.
Cupioromantic: someone who does not experience romantic attraction but has a desire to be in a romantic relationship.
Cupiosexual: someone who desires a sexual relationship, but does not experience sexual attraction.
Demi: an abbreviation for demisexuality and demiromanticism.
Demi(a)romantic: someone who only experiences romantic attraction after establishing a strong emotional connection to someone.
Demi-(a)sexual: someone who only experiences sexual attraction after establishing a close emotional and/or romantic connection with another person/persons.
Frayromantic: someone who experiences romantic attraction, but this attraction fades after getting to know the object of attraction.
Fraysexual: someone who initially experiences sexual attraction upon meeting someone, but this attraction fades after getting to know them.
Grey-(a)romantic: someone who sometimes, occasionally, or rarely experiences romantic attraction. The attraction they experience may be weak, or it might be infrequent. Also used as an umbrella term for all romantic orientations that fall between alloromantic and aromantic.
Grey-(a)sexual: someone who sometimes, occasionally, or rarely experiences sexual attraction. The attraction they experience may be weak, or it might be infrequent. Greysexuality describes any sexual orientation that falls somewhere between asexual and allosexual. It is often used as an umbrella term to encompass other identities on the grey area of the spectrum, including demisexuals, lithsexuals, ace flux, etc.
Perioriented: describes a person whose romantic and sexual orientations align, for example, a homoromantic homosexual person, or an asexual aromantic person.
Varioriented: describes a person whose romantic and sexual orientations don't align, for example, a homoromantic pansexual person, or a homosexual demiromantic person.
Quoiromantic/WTF-romantic: someone who finds romantic attraction confusing, or cannot differentiate between platonic and romantic attraction, or is unsure of whether they experience romantic attraction.
Quoisexual: someone who is unsure whether they experience sexual attraction, or is unsure about what sexual attraction is.


Aesthetic attraction: an appreciation for or attraction to someone’s looks, but which does not necessarily accompany a desire for any kind of reciprocation; experiencing aesthetic attraction towards someone does not automatically lead to a desire for a romantic or sexual relationship with that person.
Alterous attraction: a type of attraction that is neither entirely platonic nor entirely romantic, best described as desiring an emotional closeness with somebody.
Aromate: a term to refer to a partner in an aromantic relationship.
Asexy: a term used playfully by some members of the ace community as a positive describing word, often in relation to things or people they are attracted to, but not sexually.
Hypoactive Sexual Desire Disorder (HSDD): A disorder characterised by lack of sexual fantasies and desire for sexual activity which causes a person significant distress. Sometimes used to attempt to pathologise asexuality, though an asexual person who experiences no distress because of their identity is excluded from this diagnosis. Asexuality itself is not a disorder - it’s a legitimate orientation, and there’s nothing wrong with being ace!
Libido: a person’s sex drive, or the frequency with which they desire sexual contact, regardless of their experiences (or lack thereof) of attraction. Someone’s libido or sex-drive is not the same as their attraction; someone might be asexual and have a high sex-drive, or they could have none at all.
Limerence: any strong feelings of attraction, such as ‘butterflies’, nervousness, obsessive thoughts, or desire for approval.
Nonlibidoist: someone who does not have a libido, or has a very low libido.
Primary attraction: any attraction experienced upon first meeting someone.
Platonic attraction: a type of attraction that is not romantic, but more of an intense desire to be close to somebody emotionally, possibly more intense than a typical desire for friendship.
Platonic partner/qp: a term to refer to someone’s partner in a non-romantic relationship.
Queer-Platonic Relationship/Quasi-Platonic Relationship (QPR): a platonic relationship that transcends a person’s usual boundaries for friendships, or an incredibly strong non-romantic partnership. ‘Quasi-platonic’ came about as an alternative to ‘queer-platonic’ for people who do not feel comfortable using a reclaimed slur.
Romantic attraction: a romantic pull towards someone, which usually results in a desire for a romantic relationship with that person.
Secondary attraction: any attraction that develops over time. Within the ace community, most often experienced by demi individuals.
Sensual attraction: a type of attraction based on the senses, especially touch, which typically results in a desire for some physical contact with another person, such as holding hands, hugging, or kissing. Sensual attraction does not have to be accompanied by romantic or sexual feelings.
Sexual attraction: a sexual draw towards someone, typically resulting in a desire for a sexual partnership with that person.
Squish: a term used by some ace/aro people to describe a platonic crush. Some criticise the term as being infantilising.
Zucchini: a term of endearment used by some aro/ace people to describe their queer-platonic or quasi-platonic partner. Usage is much more prevalent in the USA, and there are a number of criticisms.


Celibacy: the choice to abstain from all sexual activity, regardless of attraction. Celibacy is not the same as asexuality. Celibacy is a behaviour and a choice, not an orientation.
Sex favourability: someone who may engage in sexual activity even if they do not have any desire for sexual activity, for example to please a partner.
Sex indifference: someone who is neutral towards engaging in sexual activity.
Sex repulsion: a personal aversion towards engaging in sexual activity. Someone who is sex repulsed is not necessarily sex negative.
Sex negativity: a moral aversion towards sexual activity as a whole, regardless of one’s own participation or abstinence from sexual activity.
Sex positivity: harbouring positive attitudes towards sex, regardless of one’s own desire or lack of desire for sexual activity.
Touch aversion: a desire not to be touched by people, or to touch others, and/or a repulsion to touch. This is often relating to sexual touch, but can be any kind of touch.


Ace/aro erasure: the denial that asexuality and/or aromanticism is real, and the invisibility and lack of representation of asexuality and aromanticism. Examples include dismissing, ignoring, or trying to explain away asexuality/aromanticism.
Acephobia/arophobia/Aphobia: any negative attitude towards asexuality, aromanticism, and asexual or aromantic people, including prejudice, hate, bullying, and erasure.
Amatonormativity: the assumption or insistence that romantic relationships are the norm and should be the ultimate goal in life for everyone, and that these relationships are more intrinsically valuable than other relationships.
AVEN: the Asexuality Visibility and Education Network, the largest online ace community with lots of forums and information.
Compulsory sexuality: the assumption that everyone experiences sexual attraction, and that everyone should desire sex and partake in it. Compulsory sexuality puts (usually heterosexual) relationships at the centre of the ideal human experience. It also includes the idea that romantic relationships must include sexual activity. Closely related to amatonormativity.
Heteronormativity: the assumption that heterosexuality and heteroromanticism are the norm.
Playing cards: some asexual people have taken up the abbreviation ‘ace’ and matched different playing cards to various ace identities, and use these playing cards to describe themselves in a kind of slang. The ace of hearts represents romantic asexuals, the ace of spades represents aromantic asexuals, the ace of diamonds represents demi and grey asexuals, and the ace of clubs represents questioning people on the ace/aro spectrum. This has been criticised by some as not inclusive of people whose identities do not fit into these four categories.

I really try my best to be sensitive to all of these issues but man. This is a lot. 
I think my gender is Danny Glover. 

Edited by J3FF3R00
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Gay cis dude.  Got some feminine and masculine traits but I never felt any kind of dysmorphia.  The only discomfort I have with my own body is me being a doughy piece of shit.  Thought for a short while I might've been ace but I think I'm just exhausted all the time lol.

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16 minutes ago, chronical said:

wtf is a deep warrior friendship?

a close bond between two dudes in which you'd fight for their life but not fuck them

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6 hours ago, usagi said:

if your sex drive is dying because of physical exhaustion, emotional numbing, alienation, weltschmerz, ennui, etc, does that come under the umbrella of asexuality?

or is that just male menopause lol

tbh this kind of question is why I didn't bring it up for years. I struggled with it for a long time. idk. 

plenty of people of all genders are ace btw, not just guys. it's just harder for us to talk about. :shrug:

again, didn't mean to make this about my own identity, esp sexual instead of gender. pls share yr own experiences!

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12 hours ago, toaoaoad said:

Generally I wouldn't expect watmm to be the place to seek enlightenment about modern gender theory but hey prove me wrong guys :dadjoke:

I dunno, we can do serious stuff. A lot of us are middle aged thoughtful people.

e.g. On the internet, if you want to talk about philosophy, sometimes one of the worst places to go is a philosophy forum, sometimes you're better off going somewhere where there's a cross section of people with interests orthogonal to philosophy. You get more genuine dialogue and less axe-grinding.

I always imagined watmm skewing mostly male but maybe a bit less nowadays.

me: cis male vanilla
middle aged

Thanks luke for introducing me to a load of new words.

Edited by zazen
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