How does the World view America these days?

[LimpyLoo]

Man who shot at George Zimmerman using stand your ground defense

 

http://gawker.com/man-who-shot-at-george-zimmerman-will-use-stand-your-gr-1708627510

 

holy shit that's a lol

[delet...]

i wonder at the conniptions going through the minds of the many that wanted the law repealed but hate zimmerman and want to see him punished.

[LimpyLoo]

i wonder at the conniptions going through the minds of the many that wanted the law repealed but hate zimmerman and want to see him punished.

stand your ground should be repealed.......immediately after this trial

[delet...]

they should buy handguns themselves, then when someone calls them babe or bossy or sits on the train with their legs spread apart, they can wack 'em and claim self defence.

[cwmbrancity]

come to Butthead

 

 

Edited June 3, 2015 by cwmbrancity

[pattern recognition]

[autopilot]

All of those people would be stable, non-violent individuals if all guns were banned.

[awepittance]

 

Seems like little more than extreme paranoia to me. I guess if nothing else it provides entertainment value.

 

It's more than just paranoia, though

 

Many of them seem to think that climate changers, immigrants, Muslims, environmentalists and liberals in general are all sub-human and should be treated as such. Like, I get a real "let's just bomb the middle east and let God sort 'em out" kinda vibe from those types of conservatives.

 

just out of curiosity, (and correct me if im mistaken) but didn't Sam Harris effectively use his neuroscience background to show that brain scans of muslims show a greater propensity towards violence (aka they are more animalistic and subhuman than the rest of us folks)? For me its much easier to write off and minimize someone like a conservative who literally thinks a muslim is subhuman, much harder and more destructive for someone who calls themselves liberal atheist and is as respectable as Sam Harris to make basically the same claims couched in intellectual language. Unfortunately even if this wasn't Sam Harris' intentions (to make educated parts of the populations broadly judge entire populations of people as being less civilized) he has convinced a lot of liberals that islam poses the greatest threat in the world and thats a lot scarier to me than a bunch of fucktard american flag waving conservatives screaming about sharia law

Edited June 3, 2015 by John Ehrlichman

[delet...]

All of those people would be stable, non-violent individuals if all guns were banned.

 

stable non-violent individuals living in a tyrannical police state.

[chenGOD]

 

All of those people would be stable, non-violent individuals if all guns were banned.

stable non-violent individuals living in a tyrannical police state.

Just like you guys have in Australia amirite? Yeeehaw Tex!

[delet...]

 

 

Seems like little more than extreme paranoia to me. I guess if nothing else it provides entertainment value.

 

It's more than just paranoia, though

 

Many of them seem to think that climate changers, immigrants, Muslims, environmentalists and liberals in general are all sub-human and should be treated as such. Like, I get a real "let's just bomb the middle east and let God sort 'em out" kinda vibe from those types of conservatives.

 

 

The way some of these mindless 'liberals' behave you have to wonder at their 'humanity'. They'll agree with the state terror as long as obama's in power. They'll agree with any psycho religious custom that they wouldn't accept from those of their own race in the name of 'tolerance'. It's all a big hypocritical what the fuck subhuman brain state from many of everyone everywhere, liberals, redneckals, immigrantals.

[delet...]

 

 

All of those people would be stable, non-violent individuals if all guns were banned.

stable non-violent individuals living in a tyrannical police state.

Just like you guys have in Australia amirite? Yeeehaw Tex!

 

 

they're working on taking away our rights chen, don't you worry about that, we're just calmly letting it all happen. We already have some terrible anti-terror legislation, indefinite detention, not allowed to tell anyone that you were even imprisoned and the media and your lawyer aren't either. We've just started data retention, on board with the TPP and so on and so forth.

 

What's happening chen is that they are whilst we are calm, laying the foundations and building the walls of our prison, so that when we realise 'wtf', it'll be too late, no guns to rebel, no ability to say no when someone wants to force medication in to you, no legal recourse if you're being targeted as a dissenter, no cash to stop our bank accounts from getting plundered when a phoney crisis hits. We'll be fucked.

[LimpyLoo]

 

 

Seems like little more than extreme paranoia to me. I guess if nothing else it provides entertainment value.

 

It's more than just paranoia, though

 

Many of them seem to think that climate changers, immigrants, Muslims, environmentalists and liberals in general are all sub-human and should be treated as such. Like, I get a real "let's just bomb the middle east and let God sort 'em out" kinda vibe from those types of conservatives.

 

just out of curiosity, (and correct me if im mistaken) but didn't Sam Harris effectively use his neuroscience background to show that brain scans of muslims show a greater propensity towards violence (aka they are more animalistic and subhuman than the rest of us folks)? For me its much easier to write off and minimize someone like a conservative who literally thinks a muslim is subhuman, much harder and more destructive for someone who calls themselves liberal atheist and is as respectable as Sam Harris to make basically the same claims couched in intellectual language. Unfortunately even if this wasn't Sam Harris' intentions (to make educated parts of the populations broadly judge entire populations of people as being less civilized) he has convinced a lot of liberals that islam poses the greatest threat in the world and thats a lot scarier to me than a bunch of fucktard american flag waving conservatives screaming about sharia law

 

 

Where on earth did you hear that? lol

 

yeah so, once again: Sam Harris doesn't think muslims are subhuman

 

it's really frustrating how one can't talk about supersticious or supernatural beliefs without essentially being called racist or xenophobic or whatever

[LimpyLoo]

 

 

 

Seems like little more than extreme paranoia to me. I guess if nothing else it provides entertainment value.

 

It's more than just paranoia, though

 

Many of them seem to think that climate changers, immigrants, Muslims, environmentalists and liberals in general are all sub-human and should be treated as such. Like, I get a real "let's just bomb the middle east and let God sort 'em out" kinda vibe from those types of conservatives.

 

 

The way some of these mindless 'liberals' behave you have to wonder at their 'humanity'. They'll agree with the state terror as long as obama's in power. They'll agree with any psycho religious custom that they wouldn't accept from those of their own race in the name of 'tolerance'. It's all a big hypocritical what the fuck subhuman brain state from many of everyone everywhere, liberals, redneckals, immigrantals.

 

 

where do you guys get these ideas? for instance: who supports state terror?

[delet...]

 

 

 

 

Seems like little more than extreme paranoia to me. I guess if nothing else it provides entertainment value.

 

It's more than just paranoia, though

 

Many of them seem to think that climate changers, immigrants, Muslims, environmentalists and liberals in general are all sub-human and should be treated as such. Like, I get a real "let's just bomb the middle east and let God sort 'em out" kinda vibe from those types of conservatives.

 

 

The way some of these mindless 'liberals' behave you have to wonder at their 'humanity'. They'll agree with the state terror as long as obama's in power. They'll agree with any psycho religious custom that they wouldn't accept from those of their own race in the name of 'tolerance'. It's all a big hypocritical what the fuck subhuman brain state from many of everyone everywhere, liberals, redneckals, immigrantals.

 

 

where do you guys get these ideas? for instance: who supports state terror?

 

 

people who support obama support the US state manifesting state power to create state terror. Drone programs in several countries performing extra judicial executions from above with huge collateral losses, funding giant proxy armies to roam about the middle east and africa raping, pillaging, mudering and genociding, masterminding and funding the coup in ukraine and almost coup in macedonia, looking the other way whilst their allies blow up yemen. yup, so what were you trynah say ?

[LimpyLoo]

 

 

 

 

 

Seems like little more than extreme paranoia to me. I guess if nothing else it provides entertainment value.

 

It's more than just paranoia, though

 

Many of them seem to think that climate changers, immigrants, Muslims, environmentalists and liberals in general are all sub-human and should be treated as such. Like, I get a real "let's just bomb the middle east and let God sort 'em out" kinda vibe from those types of conservatives.

 

 

The way some of these mindless 'liberals' behave you have to wonder at their 'humanity'. They'll agree with the state terror as long as obama's in power. They'll agree with any psycho religious custom that they wouldn't accept from those of their own race in the name of 'tolerance'. It's all a big hypocritical what the fuck subhuman brain state from many of everyone everywhere, liberals, redneckals, immigrantals.

 

 

where do you guys get these ideas? for instance: who supports state terror?

 

 

people who support obama support the US state manifesting state power to create state terror. Drone programs in several countries performing extra judicial executions from above with huge collateral losses, funding giant proxy armies to roam about the middle east and africa raping, pillaging, mudering and genociding, masterminding and funding coups like in ukraine and almost in macedonia. yup, so what were you trynah say ?

 

 

so you were talking about mindless 'liberals' and their 'humanity' supporting state terror?

 

who were you referring to?

[delet...]

 

 

 

 

 

 

Seems like little more than extreme paranoia to me. I guess if nothing else it provides entertainment value.

 

It's more than just paranoia, though

 

Many of them seem to think that climate changers, immigrants, Muslims, environmentalists and liberals in general are all sub-human and should be treated as such. Like, I get a real "let's just bomb the middle east and let God sort 'em out" kinda vibe from those types of conservatives.

 

 

The way some of these mindless 'liberals' behave you have to wonder at their 'humanity'. They'll agree with the state terror as long as obama's in power. They'll agree with any psycho religious custom that they wouldn't accept from those of their own race in the name of 'tolerance'. It's all a big hypocritical what the fuck subhuman brain state from many of everyone everywhere, liberals, redneckals, immigrantals.

 

 

where do you guys get these ideas? for instance: who supports state terror?

 

 

people who support obama support the US state manifesting state power to create state terror. Drone programs in several countries performing extra judicial executions from above with huge collateral losses, funding giant proxy armies to roam about the middle east and africa raping, pillaging, mudering and genociding, masterminding and funding the coup in ukraine and almost coup in macedonia, looking the other way whilst their allies blow up yemen. yup, so what were you trynah say ?

 

so you were talking about mindless 'liberals' and their 'humanity' supporting state terror?

 

who were you referring to?

 

 

i wasn't dissing anyone here dude, it's ok.

[chenGOD]

 

 

 

All of those people would be stable, non-violent individuals if all guns were banned.

stable non-violent individuals living in a tyrannical police state.

Just like you guys have in Australia amirite? Yeeehaw Tex!

they're working on taking away our rights chen, don't you worry about that, we're just calmly letting it all happen. We already have some terrible anti-terror legislation, indefinite detention, not allowed to tell anyone that you were even imprisoned and the media and your lawyer aren't either. We've just started data retention, on board with the TPP and so on and so forth.

 

What's happening chen is that they are whilst we are calm, laying the foundations and building the walls of our prison, so that when we realise 'wtf', it'll be too late, no guns to rebel, no ability to say no when someone wants to force medication in to you, no legal recourse if you're being targeted as a dissenter, no cash to stop our bank accounts from getting plundered when a phoney crisis hits. We'll be fucked.

I've been hearing this for a long time, and yet here you are, still free to dissent away.

[LimpyLoo]

Alright, so to give you guys a sense of my frustration...this is why i'll never again talk politics on WATMM

 

if you say something, people will just hear what they wanna hear

and then lump you in with any and everyone else who disagrees with them

and they will think that you hold the same opinions as those people

 

 

 

 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vDvrkJkCdJg

 

Just to follow up on this - it went viral, they got the guys name, Twitter account etc - then increased the brightness/contrast of a pic he posted, exposing his genitals:

 

 

http://www.theransomnote.co.uk/new-world-musings/news/cyclists-take-online-revenge-on-insane-road-rage-driver/

 

 

lol. fucking cunt deserves it, absolutely appalling behaviour he displayed in that video.

 

 

as terrible and idiotic as the leather jacket dude is

 

the cyclist is also dumb for not even trying to de-escalate the situation

 

like, if you want this maniac to get out of your face, stop shouting insults at him

 

i almost find them both equally insufferable

 

 

interesting approach. one could almost expand on it and say that deliberately antagonising people for holding certain religious belief is counterproductive in trying to build cross-cultural relations and world peace.

 

 

right...

 

...which is something i said multiple times but the nuanc seemed to hurt people's brains so they forgot.

 

 

 

sure you did.

 

 

 

sure you did.

 

Would you like me to go find it?

 

It shouldn't be hard since I said it about once per page...

 

 

 

 

 

 

Sure fine, we agree - people are idiots about blasphemy.

 

Do you think this protest is a good idea?

 

i think it should be

but since we live in a world where people get murdered for depicting Muhammad

on a micro scale: no it's not a good idea

 

but on a macro, historic scale: it is a good idea

 

as has been pointed out

part of the reason drawing Muhammad is dangerous

is because so few people do it

for instance after the Charlie Ebdo attack

some publications (e.g. New York Times) wouldn't publish the cartoons

or even the MET taking down all art depicting Mohammad

unfortunately this serves both to legitimize the problem

and localize the risk to those who do decide to depict Muhammad

 

 

I really strongly disagree with you about this. Yes of course freedom of speech is important and people should be allowed to express themselves even if their opinions are extremely unpopular. Guess what though - they *are* allowed. These people drawing pictures of the prophet aren't getting locked up for doing so. The Westboro Baptist Church are allowed to picket soldier's funerals and wave placards about with 'God hates fags' daubed all over them. People are allowed to express racial, homophobic and sexist prejudice without getting locked up for it. Does that make it right for them to do those things though? Should we hold all of these examples up as shining beacons showing the world the values we stand for? I don't think so, do you? The people drawing these pictures aren't doing it because they're professional artists making profound postmodern cultural statements. They're not doing it because they're trying to make the world a better place. They're doing it because they're racist fuckwits. There's no scenario where it should be a good idea to be a racist fuckwit.

 

 

I agree that some of them are indeed racist fuckwits. But that is incidental.

 

And they are allowed to do it....sorta. They either get scorned or murdered. Freedom of speech has to protect the unsavory shit, the shit we don't like. It has to protect the Holocaust deniers and the white supremacists and the Pam Gellers of the world, otherwise it's just "freedom of uncontroversial speech."

 

 

Should the MET have taken down art that depicted Muhammad? Should Wikipedia have?

 

I think there are a few issues here, and we're both talking past each other a bit:

 

1) should people be able to draw Muhammad without fear of death? (I think we all agree that yes, they should)

 

2) is it wise--given the current state of affairs--to draw Muhammad? (Practically speaking, it is dangerous to do)

 

3) might there be some racist people involved in the drawing of Muhammad? (without a doubt)

 

4) do we want to live in a world where drawing Muhammad--for whatever reason--isn't dangerous? (I hope we all do)

 

5) When someone draws Muhammad (or writes a book about Islam, or a film, or whatever) and is murdered, is it their own fault? (I hope we all think that no, no it's not)

 

[delet...]

 

Alright, so to give you guys a sense of my frustration...this is why i'll never again talk politics on WATMM

 

if you say something, people will just hear what they wanna hear

and then lump you in with any and everyone else who disagrees with them

and they will think that you hold the same opinions as those people

 

 

 

 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vDvrkJkCdJg

 

Just to follow up on this - it went viral, they got the guys name, Twitter account etc - then increased the brightness/contrast of a pic he posted, exposing his genitals:

 

 

http://www.theransomnote.co.uk/new-world-musings/news/cyclists-take-online-revenge-on-insane-road-rage-driver/

 

 

lol. fucking cunt deserves it, absolutely appalling behaviour he displayed in that video.

 

 

as terrible and idiotic as the leather jacket dude is

 

the cyclist is also dumb for not even trying to de-escalate the situation

 

like, if you want this maniac to get out of your face, stop shouting insults at him

 

i almost find them both equally insufferable

 

 

interesting approach. one could almost expand on it and say that deliberately antagonising people for holding certain religious belief is counterproductive in trying to build cross-cultural relations and world peace.

 

 

right...

 

...which is something i said multiple times but the nuanc seemed to hurt people's brains so they forgot.

 

 

 

sure you did.

 

 

 

sure you did.

 

Would you like me to go find it?

 

It shouldn't be hard since I said it about once per page...

 

 

 

 

 

 

Sure fine, we agree - people are idiots about blasphemy.

 

Do you think this protest is a good idea?

 

i think it should be

but since we live in a world where people get murdered for depicting Muhammad

on a micro scale: no it's not a good idea

 

but on a macro, historic scale: it is a good idea

 

as has been pointed out

part of the reason drawing Muhammad is dangerous

is because so few people do it

for instance after the Charlie Ebdo attack

some publications (e.g. New York Times) wouldn't publish the cartoons

or even the MET taking down all art depicting Mohammad

unfortunately this serves both to legitimize the problem

and localize the risk to those who do decide to depict Muhammad

 

 

I really strongly disagree with you about this. Yes of course freedom of speech is important and people should be allowed to express themselves even if their opinions are extremely unpopular. Guess what though - they *are* allowed. These people drawing pictures of the prophet aren't getting locked up for doing so. The Westboro Baptist Church are allowed to picket soldier's funerals and wave placards about with 'God hates fags' daubed all over them. People are allowed to express racial, homophobic and sexist prejudice without getting locked up for it. Does that make it right for them to do those things though? Should we hold all of these examples up as shining beacons showing the world the values we stand for? I don't think so, do you? The people drawing these pictures aren't doing it because they're professional artists making profound postmodern cultural statements. They're not doing it because they're trying to make the world a better place. They're doing it because they're racist fuckwits. There's no scenario where it should be a good idea to be a racist fuckwit.

 

 

I agree that some of them are indeed racist fuckwits. But that is incidental.

 

And they are allowed to do it....sorta. They either get scorned or murdered. Freedom of speech has to protect the unsavory shit, the shit we don't like. It has to protect the Holocaust deniers and the white supremacists and the Pam Gellers of the world, otherwise it's just "freedom of uncontroversial speech."

 

 

Should the MET have taken down art that depicted Muhammad? Should Wikipedia have?

 

I think there are a few issues here, and we're both talking past each other a bit:

 

1) should people be able to draw Muhammad without fear of death? (I think we all agree that yes, they should)

 

2) is it wise--given the current state of affairs--to draw Muhammad? (Practically speaking, it is dangerous to do)

 

3) might there be some racist people involved in the drawing of Muhammad? (without a doubt)

 

4) do we want to live in a world where drawing Muhammad--for whatever reason--isn't dangerous? (I hope we all do)

 

5) When someone draws Muhammad (or writes a book about Islam, or a film, or whatever) and is murdered, is it their own fault? (I hope we all think that no, no it's not)

 

 

 

 

You'll see why i'm just a casual tourist to these threads limpy. Drop a clusterbomb then move on, i don't care to argue the toss or get into great detail. My grandfather used to say that it was not worth belabouring a point at a party, it's tedious for both you and your audience. Over the years have come to fully agree with this idea. A point of view will either stick and you can carry on amongst like minds (there are few here i have found, at least not that will admit it, perhaps because that would leave them open to the same self assured piss tank dumping or pages and pages of misunderstanding and circular arguments that never allow a point to stand corrected for long); or the point will perhaps become a seed in the mind of the listener, which imperceptibly alters their perception so that a few months of even years down the track they'll see something through the context of that seed, and it will activate a shift in their worldview (or not). Either way, don't be a tiresome bore (i'm failing in this post, heeh, sorry).

 

For the record limpy i agree that there should be society wide draw muhammed days, i was thinking about this the other day and came to the obvious conclusion that indeed it would lessen the threat to each individual event of attack by radical nutbags down to near zero. And eventually even normalise the thing (so the radicals would give up and stop thinking about it). Which is what we should have done in the first place. We don't agree (extremists) that you can force us to also be precious about your fantasy religio rules, so we'll do the opposite because we can and if you don't like it, well go live somewhere that wants to live that way, or learn that you don't have the right to not be offended.

 

i also agree that racism is a diversion from the fundamental issue, which is of freedom of thought. You have to wonder at the mindset of those that would excuse radical bullies in such a way, are they not aware how hypocritical their position is? Or are the just going with the flow, their critical faculties totally divorced from the process, lying languid, in an unfurnished limbo struggling to do the simple numerical computation that would count the years since it was last called upon.

[goDel]

So, euhm, yeah, that thing about avoiding political discussions at watmm...

 

*already forgot what I was doing*

[Adieu]

Damn, I just got one of those Withings scales today. Good to know I shouldn't use it for selfies lol. For the record, the scale actually relays the weight data to an app for logging, so he could have just posted a screenshot of the app instead.

[Guest Atom Dowry Firth]

 

Alright, so to give you guys a sense of my frustration...this is why i'll never again talk politics on WATMM

 

Nah you should. Delet is butthurt because I had a go at him in another thread, so now he's trying to put me into some kind of derogatory box of his own imagining in some kind of weird attempt at baiting. The fact that he thinks liberal ideas are contradictory fallacies, is a moderator and has literally just admitted to deliberately trolling with the vast majority of his posts, all while spouting ideas usually only found on fringe 'news' blogs = not really worth taking seriously.

[Rubin Farr]

Please deport the Duggars.

[cwmbrancity]

no biscuits n gravy lurrrrrv?

 

shame on y'all