Scotland

[Redruth]

troon

[pcock]

lol, i dont even actually agree with this as being a good way to make your case, but its pretty fuckin funny, my pal matt on the net for this.

 

 

www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2014/09/11/scottish-independence-darth-vader-music_n_5804224.html

[poblequadrat]

 

1800000 people

scotland please don't fail us

[doublename]

Jesus

[delet...]

 

1800000 people

scotland please don't fail us

 

 

Cool. Probably needs it's own thread too, but nwae.

 

http://youtu.be/Th8_grOkm5Q

[delet...]

/is so moved by this that he moves to mother's homeland of bretagne, joins their independence movement. (we could maybe be in a federation with cornwall).

[pcock]

this is happening. 97.5 of the scottish electorate now registered to vote.

[pcock]

here is some fascinating proof of the bbc bias(they stand to lose millions from the split)

 

 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rHmLb-RIbrM

 

here is what alex salmond said.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=enrdDaf3uss&feature=youtu.be

 

here is what the bbc reported.

[luke viia]

^ wow, to hell with the BBCs coverage of this. hopin the best for you, scotland.

[delet...]

This is the bbc reporting about anything in the world, this is why it cannot be held out as some standard for credible reporting or umpire over truth in this world. It is a propaganda arm of government, no more no less, the same goes for every other major media outlet as evidenced by the increasingly toxic and outlandish claims being made by the spectrum of western media over russia's role (or in reality non-role apart from much maligned peacemaker) over the crisis for the ruso ethnic, non coup government supporting, separatists and their self defence forces in eastern Ukraine. For so many years the bbc has been on the side of the self interested power elite. I well remember the bbc's uncritical reporting in months the leading up to the iraq war of the 2000's, the 'serious' and prevaricating contempt with which it dismissed anyone that countered the weapons of mass destruction echo chamber or the hilarious in their ridiculousness claims, that saddam's missiles could reach london (as he'd want to fire them there any way, he just wanted sanctions lifted so that he could get incubators and sterilizers for hospitals and parts for water treatment plants, to help combat the terrible infant morality rate of his country (remembering that before the first gulf war iraq had the most modern hospital system in the middle east)). And on and on through the years, the mercenary voices for empire of the bbc have lied and 'missold' massacres, landgrabs and corporate fraud in a way that can only be described as criminal, actions that have directly led to the deaths of now no doubt, millions.

 

As to salmond, man that chap has a character of steel, good for him. I might not agree with everything he thinks politically, but i agree with referendum as a means to self determination for a community set within geographical boundaries, this concept is at the heart of democracy. Any group, large or small should be able to decouple from the larger state that they find themselves in. That state being only a political entity decided and maintained by the will of men anyway. If you choose to withdraw, it is no business of others living elsewhere to deny you that right. And given the unrealised political leanings of the scots people, due to being tethered to their tory cousins south of the border, a yes vote seems to be the only way to true democracy and an unleashing of the will of the scots people. Lets hope that they don't use diebold electronic voting machines.

[eugene]

that doesn't quite work like that ideal in already functioning states, the people of the big state paid their taxes that also went to developing of scotland. on the other hand so did the scots to the benefit of all of uk so maybe it evens out at the end, but it's very plausible to assume that there could be some projects subsidized by the people of all uk that were focused on that region for the potential benefit of all uk, thus it would make it unfair to just let it get out of hands of uk'ers just because of self determination arguments. though i guess uk wouldn't let the vote take place before stuff like this was settled.

[Guest Atom Dowry Firth]

here is some fascinating proof of the bbc bias(they stand to lose millions from the split)

 

I'm not quite sure how taking one video of a debate that was broadcast on the BBC, then uploaded to YouTube with the sensationalist title 'ultimate smackdown' and comparing it to a shorter snippet also broadcast on the BBC is somehow 'proof of the BBC's bias'. I know the BBC is far from the paragon of impartiality it should ideally be, but come on now. They broadcast shorter snippets like the second video all the time during shorter news broadcasts throughout the day between programming and also here and there on News 24 between other news items. There are some other things going on in the world besides Scottish independence after all. Taking those two videos out of context like that and trying to frame them as proof of bias for your own political agenda is just as bad as the point you're trying to prove of the BBC's bias. It's clear that Salmond has a lot of charisma - but to be fair to the reporter there, he kind of didn't actually answer the question.

 

I'm finding it pretty difficult to feel anything other than sadness about this whole thing really. I don't think it's a good prospect for anyone, and it's woeful that the offering of more powers has only really been introduced this late in the game - that should have been on the table from the start. The whole world seems to be taking massive steps backwards at the moment. Depressing.

[chenGOD]

Voting for political independence without achieving monetary independence is fucking idiotic.

 

And whoever wrote that bit about post-colonial civil war - you're talking about nations that were left without functioning institutions, poor infrastructure and a lack of properly trained people to run a country. Comparing Scotland (or Australia) to those nations is like saying North and South Korea are the same things.

 

and delet - your bit about Saddam wanting sanctions lifted so he could get incubators and so on is fucking hilarious, have you considered stand-up?

[Malkmus]

you're talking about nations that were left without functioning institutions, poor infrastructure and a lack of properly trained people to run a country.

 

That, i'm afraid to say sums up Scotland perfectly !! we're doooOOOOOMMMMMEEEeeeddd

[chenGOD]

 

you're talking about nations that were left without functioning institutions, poor infrastructure and a lack of properly trained people to run a country.

 

That, i'm afraid to say sums up Scotland perfectly !! we're doooOOOOOMMMMMEEEeeeddd

 

 

[Soloman Tump]

 

 

Voting for political independence without achieving monetary independence is fucking idiotic

Exactly this.

 

Not just shooting themselves in the foot, but taking the other barrel in the jugular too

[delet...]

and delet - your bit about Saddam wanting sanctions lifted so he could get incubators and so on is fucking hilarious, have you considered stand-up?

 

Do you not recall that some of the sanction implementation led to hospital equipment being barred by the US in case it get repurposed by the regime. This is the kind of shit those sanctions achieved, saddam still had his palaces. Sanctions of the sort the US favours are well known to mostly cruelly impact the population not the leadership. Do you recall the famous quote from madeliene albright, dismissing the deaths up to the point under clinton due to the sanctions

 

http://youtu.be/x4PgpbQfxgo

 

These people were and continue to be scum subcontracted to do the work of demons, whom history will catch up with quicker than they'd like.

Voting for political independence without achieving monetary independence is fucking idiotic.

 

 

 

 

I agree that a country needs to control it's currency. Sadly not many places in the world do anymore do they, not with central bankers and bond speculators in charge.

[chenGOD]

A) Blanket sanctions are fucking immoral and heinous, and yes they punish only the poor in countries where they are implemented, generally failing to achieve any of their stated goals.

B) If you think the hospital thing was anything but a ruse by Saddam, you are blinded by your hatred to US imperialism.

[Zorro]

Scotland

Catalunya

Kurdistan?

Kernow? or Kernow/Brittany?

 

(as an observer I'd be fine with any of those, and might suggest to Languedoc and Valencia that they might what to hitch up with the middle lot)

 

But then there's ISIS.

 

I believe a secret cabal of cartographers and geography teachers are behind all this.

[pcock]

actually fuck it, i cant even be arsed debating any more. Its looking extremely likely we are going to succeed anyway, and im excited as fuck.

[pcock]

 

tens of thousands of supporters turned up in town on the same day that the orange march asked its bigoted, idiot supporters to march en masse. the atmosphere was awesome, like a huge festival.

[Guest Al Hounos]

Good luck Scotland!

 

I wish the US could split up into a few individual nations as well.

[Zorro]

Good luck, Scotland!

[MadameChaos]

I don't see what all the fuss is about to be honest. If you look at Jersey for example, they were "allowed" to be independent and still keep the pound.

 

The reason all the politicians are freaking out and using this to try and put off Scotland is due to the North Sea oil, which will of course be out of the control of the English parliment. http://www.energyvoice.com/2014/09/expert-alex-kemp-predicts-north-sea-oil-bonanza/ I see little other reason for their interest.

 

However in the case of not allowing Scotland to keep the pound they will be losing out still as more likely than not it will weaken the currency (especially if you consider the North Sea oil reserves which will then I assume be sold in whichever currency Scotland adopts). http://www.iea.org.uk/blog/should-an-independent-scotland-keep-the-pound

 

In terms of the ordinary man in the street there are probably a few advantages as well.

 

1. You can pop up to Scotland for your duty free

2. You can go on holiday "abroad" without crossing a sea

3. You get to piss of JK Rowling and David Cameron (yay!)

4. If you get too annoyed with the British government you can just move to Scotland.

 

This is all just off the top of my head guys, feel free to correct me on and of the points raised. Personally I think there are more positives than negatives.

[MadameChaos]

to summarise