spunktronics Posted September 5, 2017 Share Posted September 5, 2017 been working on an album since 2014ish, basically had it finished like 3 times and i change it up and rearrange shit and swap sounds out and change my production style. who else does this? It's really starting to grind me down now cause it was probably fine 2 years ago but i always do this and never finish anything...:[ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b born droid Posted September 5, 2017 Share Posted September 5, 2017 been working on an album since 2014ish, basically had it finished like 3 times and i change it up and rearrange shit and swap sounds out and change my production style. who else does this? It's really starting to grind me down now cause it was probably fine 2 years ago but i always do this and never finish anything...:[ I never do this anymore. A while ago I learnt to just let stuff go. Absolutely no point in forcing something. If I want to try other styles, I find new ideas, rather than try to shape something into it. I also don't believe in being able to return to tracks after periods of inactivity, that creative moment is lost and I know from experience I could actually write something brand new that is better than trying to finish something old. It's a shame because I have lots of stuff that I still think is shit hot lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcbpete Posted September 5, 2017 Share Posted September 5, 2017 If there's a track that you love an idea of I'd say there's no harm in revisiting at all, but maybe release it a new 'remix' instead of losing the original again For instance this track in 2006 had a nice progression but went a bit M83-ish for our liking: [bandcamp width=100% height=42 album=3251998843 size=small bgcol=ffffff linkcol=0687f5 track=404418638] So 4 years later as we had better equipment, musical knowledge and production techniques etc. it became this: [bandcamp width=100% height=120 track=2568393952 size=large bgcol=ffffff linkcol=0687f5 tracklist=false artwork=small] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zoix Posted September 5, 2017 Share Posted September 5, 2017 been working on an album since 2014ish, basically had it finished like 3 times and i change it up and rearrange shit and swap sounds out and change my production style. who else does this? It's really starting to grind me down now cause it was probably fine 2 years ago but i always do this and never finish anything...:[ Is there something special about this album for you? Like your special album you want to be particularly polished and keep coming back to as you improve as a producer? Skickat från min SM-G930F via Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peace 7 Posted September 5, 2017 Share Posted September 5, 2017 been working on an album since 2014ish, basically had it finished like 3 times and i change it up and rearrange shit and swap sounds out and change my production style. who else does this? It's really starting to grind me down now cause it was probably fine 2 years ago but i always do this and never finish anything...:[ If I did this with drawing, I would have no drawings from elementary school. Now is the infinite now, but we don't always have to self-reference in the now. As noted, gotta learn to let things go. Everything is not about doing the best you can in all time periods and dimensions; else we'd all beat up ourselves over idealized future selves-- it's about doing the best you can by using your present judgment, using will power to fight through laziness, and being confident enough to know when something is at its prime cuz it feels solid. Ironically, this can all be done by "not giving a shit". OF COURSE you care, or you wouldn't be doing it. So "not giving a shit" just means to not become paralyzed over stupid little details, when there's like 3 minutes left to finish in the track. That being said, if you work on your own music 5~10 years after not working on it, it's basically like working on someone else's music. In that sense, creative potential is pretty high, when it comes to seeing things in new contexts and hearing things totally differently. -A curse of this is that one often finds out years later, that their old unfinished music was quite fucking good ("Why didn't I finish it?" "Cuz lazy." "Oh, right."). My goals with music: Set deadlines, finish music. I have a fuckload of awesome unfinished music from the past 20 years, but that really accomplishes nothing but having had fun. But I always have fun, so fun cannot be the ultimate goal of my music. So to me, it is a WASTE OF LIFE to not finish your own music. I'm working on one of my best albums ever now, and I need to finish it. Creating great art can't always be about that feeling you have when starting a new loop from scratch. When it comes to influencing the world positively- and influencing yourself positively- one finished album is worth far more than several thousand unfinished tracks. There is no perfection, but completion is divine. Something that working for others has taught me (corporate and freelance), is that "unrealistic deadlines" are actually mostly realistic. When we don't finish our own hobby music, nobody is gonna come into your bedroom and fire you from making IDM. But if you aren't up to standard in a high-performance corporate environment, you're fucked, because you could end up not being able to pay for food. So you start the project, even though the deadlines and workload seem humanly impossible. But then you realize you don't wanna be sucking dick for pocket change behind McDonald's, so you ALLOW YOURSELF to push yourself. And holy fuck motherfucker, deadline comes, and you either finished the project, or got to 97% and get a deadline extension. THAT is how projects get done- by setting deadlines and sticking to them. IDM is infinite and yah you have forever to make the most epic album of all time, but the world that actually produces high-level output on a regular basis has proven time and time again: Deadlines are required to push oneself to the next-level. And pushing oneself to the next-level is truly IDM; truly Ultra. Deadlines=IDM Ultra Hack. In a corporate environment you don't have time to nitpick all the small things that slow you down with hobby music, because if you nitpick, you won't meet deadlines; get fired. And if you never meet deadlines, you end up giving handjobs at Burger King, just because nobody with moral integrity can trust you to do anything. Trust yourself, set a fucking deadline, and watch your pure genius unfold when you stick to it. When you can set and meet your own deadlines in life, nobody can stop you from accomplishing anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spunktronics Posted September 5, 2017 Author Share Posted September 5, 2017 been working on an album since 2014ish, basically had it finished like 3 times and i change it up and rearrange shit and swap sounds out and change my production style. who else does this? It's really starting to grind me down now cause it was probably fine 2 years ago but i always do this and never finish anything...:[ Is there something special about this album for you? Like your special album you want to be particularly polished and keep coming back to as you improve as a producer? Skickat från min SM-G930F via Tapatalk yes it'll be the first thing solo i'll release proper... it's a journey of discovery accumulating everything i've learnt as a producer coming all my fav styles etc.. i've released stuff in the past with bands and collabs and thought thats shite...so vowed never to do this again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spunktronics Posted September 5, 2017 Author Share Posted September 5, 2017 been working on an album since 2014ish, basically had it finished like 3 times and i change it up and rearrange shit and swap sounds out and change my production style. who else does this? It's really starting to grind me down now cause it was probably fine 2 years ago but i always do this and never finish anything...:[ If I did this with drawing, I would have no drawings from elementary school. Now is the infinite now, but we don't always have to self-reference in the now. As noted, gotta learn to let things go. Everything is not about doing the best you can in all time periods and dimensions; else we'd all beat up ourselves over idealized future selves-- it's about doing the best you can by using your present judgment, using will power to fight through laziness, and being confident enough to know when something is at its prime cuz it feels solid. Ironically, this can all be done by "not giving a shit". OF COURSE you care, or you wouldn't be doing it. So "not giving a shit" just means to not become paralyzed over stupid little details, when there's like 3 minutes left to finish in the track. That being said, if you work on your own music 5~10 years after not working on it, it's basically like working on someone else's music. In that sense, creative potential is pretty high, when it comes to seeing things in new contexts and hearing things totally differently. -A curse of this is that one often finds out years later, that their old unfinished music was quite fucking good ("Why didn't I finish it?" "Cuz lazy." "Oh, right."). My goals with music: Set deadlines, finish music. I have a fuckload of awesome unfinished music from the past 20 years, but that really accomplishes nothing but having had fun. But I always have fun, so fun cannot be the ultimate goal of my music. So to me, it is a WASTE OF LIFE to not finish your own music. I'm working on one of my best albums ever now, and I need to finish it. Creating great art can't always be about that feeling you have when starting a new loop from scratch. When it comes to influencing the world positively- and influencing yourself positively- one finished album is worth far more than several thousand unfinished tracks. There is no perfection, but completion is divine. Something that working for others has taught me (corporate and freelance), is that "unrealistic deadlines" are actually mostly realistic. When we don't finish our own hobby music, nobody is gonna come into your bedroom and fire you from making IDM. But if you aren't up to standard in a high-performance corporate environment, you're fucked, because you could end up not being able to pay for food. So you start the project, even though the deadlines and workload seem humanly impossible. But then you realize you don't wanna be sucking dick for pocket change behind McDonald's, so you ALLOW YOURSELF to push yourself. And holy fuck motherfucker, deadline comes, and you either finished the project, or got to 97% and get a deadline extension. THAT is how projects get done- by setting deadlines and sticking to them. IDM is infinite and yah you have forever to make the most epic album of all time, but the world that actually produces high-level output on a regular basis has proven time and time again: Deadlines are required to push oneself to the next-level. And pushing oneself to the next-level is truly IDM; truly Ultra. Deadlines=IDM Ultra Hack. In a corporate environment you don't have time to nitpick all the small things that slow you down with hobby music, because if you nitpick, you won't meet deadlines; get fired. And if you never meet deadlines, you end up giving handjobs at Burger King, just because nobody with moral integrity can trust you to do anything. Trust yourself, set a fucking deadline, and watch your pure genius unfold when you stick to it. When you can set and meet your own deadlines in life, nobody can stop you from accomplishing anything. totes know what ya saying dude but i've been writing over music at the same time so i don't really have a deadline i'm just interested in people process, i view tracks like lifeforms or they start off simple and progressvly get more deveolped until theyre at the point were nothing niggles me and i'm like yea thats it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zoix Posted September 5, 2017 Share Posted September 5, 2017 been working on an album since 2014ish, basically had it finished like 3 times and i change it up and rearrange shit and swap sounds out and change my production style. who else does this? It's really starting to grind me down now cause it was probably fine 2 years ago but i always do this and never finish anything...:[ Is there something special about this album for you? Like your special album you want to be particularly polished and keep coming back to as you improve as a producer? Skickat från min SM-G930F via Tapatalk yes it'll be the first thing solo i'll release proper... it's a journey of discovery accumulating everything i've learnt as a producer coming all my fav styles etc.. i've released stuff in the past with bands and collabs and thought thats shite...so vowed never to do this again. Well sounds like you want it to be really polished and maybe this is your personal process. Have you gotten any feedback yet? That really helps for me at least. Skickat från min SM-G930F via Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
entropi Posted September 5, 2017 Share Posted September 5, 2017 I love remixing and remaking my old tracks. I have stuff from 92 that I still keep making new versions of... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spunktronics Posted September 5, 2017 Author Share Posted September 5, 2017 been working on an album since 2014ish, basically had it finished like 3 times and i change it up and rearrange shit and swap sounds out and change my production style. who else does this? It's really starting to grind me down now cause it was probably fine 2 years ago but i always do this and never finish anything...:[ Is there something special about this album for you? Like your special album you want to be particularly polished and keep coming back to as you improve as a producer? Skickat från min SM-G930F via Tapatalk yes it'll be the first thing solo i'll release proper... it's a journey of discovery accumulating everything i've learnt as a producer coming all my fav styles etc.. i've released stuff in the past with bands and collabs and thought thats shite...so vowed never to do this again. Well sounds like you want it to be really polished and maybe this is your personal process. Have you gotten any feedback yet? That really helps for me at least. Skickat från min SM-G930F via Tapatalk just from friends that are like "sick bro, get this shit out there" its definitely not a polished sound but its a sound hahaha maybe just a case of too many influences maybe stop listening to so much music Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diatoms Posted September 5, 2017 Share Posted September 5, 2017 been working on an album since 2014ish, basically had it finished like 3 times and i change it up and rearrange shit and swap sounds out and change my production style. who else does this? It's really starting to grind me down now cause it was probably fine 2 years ago but i always do this and never finish anything...:[ If I did this with drawing, I would have no drawings from elementary school. Now is the infinite now, but we don't always have to self-reference in the now. As noted, gotta learn to let things go. Everything is not about doing the best you can in all time periods and dimensions; else we'd all beat up ourselves over idealized future selves-- it's about doing the best you can by using your present judgment, using will power to fight through laziness, and being confident enough to know when something is at its prime cuz it feels solid. Ironically, this can all be done by "not giving a shit". OF COURSE you care, or you wouldn't be doing it. So "not giving a shit" just means to not become paralyzed over stupid little details, when there's like 3 minutes left to finish in the track. That being said, if you work on your own music 5~10 years after not working on it, it's basically like working on someone else's music. In that sense, creative potential is pretty high, when it comes to seeing things in new contexts and hearing things totally differently. -A curse of this is that one often finds out years later, that their old unfinished music was quite fucking good ("Why didn't I finish it?" "Cuz lazy." "Oh, right."). My goals with music: Set deadlines, finish music. I have a fuckload of awesome unfinished music from the past 20 years, but that really accomplishes nothing but having had fun. But I always have fun, so fun cannot be the ultimate goal of my music. So to me, it is a WASTE OF LIFE to not finish your own music. I'm working on one of my best albums ever now, and I need to finish it. Creating great art can't always be about that feeling you have when starting a new loop from scratch. When it comes to influencing the world positively- and influencing yourself positively- one finished album is worth far more than several thousand unfinished tracks. There is no perfection, but completion is divine. Something that working for others has taught me (corporate and freelance), is that "unrealistic deadlines" are actually mostly realistic. When we don't finish our own hobby music, nobody is gonna come into your bedroom and fire you from making IDM. But if you aren't up to standard in a high-performance corporate environment, you're fucked, because you could end up not being able to pay for food. So you start the project, even though the deadlines and workload seem humanly impossible. But then you realize you don't wanna be sucking dick for pocket change behind McDonald's, so you ALLOW YOURSELF to push yourself. And holy fuck motherfucker, deadline comes, and you either finished the project, or got to 97% and get a deadline extension. THAT is how projects get done- by setting deadlines and sticking to them. IDM is infinite and yah you have forever to make the most epic album of all time, but the world that actually produces high-level output on a regular basis has proven time and time again: Deadlines are required to push oneself to the next-level. And pushing oneself to the next-level is truly IDM; truly Ultra. Deadlines=IDM Ultra Hack. In a corporate environment you don't have time to nitpick all the small things that slow you down with hobby music, because if you nitpick, you won't meet deadlines; get fired. And if you never meet deadlines, you end up giving handjobs at Burger King, just because nobody with moral integrity can trust you to do anything. Trust yourself, set a fucking deadline, and watch your pure genius unfold when you stick to it. When you can set and meet your own deadlines in life, nobody can stop you from accomplishing anything. Awesome Thoughts on this Thanks peace 7 :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donimo Posted September 5, 2017 Share Posted September 5, 2017 ALL expression is valid. This includes unpolished expression. Any flaws present may become artistic quirks. Allow this to empower you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCM Posted September 5, 2017 Share Posted September 5, 2017 i hate returning to tracks, almost never do it. fire and forget innit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peace 7 Posted September 6, 2017 Share Posted September 6, 2017 Awesome Thoughts on this Thanks peace 7 :) :-) Keep on truckin', mang~! Much love to all~~~ I belieeeve in yooooouuuuu~~~ You can do it, fellow Cosmic Warriors! Don't let yourself stop yourself! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sweepstakes Posted September 6, 2017 Share Posted September 6, 2017 My goals with music: Set deadlines, finish music. I have a fuckload of awesome unfinished music from the past 20 years, but that really accomplishes nothing but having had fun. But I always have fun, so fun cannot be the ultimate goal of my music. So to me, it is a WASTE OF LIFE to not finish your own music. I'm working on one of my best albums ever now, and I need to finish it. Creating great art can't always be about that feeling you have when starting a new loop from scratch. ... There is no perfection, but completion is divine. Trust yourself, set a fucking deadline, and watch your pure genius unfold when you stick to it. When you can set and meet your own deadlines in life, nobody can stop you from accomplishing anything. This is great advice. How do I know? Because when it comes to music I'm a total loser dilettante and I've never released any albums or EPs and the only things in recent memory that have made me finish something are: - WeeklyBeats (if you're not familiar, a beat is due every Sunday) - The WATMM MnM compo (now, my track was the weakest on there but I was still proud that I finished something) it's a journey of discovery accumulating everything i've learnt as a producer coming all my fav styles etc.. This is bullshit. You're setting expectations way too high like this is going to going to be the thing you're remembered by. Knock that nonsense off! And on the other hand, what you said is actually so obvious as to be banal, just because your tastes are going to guide everything you do, by default. You really don't need to put any focus there, you'll get all the lessons and preferences "for free", just by virtue of being you! I'm starting to realize that there's only 2 ways to be productive in this artform: - Accepting the flaws and running with them (which imo is what peace's advice implies): Autechre - Monk-like devotion to the craft (which inevitably burns you out): Boards of Canada, Squarepusher - OK, 3rd option, BOTH: Aphex Twin I don't have time for #2 or #3! #1 it is! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diatoms Posted September 6, 2017 Share Posted September 6, 2017 This is an Awesome thread! I finished my first track a week and a half ago Listened to it once Love I was going to listen to it again with fresh ears here in a couple of days My memory says it's done :) On to track 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spunktronics Posted September 6, 2017 Author Share Posted September 6, 2017 in some ways i see it no different to a band developing a style or a sound and writing songs they morph and change etc.. The difference is that your'e playing all the instruments and rather than falling out with fellow band members you just fall out with yourself.ha! i think it's weird that computer/electronic music is be classed as such throwaway music. youve invested loads of time and money in buying gear and learning a software package etc.. surely thats the same as buying a guitar amp and pedals etc...just like you would get a new pedal your sound will change, you get a new riff idea for a song and bring it to the band you add a chorus bridge etc.. so why is electronic music so different? outside influences effect the progression unless youre making stuff in a strict genre (doom,techno) that have particular aspects. If your trying to push the boundaries of what you want to sound like before unleashing and have the passion prduce something that a little different. I'm not trying to make my magnum opus but i definitely want to make something that looks at a style/sound from a different angle not for people to go yea wow amazing or anything like that but for me to fill that gap in the crossroads of my tastes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCM Posted September 6, 2017 Share Posted September 6, 2017 basically for me, i ain't got time to bleed. can't be fucking about fiddling around with this and that or changing shit...takes me long enough to finish a track as it is. as i'm recording parts, i'll definitely redo them if i'm not happy (e.g. record the snare track live, fuck up a fill-in, delete recording and start that bit again - i'll often do this several times for each part). but once all parts are recorded into my DAW and edited, fucked if i'm going to go back and re-arrange it all or whatever. basically, i don't really enjoy the whole recording process or crafting a track to perfection. what i really like is sitting in front of lots of gear with flashing lights on it, making weird noises and getting stoned. occasionally i'll get a track done... i also hate making albums - it's just like a really long process and i get bored as fuck. essentially i hate music. why am i here again? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sweepstakes Posted September 6, 2017 Share Posted September 6, 2017 so why is electronic music so different? outside influences effect the progression unless youre making stuff in a strict genre (doom,techno) that have particular aspects. If your trying to push the boundaries of what you want to sound like before unleashing and have the passion prduce something that a little different. I'm not trying to make my magnum opus but i definitely want to make something that looks at a style/sound from a different angle not for people to go yea wow amazing or anything like that but for me to fill that gap in the crossroads of my tastes I actually don't think it's that difficult to do something a little different and interesting. Just try to be conscious of your habits, and take them out of the picture as much as you can. If you're trying to synthesize a couple things, get away from the chin-stroking and just do it as brutally as possible - sample a couple bars of each, mix them together, and force them to get along. Then you can get into things like cutting up the sample and rearranging it, making one copy the other, amplifying the commonalities or differences, etc. Grab a copy of the Oblique Strategies and take its advice :) what i really like is sitting in front of lots of gear with flashing lights on it, making weird noises and getting stoned. occasionally i'll get a track done... On the other hand I'm trying to get away from this right now... like peace said, it's great fun but it doesn't go anywhere. I have so many ideas (or maybe it's just one big multi-faceted idea) but not many tracks to show for them. Just lots and lots of sloppy, self-indulgent jams that I have to trawl through for the good parts. It would be much cooler to have those baked into some finished(-ish) tracks, if not for people to hear what I'm about, then at least something for me to listen to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCM Posted September 6, 2017 Share Posted September 6, 2017 i do actually have quite a few tracks and a couple albums to show for it...just found making them a chore...i get shit done and realise just messing about making jams is not productive so make myself finish stuff. i just don't enjoy the process that much (but do it anyway). was just trying to be honest and admit the parts i actually like about making music. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Chesney Posted September 6, 2017 Share Posted September 6, 2017 I was in the same boat as the OP for so long, always had the goal of an album and only last year did I actually make myself complete it. Of course hundreds of tracks moved in and out of this idea so the album could have been a mix of any of bunch of tracks and the ever increasing track count are all valid for inclusion on the next project, who knows? I have 2 Ep's pretty much done but waiting on my space to be perfect before I mix and get them right. Like BCM, the main thing is jamming and having fun and lots may never get recorded but it's the best fun nonetheless. I can get frustrated at the arrangement stage and leave tracks for weeks, months, years before the right idea comes along and makes it work, but I see no point in righting off good initial ideas in some weird idea that going over old ideas are unproductive. They aren't if you can mash newly learned concepts and make something cool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hautlle Posted September 7, 2017 Share Posted September 7, 2017 Zero times -- live hardware jams. Even when I was doing everything via software I rarely would go back and completely rewrite/change a track. As said previously, that moment is gone far too fast -- grasping at straws for "perfection" is fruitless and usually frustrating. I just look at each track as a little piece of time -- some times are amazing and memorable, some aren't, but they're all important though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spunktronics Posted September 7, 2017 Author Share Posted September 7, 2017 I was in the same boat as the OP for so long, always had the goal of an album and only last year did I actually make myself complete it. Of course hundreds of tracks moved in and out of this idea so the album could have been a mix of any of bunch of tracks and the ever increasing track count are all valid for inclusion on the next project, who knows? I have 2 Ep's pretty much done but waiting on my space to be perfect before I mix and get them right. Like BCM, the main thing is jamming and having fun and lots may never get recorded but it's the best fun nonetheless. I can get frustrated at the arrangement stage and leave tracks for weeks, months, years before the right idea comes along and makes it work, but I see no point in righting off good initial ideas in some weird idea that going over old ideas are unproductive. They aren't if you can mash newly learned concepts and make something cool. yea same, this album is based on sampling tapes, mainly bollywood tapes. i'll get a cool sample and the nit flow from there and i'll add some shit in, synths and beats and then noises and ambience etc.. then i'll start to move whole sections around and then before i know it I've got a completely different track without the original sample and it's like amazing realization then i'll listen to it a few days later and that gives me more ideas.. eventually it becomes set in stone then i start to really edit everything down and add in all the variations on beats and resample shit and automation etc... then i'll almost start the process again resampling whole sections and cutting them up cause i'm trying to tell a story and get it right...i never hardly start with an idea unless i have a sample of jam some shit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spunktronics Posted September 7, 2017 Author Share Posted September 7, 2017 here's a half finished track https://instaud.io/1eWR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.