keltoi Posted September 27, 2011 Share Posted September 27, 2011 sugar schmugar. you're all going to die from some horrible disease anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest fiznuthian Posted September 27, 2011 Share Posted September 27, 2011 Yeah, but vegans are "exploiting" plants and grasslands, so that logic can be thrown out the window right now. Life eats life and there's no way of getting around it. I'm not pulling out the bee's wings and putting pins in their faces after I eat their sweet, sweet nectar, and neither are the people raising them. And for the record, I find the idea of keeping pets such as cats and dogs to be a much worse offense of holding dominion over other sentient creatures (for the purpose of entertaining humans, mind you) than raising bees. Bees don't end up in the pound, nor are they trained to fight or attack each other (to my knowledge). I will post "30 hornets vs 30,000 bees" if we really need to drive home the point of natural violence in the world, but if the [vegan] argument is that humans should be above 'holding dominion' over other animals, there are better places to start remedying the problem than beekeeping. That's why I stopped this conversation when it first approached me. *slowly backs off while wolfing out* While I agree with you about exploiting land and plants, I don't necessarily agree when it comes to dogs (cats don't care much about people). My dog has an extremely strong attachment to me. When i'm sad he usually doesn't leave my side. When he's tired he lays down on my foot and falls asleep. He brings toys to me and asks for me to play with him, wagging his tail and all. I can't see how this would constitute holding dominion over him, I let him do as he pleases yet he spends 99% of his day trying to be involved in what i'm doing. He's like velcro. He even brings his own leash to me, begging me to go for a walk or run with him. A dog is a true companion, co-evolved with humans and they seem to enjoy our presence even from birth. What's unfortunate though is most people are not like this at all. Probably some 90% of dog owners buy a dog just to have around and do nothing else with them besides give some food and water, maybe a little attention sporadically. Even worse is dogs that are tied to a pole outside all day. Makes me absolutely fucking FURIOUS! A dog needs to walk and get LOTS of exercise every single day. People think their cute little toy dog will take care of themselves, but on the inside that toy dog still has most of a wild dog's genes. It requires activities that dogs do, not hanging out inside of a house all day getting touched occasionally. They need to feel part of a group, they're social animals just like we are. It's like having a kid then doing nothing with them their entire life besides the occasional pat on the back, "Good boy, you're such a good boy" , "Now back to your room for the next 23 1/2 hours!" And then I take my dog for a walk every single day, only to hear the cries of dogs inside their houses suffering from anxiety issues. They sound like they're about to have a panic attack, jumping at the door, screaming and yelping for no apparent reason. My dog does not do this, he does not bark at people, he doesn't chase people, nothing. He's well mannered, well exercised, receives LOTS of love and attention, and some damn good food to boot. Anyway, sorry to totally derail this its just your comment reminded me of the assholes all over our planet who should not have a pet whatsoever. Regarding sugar, Lustig's video is the 100% truth. Might as well drink yourself into oblivion, because all of the sugar in our food supply does the same damn thing. It's a chronic disease, and we're helplessly addicted to the blood sugar highs and lows produced by such diets. Essines, you say its easy to stop eating sugar, and it is I do agree. It's entirely possible to make the choice that you're done with it. Unfortunately people aren't well informed about why they feel the way they do, such as drinking some soda and eating a bunch of chips then feeling like shit an hour later, crashing on the sofa because you "just dont feel like doing anything". Then 2 hours later, eating some more. It's a vicious cycle man Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
essines Posted September 27, 2011 Share Posted September 27, 2011 (cats don't care much about people). that is a stupid thing to assume. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sup Posted September 27, 2011 Share Posted September 27, 2011 candy is good Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Braintree Posted September 27, 2011 Share Posted September 27, 2011 Taking the honey from the bees stresses them out. I mean, they work their entire lives to make the honey and then some asshole comes along and takes it. I prefer to use agave nectar. Anyway, I don't eat that much sugar. I'm not fond of super sweet stuff, but when I do get stuff that's processed, it turns out to have high fructose corn syrup a lot of the time. So that's really hard to avoid. It's in tons of stuff. Stuff that's not even sweet... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redruth Posted September 27, 2011 Share Posted September 27, 2011 the fact that doing good seems impossible or that bad seems relative should not stand in the way of our ability and our wanting to do something 'better' and search for what that is. when someone strives to express more advanced forms of good (love) and to know what that is, it seems it is some folks tendency to shoot them down instead of trying to aid in their search. attempting to hold to a more and more perfected ideal in goodness and kindness should be celebrated, supported and revered even if it's parts do not make perfect sense or it is not supported by peer review. we have goodness innately inside us and we look to express that, it being so difficult to define with certainty how to do this act should be proof itself of how flawed this whole experience is to begin with Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zazen Posted September 28, 2011 Share Posted September 28, 2011 high fructose corn syrup is a lot rarer in the UK. Unless you go to Wholefoods Market and then it seems to be in all their own brand stuff, the cheeky septics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr lopez Posted September 28, 2011 Share Posted September 28, 2011 i just ate some poptarts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delet... Posted September 28, 2011 Share Posted September 28, 2011 Yeah, but vegans are "exploiting" plants and grasslands, so that logic can be thrown out the window right now. Life eats life and there's no way of getting around it. I'm not pulling out the bee's wings and putting pins in their faces after I eat their sweet, sweet nectar, and neither are the people raising them. And for the record, I find the idea of keeping pets such as cats and dogs to be a much worse offense of holding dominion over other sentient creatures (for the purpose of entertaining humans, mind you) than raising bees. Bees don't end up in the pound, nor are they trained to fight or attack each other (to my knowledge). I will post "30 hornets vs 30,000 bees" if we really need to drive home the point of natural violence in the world, but if the [vegan] argument is that humans should be above 'holding dominion' over other animals, there are better places to start remedying the problem than beekeeping. That's why I stopped this conversation when it first approached me. *slowly backs off while wolfing out* Yeah, vegans should not own pets. And on top of that yes, they should live a wilderness existance cause their city dwelling and modern farming is paving over and ploughing nature. Also they shouldn't breed, cause there's already too many of the fuckers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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