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jordan peterson


zaphod

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@qnio — good post m9

thanks. always a pleasure to read yours

is a great way to view the world innit.. keep calling people figures of stupidity with no value, keep calling them charlatans and assume there is nothing to be learned from them.. feels good no?

it's not about whether it feels good or not, it has been already proven in this thread that nothing can be learned from jordan peterson.

 

well yes there is. this can (probably) be helpful if you want to achieve something:

 

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i have learned a whole lot, and so seem a lot of people who follow him, i suppose we are just ignorant then.. any other adjectives you find appropriate for us?

 

 

 

followers could be inferred as disciples

 

jokes aside, it illustrates how poorly psychology is relayed to the general populace & society as a whole, so when a well-qualified therapist throws his hat in the proverbial ideological ring & piggybacks on the likes of Nietzsche, Piaget & Jung as a means to discredit those scholars Peterson objects to, the outcomes can be toxic but with a 50k a month Patreon income as a sweet chaser

 

thinkers like Nietzsche & Jung will always resonate with anyone pro-actively minded or anyone in a bind discovering them for the first time

 

it also hasnt helped that left leaning platforms continually ram the perils of PATRIARCHY down any observer's throat, so its possibly no surprise that young men make up the bulk of Peterson's fan base because patriarchy & hegemony are different categories entirely & if yer just starting out in the adult world you could be forgiven for thinking "what has this got to do with me?"

 

Peterson is canny enough to know this & if he was purely in it for the "healing", his self help courses would be free cos he must have banked enough to guarantee 2/3 generations of Petersons will be financially independent....having said that psychotherapists do incredible work & its important to recognize that the numbers of people he has directly helped are significant pluses

 

on the flip-side his attacks on Scandinavian societies, however, are pure ideological farce & he'll never publicly concede much to left-wing thought/practice, which is one eyed & skewiff

 

i've enjoyed parts of his lectures on myths, Jung & particularly trauma & the pathology/manifestations of human malevolence, but theres no real balance if you take the whole picture into view & for a "classic British liberal" (which is how JP describes his own perspective), thats a tad problematic

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on the flip-side his attacks on Scandinavian societies, however, are pure ideological farce & he'll never publicly concede much to left-wing thought/practice, which is one eyed & skewiff

do you live here? he's dead on, is actually worse than he paints it.. atleast in sweden
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on the flip-side his attacks on Scandinavian societies, however, are pure ideological farce & he'll never publicly concede much to left-wing thought/practice, which is one eyed & skewiff

do you live here? he's dead on, is actually worse than he paints it.. atleast in sweden

 

 

 

have you read Judith Butler?

 

a link to a JP approved libertarian web-site isnt very cosmic & doesnt trowel out anything other than one academic condemning an entire system for pursuing the study of Judith Butler

 

her ideas on gender performativity are ignored with a degree of bull-headed ignorance (if you want a closer inspection on notions of "identity"), you dont have to agree with everything she has to say, but to dismiss her entire body of research or condemning including her works in an undergrad course bibliography as an "untenable" position, is shoddy & scholarly politicizing

 

considering i had to translate previous answers for you twice, in Swedish & Spanish, my only possible option is to recommend you listen to this, on repeat, for about 23hrs....

 

https://nursewithwound1.bandcamp.com/track/beware-the-african-mosquito-blue-lacuna-mix

 

.....while bemusing yourself over these images & text, at least this way humour & Judith Butler can be put into context, plus THERE ARE CATS:

 

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b2.png

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on the flip-side his attacks on Scandinavian societies, however, are pure ideological farce & he'll never publicly concede much to left-wing thought/practice, which is one eyed & skewiff

do you live here? he's dead on, is actually worse than he paints it.. atleast in sweden

have you read Judith Butler?

 

a link to a JP approved libertarian web-site isnt very cosmic & doesnt trowel out anything other than one academic condemning an entire system for pursuing the study of Judith Butler

 

her ideas on gender performativity are ignored with a degree of bull-headed ignorance (if you want a closer inspection on notions of "identity"), you dont have to agree with everything she has to say, but to dismiss her entire body of research or condemning including her works in an undergrad course bibliography as an "untenable" position, is shoddy & scholarly politicizing

 

considering i had to translate previous answers for you twice, in Swedish & Spanish, my only possible option is to recommend you listen to this, on repeat, for about 23hrs....

 

https://nursewithwound1.bandcamp.com/track/beware-the-african-mosquito-blue-lacuna-mix

 

.....while bemusing yourself over these images & text, at least this way humour & Judith Butler can be put into context, plus THERE ARE CATS:

 

b1.png

b2.png

ineed, a very relevant thinker for a course on "the reaction to modernity at the turn of the last century, with a focus on fascism."

 

ivar arpi is one of the last reasonable journalists we have left here, that article would not have been published by any of our newspapers

 

I also posted this case a couple of pages before (edit:subs available)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iv_Pyo0SnVY

 

here is the big post I made on this, I'm not re-doing it:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

He’s protesting “cultural Marxism” which doesn’t exist. Shame on all those people protesting real issues, eh?

perhaps not where you live, and id argue that inequality in the sense that has been protested against peterson is the non existent issue.

i guess we disagree

can you elaborate on this for us please?
I don't really want to engage that conversation on this thread.. but I'll explain from my perspective living in Sweden what I mean

class differences is a real issue and complicated issue.. but I have lived most of my life in a 2nd world country (Colombia) and in comparison Sweden truly is paradise when it comes to this. And so, seeing people demanding equity, seeing "Gulag" written on the streets and antifa/marxists movements and protests is, to me, ridiculous...

furthermore the narrative of these movements has moved up onto companies, the universities and the govermnet leading to ridiculous policies for equity, immigration problems and a huge fear from the media to discuss these issues.. so that's how I see it

now back to petersson, alco mentioned before that he doesn't add anything of meaning to the debate but iunno man.. if anything he makes people aware of the issue

actually i think this is the best thread we have for discussing this type of thing. i can't think where else on watmm it would be appropriate.

don't you think it's a bit rich to immediately reach for the marxist / antifa characterisation when discussing these things? overwhelmingly the majority of people who have an interest in equity and rights are not in this camp. not many people on here would agree with extremist tactics either but this is not a reason to go down the cultural marxism rabbit hole.

and really, you think the media and people are afraid to speak up on this issue? that's interesting because i have seen plenty of news stories that deal with these topics... oh i'm assuming you mean the mainstream media...like fox and every bloody uk tabloid that runs daily articles on how the 'loony left' are infiltrating society with their wacky plans for world domination. and how new corp owns more than two thirds of every newspaper in australia. and how every second night on australian tv there will be a story about how immigrants and dole bludgers are ruining the country. yes, that media would be really scared to report on these things wouldn't they.

what specific examples do you have that proves that there is an active effort to indoctrinate people into marxism and leftism? what specific ideas are being pursued by companies, universities and government that you find reprehensible and why? i am not being a snarky dick in saying this, i genuinely want to chase this train of thought as i think it is relevant to the discussion.

ok, so part of the reason I didn't want to discuss it is because I simply don't know enough.. but this article I think summarizes the state of the universities here well:http://quillette.com/2017/11/14/academic-freedom-threat-sweden/

I study engineering in Lund and the marxists stickers and "gulag" marks have slowly been growing in density in the city and campus... here there is no right wing mainstream media id say, so to see the other side of things we're forced to youtube etc (and the government want to call Google and Facebook into court for promoting hate speech! https://www.expressen.se/nyheter/ku-ordforanden-oppnar-for-att-kalla-google-till-forhor/) I agree that most people don't agree with the extreme left ideas of equality but the thing is i dont think people realise how far left things are going... I was taught in school about Nazi Germany but not a word about Maoist China or the Soviet Union (I mean not a word on how many people communism killed). I don't believe there is a conspiracy behind it.. I think it has more to do with that is more difficult to see what's wrong with ideas of equality being pushed too far (in comparison to far right ideas).

and yes, here you are afraid to speak about it.. we only have one big "right wing" party which wants to reduce immigration and they are labeled the nazis and racists by the media... when in truth they are barely centrists in their politics (and they where voted by 13% of the population!)

I'll need to do more research to tell you more details.. I mean is not like everything is on fire or anything but is not a good direction!

edit: @Salvatorin I try rlly hard to tell myself not to agree with everything but what can I say, I agree with most of it! I don't think the supa left thing applies to all of the west but certainly parts of it.. and there are much larger problems at hand than these equality games!

 

 

 

this thread was def better 20 pages ago

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on the flip-side his attacks on Scandinavian societies, however, are pure ideological farce & he'll never publicly concede much to left-wing thought/practice, which is one eyed & skewiff

do you live here? he's dead on, is actually worse than he paints it.. atleast in sweden

have you read Judith Butler?

 

a link to a JP approved libertarian web-site isnt very cosmic & doesnt trowel out anything other than one academic condemning an entire system for pursuing the study of Judith Butler

 

her ideas on gender performativity are ignored with a degree of bull-headed ignorance (if you want a closer inspection on notions of "identity"), you dont have to agree with everything she has to say, but to dismiss her entire body of research or condemning including her works in an undergrad course bibliography as an "untenable" position, is shoddy & scholarly politicizing

 

 

 

this thread was def better 20 pages ago

 

 

 

better when your presuppositions werent being more directly challenged?

 

Butler is on the biblio list for European & Middle Eastern prehistory of all things, thats pretty much how i got exposed to her writing, she has some absurd opinions & some illuminating ones too....

 

overall, its a bit extreme (and reactionary) for a tutor to want her excluded entirely from an institution's course where the theme is fascism & by default, power

 

at least let the students read her & make up their own minds or it might appear a tad fascistic, n'est pas?

 

she's not being force fed after all, so for a tutor to act like he's on hunger strike with a Judith Butler feeding tube being forced down his guts is infantile & a form of provocation, bit like a kid taking his toy home indoors to play alone rather than share

 

scuse the edit, all the quotes within quotes gets a bit ott

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you are cylob, I knew it

 

and no, I referred to when tri and I where talking about chocolate milk 20 pages ago

 

edit:

what's extreme is that she's forced to be part of the course material by our university, because

 

The department’s goal, set by the board and approved by the academic board, is that the proportion of female authors must never fall below 40 percent of the reading lists

this applies to all courses regardless of subject

 

here in Lund the goal for 2020 is to have 40% women professors to be hired

 

make of that what you want, but I personally want those who teach the next generation to be the most competent possible.. and to not be chosen on basis of gender/race/whatever because a minority of very noisy people think they are treated unfairly in the (arguably) most fair-treating country in the world.

 

edit2: since you apparently don't see the video I linked, this is part of what the teacher tells the student "to spread opinions, even if they are backed by facts is not something that we do in this university"

 

edit3: to bring back this to topic, this is what will happen with the west if overprotection is allowed to go too far. this is in part what I have learned from jp and, as he says.. "there are much larger problems at hand than playing these equality games"

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mixl2 i hope you’re sitting down for this but check out these news items from today’s papers lol

 

https://apnews.com/0c87e4318bcc4eb9b8e69f9f54c7b889

 

http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-edu-beutner-los-angeles-superintendent-20180430-story.html?outputType=amp&__twitter_impression=true

 

i’m thinking that if you look into this issue it’s a lot different than what peterson will have you think just bc he got triggered at work.

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