Maths & algorithums

[Guest joshier]

Are you able to express 9 digits (e.g. 392582967) with an easy to use format such as DK AK CK RJ?

 

Thanks.

[kaini]

i'm not sure i understand you, but 392582967 is 17665737 in hexadecimal, which has 8 characters the same as the example you specified.

[Guest joshier]

Algorithm:

192134143183 (takes a bit of time to tell)

 

192134143183 through algorithm - - WID KSW

WID KSW easier to say.

 

Possible?

[kaini]

yes, it's called a hash function

[Guest Super lurker ultra V12]

not enough letters

[kaini]

when i think about it, the algorithm for converting decimal to hex is a hash function of sorts

 

but when i think about it, on a deeper level, this has to do with preservation of information - each digit in your example conveys one piece of information, each of which has one of ten possible states.

 

in order to preserve the information losslessly, you could use less pieces each which would have more states (e.g. hex - one less digit with 17665737, but each digit has one of sixteen possible states, 0-F).

 

at the other end of the scale, you could use more pieces each which would have less states (e.g. binary with only two is 10111011001100101011100110111)

 

in the decimal number system, there is no definable upper bound for your algorithm (e.g. you can keep counting forever)

 

so actually, no. in order for an algorithm to do this, at the very least you would have to provide it with upper and lower bounds for the entered number. it's information theory 101

Edited September 20, 2009 by kaini

[Guest joshier]

What about 3842856295836 into > F7K C38

 

?

[kaini]

by the K you imply that you are working with a system in which each digit has one of 20 possible states (called base 20)

 

here's a converter for you, but that number is too big for it:

http://www.cleavebooks.co.uk/scol/calnumba.htm

 

now fuck off and do your own homework

[Guest Super lurker ultra V12]

this thread is good

[Guest joshier]

by the K you imply that you are working with a system in which each digit has one of 20 possible states (called base 20)

 

here's a converter for you, but that number is too big for it:

http://www.cleavebooks.co.uk/scol/calnumba.htm

 

now fuck off and do your own homework

It's easier asking the maths genius Kaini. Anyway, its work I set myself.

 

oh and I meant to put:

3842856295836 into > F7k C38

 

(lower case included)

[kaini]

that would be a shit number system unless you were an alien, it would have thirty-two possible states for each digit (0-9,A-K,a-k)

 

read this

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Numeral_system

and this

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lossless_data_compression

and stop annoying me when you are sitting in front of a computer connected to the internet

[Guest joshier]

Oh well, worth a try, thanks for your help.

[Guest Rabid]

Kaini pretty much summed it up. More states = less characters needed.

 

By the way, there was an FPS game that was super small (less than 1 MB I think) but it procedurally generated itself during gameplay. It had as much content as a much larger game. I'm trying to find it but I don't remember what it was called, it was very interesting though.

 

Found it.

 

http://catalyticat.com/a-whole-fps-game-in-less-than-100kb

[Guest joshier]

wow that games pretty awesome for that size.

[kaini]

Kaini pretty much summed it up. More states = less characters needed.

 

By the way, there was an FPS game that was super small (less than 1 MB I think) but it procedurally generated itself during gameplay. It had as much content as a much larger game. I'm trying to find it but I don't remember what it was called, it was very interesting though.

 

Found it.

 

http://catalyticat.com/a-whole-fps-game-in-less-than-100kb

 

*doesn't look at link...* .kkreiger?

 

impressive at the time it was released, not so much now.

spore uses procedural shit i think. also darwinia.

like most things, it's better incorporated as a technique rather than basing a whole game on it.

 

if you want to see procedural generation used REALLY well, look at the current demoscene. people are packing amazing amounts of stuff in 4kb

 

http://www.buenz.li/pages/competitions/4kgfx.html0

[Guest hahathhat]

Kaini pretty much summed it up. More states = less characters needed.

 

By the way, there was an FPS game that was super small (less than 1 MB I think) but it procedurally generated itself during gameplay. It had as much content as a much larger game. I'm trying to find it but I don't remember what it was called, it was very interesting though.

 

Found it.

 

http://catalyticat.com/a-whole-fps-game-in-less-than-100kb

 

"Assembly language programming is an extravagant waste of human talent and should be avoided whenever possible"

-- Peter Norton

[kaini]

i would agree with that with one important exception, and that's game programming

 

when all you had to work with was 48K RAM, programmers would squeeze every last cycle out of their <1Mhz chips. now everything's all 5GB of textures this and 500 meg patches that.

 

game programmers would do well to remember when all they had to work with was 48K RAM and a Z80 or a 6510 processor, and had to squeeze every last cycle out of their <1Mhz chips.

 

but now most of them weren't actually born then

 

... and actually the best, least intrusive, lowest system load antivir i know is NOD32 and that's almost entirely assembly.

Edited September 20, 2009 by kaini

[ericsosh]

Kaini pretty much summed it up. More states = less characters needed.

 

By the way, there was an FPS game that was super small (less than 1 MB I think) but it procedurally generated itself during gameplay. It had as much content as a much larger game. I'm trying to find it but I don't remember what it was called, it was very interesting though.

 

Found it.

 

http://catalyticat.com/a-whole-fps-game-in-less-than-100kb

 

"Assembly language programming is an extravagant waste of human talent and should be avoided whenever possible"

-- Peter Norton

 

Writing your programs directly in assembly doesn't magically make your executable smaller. Those Farbrausch guys surely didn't write .kkrieger exclusively in assembly.

[Guest Rabid]

*doesn't look at link...* .kkreiger?

 

impressive at the time it was released, not so much now.

spore uses procedural shit i think. also darwinia.

like most things, it's better incorporated as a technique rather than basing a whole game on it.

 

if you want to see procedural generation used REALLY well, look at the current demoscene. people are packing amazing amounts of stuff in 4kb

 

http://www.buenz.li/pages/competitions/4kgfx.html0

Wow, that is really amazing. 4kb? Holy shit...

[Bubba69]

Yes joshier, you could do that if you wanted to. The real question is why would you want to do that, what are you trying to do? I'm sure you could invent your own system to do what you are describing if you have any creativity whatsoever.

[kaini]

just convert from decimal to base 26, but do away with numbers in your answer and use A-Z as your base 26 digits.

that would accomplish exactly what joshier wants to do. but it's retarded.

Edited September 20, 2009 by kaini

[Guest abusivegeorge]

Hey Josh

[kaini]

i would agree with that with one important exception, and that's game programming

 

when all you had to work with was 48K RAM, programmers would squeeze every last cycle out of their <1Mhz chips. now everything's all 5GB of textures this and 500 meg patches that.

 

game programmers would do well to remember when all they had to work with was 48K RAM and a Z80 or a 6510 processor, and had to squeeze every last cycle out of their <1Mhz chips.

 

but now most of them weren't actually born then

 

... and actually the best, least intrusive, lowest system load antivir i know is NOD32 and that's almost entirely assembly.

 

and actually when i think about it i would imagine assembly programming is more or less essential in software based virtualization, which is a BIG DEAL right now

i'm imagining using windows, written in C, through an abstraction/virtualization layer, also written in C. or worse, C++

 

i know very little about the specifics of virtualization so correct me if i'm wrong.