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How does the World view America these days?


Rubin Farr
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6 minutes ago, hijexx said:

Your bias is that the murder’s actions don’t match his words. It’s fine to have that bias but don’t go putting words in my mouth that I can’t believe he’s a liar. If there is evidence that he is a white supremacist, like he’s a member of a bunch of WP FB groups or wrote screeds about the stuff I’ll believe it. Until then the only fact I’ve seen is his statement.

Still not sure why you had to take it to an ad hominem attack but whatever makes you happy.

Jesus hopping Christ. Does this dude have to sign and seal a letter saying he's racist for you to see he's racist?

That point aside, the police are leading the press here. He went to three massage parlors and 6/8 people killed were Asian women. The police's press conference sounded like PR for one of their own.

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2 minutes ago, Braintree said:

Jesus hopping Christ. Does this dude have to sign and seal a letter saying he's racist for you to see he's racist?

It only matters what the jury thinks. If a racially motivated mass murder  carries a stiffer penalty than one that is not racially motivated that will be for the courts to decide which punishment he gets. That will depend on evidence.

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1 minute ago, hijexx said:

It only matters what the jury thinks. If a racially motivated mass murder  carries a stiffer penalty than one that is not racially motivated that will be for the courts to decide which punishment he gets. That will depend on evidence.

We're not in court here and we're not discussing a court case since it doesn't exist yet. We're criticizing the police's response to the suspect.

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Just now, Braintree said:

We're not in court here and we're not discussing a court case since it doesn't exist yet. We're criticizing the police's response to the suspect.

I think we’re just talking past each other at this point. Police response is terrible, I don’t see how you comeback from saying a mass murderer “had a bad day” then express zero empathy for the victims. As for shooter my opinion is I don’t know enough yet to jump to the conclusion that he is an evil racist who had premeditated a hate crime. The case is brand new and we will learn more. That’s about all I got, sorry I don’t see it exactly like you do bro.

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1 minute ago, hijexx said:

That’s about all I got, sorry I don’t see it exactly like you do bro.

I get the feeling that we could both watch a dog take a shit in the kitchen and I would say "hey, there's some dog shit in the kitchen" and you would say "let's not jump to conclusions!"

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23 minutes ago, Braintree said:

I get the feeling that we could both watch a dog take a shit in the kitchen and I would say "hey, there's some dog shit in the kitchen" and you would say "let's not jump to conclusions!"

I’ll let you have the last ad hominem dig, seems like that is what you enjoy. 

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2 minutes ago, hijexx said:

I’ll let you have the last ad hominem dig, seems like that is what you enjoy. 

This is the third insult that you've given in this manner. Try to come up with some originals, please.

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6 hours ago, Braintree said:

race/hate crime is a lot worse under the law than a "crime of passion.

But not worse than the 3 life sentences for murder he’s looking to serve...

Also, that path of “the cops should assume” is a very dangerous one. The police should investigate and report the facts, not what people (or the police for that matter) may want to hear. The representative from the Anti-Defamation League says it well in the second half of this article. Yes it’s not up to the suspect to decide, but that is the information the police had to that point, or at least the information they get comfortable releasing to the public. So they are reporting the facts as they knew them, at that time. If they just stopped there, obviously there would be a bigger issue.  

That said, the cops’ statement that “he had a bad day” is fucking ridiculous, and that comms person should be fired. 
 

I’d say the bigger racial issue is why so many Asian women are reduced to working in rub’n’tugs. Are we allowed to say that Asian organized crime is a huge issue? Cause make no mistake, a lot of those women who were working in those brothels were trafficked, and not by whitey. 

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Just now, chenGOD said:

But not worse than the 3 life sentences for murder he’s looking to serve...

Also, that path of “the cops should assume” is a very dangerous one. The police should investigate and report the facts, not what people (or the police for that matter) may want to hear. The representative from the Anti-Defamation League says it well in the second half of this article. Yes it’s not up to the suspect to decide, but that is the information the police had to that point, or at least the information they get comfortable releasing to the public. So they are reporting the facts as they knew them, at that time. If they just stopped there, obviously there would be a bigger issue.  

That said, the cops’ statement that “he had a bad day” is fucking ridiculous, and that comms person should be fired. 

 

I’d say the bigger racial issue is why so many Asian women are reduced to working in rub’n’tugs. Are we allowed to say that Asian organized crime is a huge issue? Cause make no mistake, a lot of those women who were working in those brothels were trafficked, and not by whitey. 

My point was that they shouldn't have said anything!

They should have described the incident, like usual, instead of forming an argument like the one they did.

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Just now, Braintree said:

My point was that they shouldn't have said anything!

They should have described the incident, like usual, instead of forming an argument like the one they did.

The reporter asked them, the cops described the incident based on the information they had up to that point. If they said nothing, people would complain about the lack of transparency. 

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Just now, chenGOD said:

The reporter asked them, the cops described the incident based on the information they had up to that point. If they said nothing, people would complain about the lack of transparency. 

:rolleyes:

They shouldn't be framing this the way they did.

 

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9 minutes ago, chenGOD said:

The reporter asked them, the cops described the incident based on the information they had up to that point. If they said nothing, people would complain about the lack of transparency. 

people will always complain. police should be used to it "we don't have information on that yet. investigation is ongoing. we don't want to speculate" etc etc.. 

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Just now, Braintree said:

:rolleyes:

They shouldn't be framing this the way they did.

 

My dude, they aren’t framing shit. They are reporting the facts as they have them to this point.  
The comment about “having a bad day” was reprehensible, but they’re not saying “well he said he didn’t do it, that’s it case closed”. They have explicitly said the investigation will continue, to further uncover evidence which may or may not lead to a hate crime sentence being tacked on. 
Apparently the suspect has some anti-Asian material posted on his social media accounts, which may provide more context.
 

However, the below may provoke more thought.
 

Question: how many white sex workers are there in massage parlours in Atlanta? If this guy had been going to these massage parlours for a couple of years, and there are no white girls working in similar establishments, then I’d say the racial element probably stemmed from fetishization of Asian women, combined with significant mental health issues about relationships. Add those together with the fact that he bought the gun on the same day, and it becomes a little more nuanced. 

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5 minutes ago, ignatius said:

people will always complain. police should be used to it "we don't have information on that yet. investigation is ongoing. we don't want to speculate" etc etc.. 

listen to the question the cop is responding to.

https://youtu.be/6e_3GK052pk

 

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1 minute ago, chenGOD said:

My dude, they aren’t framing shit. They are reporting the facts as they have them to this point.  
The comment about “having a bad day” was reprehensible, but they’re not saying “well he said he didn’t do it, that’s it case closed”. They have explicitly said the investigation will continue, to further uncover evidence which may or may not lead to a hate crime sentence being tacked on. 
Apparently the suspect has some anti-Asian material posted on his social media accounts, which may provide more context.
 

However, the below may provoke more thought.
 

Question: how many white sex workers are there in massage parlours in Atlanta? If this guy had been going to these massage parlours for a couple of years, and there are no white girls working in similar establishments, then I’d say the racial element probably stemmed from fetishization of Asian women, combined with significant mental health issues about relationships. Add those together with the fact that he bought the gun on the same day, and it becomes a little more nuanced. 

The facts, again, weren't the problem. Don't start a straw man here. The police do not have to give any statement about him being a sex addict or anything. They don't have to comment on that at all. Kind of odd since it doesn't have anything to do with the events that occurred. This looks explicitly like framing the conversation, especially considering charges haven't been filed yet.

Also, I seriously think that a white guy that drives that far, and to several locations, to kill women who are mostly Asian makes this look like a race related crime. LIke....fucking obviously.

The bastion of American journalism is even jumping on that narrative: https://www.foxnews.com/us/atlanta-shooting-suspect-robert-long-rehab-sex-addiction-former-roommates

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10 minutes ago, chenGOD said:

listen to the question the cop is responding to.

https://youtu.be/6e_3GK052pk

 

yeah. and the cop does sound a bit flabbergasted at those phrases... i get that. he did attribute the phrases to the shooter.. but imo i don't think he should've said anything. "it's early and we don't want characterize his motives in any way or speculate"

it's not surprising really.. that it went the way it went.  even though this kind of shit seems to happen often enough in america i don't think any cop expects to have to talk about it in front of cameras. 

some people are savy about all these things and that's something that comes w/experience. i think this cop should have dodged the questions is all i'm saying. there's no rule that says he has to answer the question. 

by repeating the shooter's words it creates a narrative that all the media jumps on and niche electronic music forums have to chew on it instead of talking about bitcoin NFT art deals. 

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5 minutes ago, Braintree said:

he police do not have to give any statement about him being a sex addict or anything.

Listen to the question the cops are responding to. Video posted above. 
 

5 minutes ago, Braintree said:

I seriously think that a white guy that drives that far, and to several locations, to kill women who are mostly Asian makes this look like a race related crime. LIke....fucking obviously.

Luckily, justice doesn’t rely on what people in the streets think, otherwise the incidence of minorities in jail in America would be even higher. 

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23 minutes ago, chenGOD said:

Question: how many white sex workers are there in massage parlours in Atlanta?

1417 

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Just now, chenGOD said:

Listen to the question the cops are responding to. Video posted above.

Who mentioned the "addiction" first?

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4 minutes ago, ignatius said:

i don't think any cop expects to have to talk about it in front of cameras. 

This particular cop happens to be one of the Atlanta PD comms people, so it’s kind of his job. 
Again, the cop repeats twice that it’s the suspect who claims it, and then states and reiterates that the investigation is not done. 

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It sounds like she's asking a question about something he mentioned beforehand.

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6 minutes ago, Braintree said:

Who mentioned the "addiction" first?

The reporter. In the clip I posted at least. However it does appear that the chief of police (not this cop) may have said addiction in a previous press conference, where they discuss interviewing the suspect with the FBI, and the mayor of Atlanta (a black woman) also says it is too early to tell. 

Also, if it was purely racially motivated, then why were two non-Asians killed?

 
 

 

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3 minutes ago, chenGOD said:

This particular cop happens to be one of the Atlanta PD comms people, so it’s kind of his job. 
Again, the cop repeats twice that it’s the suspect who claims it, and then states and reiterates that the investigation is not done. 

is he the guy who is being removed for the alleged racist asian/corona virus posts on facebook? 

i think he fucked up but i think other people would have too. i mean.. every word is going to be picked apart. It's almost impossible to not step in shit. Best to run in place. being vague, dodging the question.. seems the best way to avoid all the hyper focused lens on every word. even saying "this is what he claimed".. idk man.. i don't think i'd want to make the case for him by putting that out there. let some facts settle etc. 

but that's my opinion. he's probably wondering "WTF did i say? why are people so upset? doesn't context matter? those aren't my words they are his" etc.. 

but once it's out it's out. 

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1 minute ago, chenGOD said:

The reporter. 

First of all, that's a weird question without prompt. Second of all, since it's a speculative element of an ongoing investigation, he doesn't have to answer it. There is no motive at this time.

Here, let me edit that. Here's what he should have said:

Quote

This is an ongoing investigation. There is no clear motive at this time, so we can't speculate on that.

 

11 minutes ago, chenGOD said:

Also, if it was purely racially motivated, then why were two non-Asians killed? 

Because they were there. Murder is messy.

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