Coronavirus COVID-19

[zkom]

3 minutes ago, rhmilo said:

Spoken like someone who hasn't seen Idiocracy.

 

1 minute ago, Satans Little Helper said:

I wouldn't count on it!

The dumb make more children. The majority might win over a "happy" few.

Plus, the orange guy had Covid and still walked away alive. Call that Darwin's mistake, if you will.

O, and btw, the supposedly smart aren't that smart either. We're all dumb shits. I see no reasonable high horse to jump on.

Lol, yeah, I've seen it the Idiocracy and know this thing. But it's pretty likely that human intelligence was driven by major catastrophes where the smarter ones survived because they were able store food and water and cooperate with each other. I mean it's pretty basic survival technique to accept free healthcare for a potentially fatal disease. If you refuse that for some dumb reason then your genes are less likely to carry on. It's not like you have to be super intelligent and mr. smartypants to figure out that maybe it's a good thing to not get some dangerous disease.

Anyway, for humans this isn't particularly interesting, because biological evolution moves at such a glacial pace that our technological and cultural evolution has far outpaced it a few millennia ago already. So I was just making a joke and not trying to have a serious conversation about covid-19's effects on human evolution because they will be absolutely minimal in any which way.

There are interesting examples in the history of evolution where a species has become dumber as a survival strategy, but that can lead to overspecialization and an evolutionary cul-de-sac. Supposedly koalas became dumber over time to save energy from their very low calorie diet.

[Limo]

26 minutes ago, Satans Little Helper said:

O, and btw, the supposedly smart aren't that smart either. We're all dumb shits. I see no reasonable high horse to jump on.

/thread

[dcom]

Humans have existed for about 200,000 years, and they've had to cooperate - even if only inside their own collective - all the time just to survive, to keep themselves and each other alive. Human collectives or individuals within the collectives actively not cooperating to keep themselves and each other alive is a relatively recent phenomenon, and sadly it's fueled by us being able to confabulate things out of thin air, and others supplying the fuel for whatever reasons. The wetware processing power we have has been hijacked by all kinds of unnecessary, needless and even harmful things like religion, superstition, conspiracy theories, and disinformation. A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky dangerous animals and you know it.

Edited May 18, 2021 by dcom

[Thu Zaw]

16 minutes ago, dcom said:

Humans have existed for about 200,000 years, and they've had to cooperate - even if inside their own collective - all the time just to survive, to keep themselves and each other alive. Human collectives not cooperating to keep themselves and each other alive is a relatively recent phenomenon, and sadly it's fueled by us being able to confabulate things out of thin air, and others supplying the fuel for whatever reasons. The processing power we have has been hijacked by all kinds of unnecessary, needless and even harmful things like religion, superstition, conspiracy theories, and disinformation. A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky dangerous animals and you know it.

Interesting thought.

What we understand as our collective (I prefer the words 'pack' or 'tribe') are much larger and less intimate now. Previously, the world was far less densely populated, people travelled from home far less, and trade was much more local. The average person would have encountered and known far fewer people, and from far fewer 'packs' as we do today.

Now, collectives (tribes/packs) are much larger, anonymous, abstract ideas, based on nationality, religion or other cultural identity. Cooperation on such a scale is much less easy to define, control, or understand, and perhaps on a personal level, feel.

 

https://www.oliverscottcurry.com/ this guy is an anthropologist I follow in Twitter who explores morality and the reason for human kindness from a point of view of evolutionary biology. He has some interesting ideas on this topic.

Edited May 18, 2021 by Thu Zaw

[zkom]

13 minutes ago, dcom said:

Humans have existed for about 200,000 years, and they've had to cooperate - even if only inside their own collective - all the time just to survive, to keep themselves and each other alive. Human collectives or individuals within the collectives actively not cooperating to keep themselves and each other alive is a relatively recent phenomenon, and sadly it's fueled by us being able to confabulate things out of thin air, and others supplying the fuel for whatever reasons. The processing power we have has been hijacked by all kinds of unnecessary, needless and even harmful things like religion, superstition, conspiracy theories, and disinformation. A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky dangerous animals and you know it.

As I understand there is a kind of equilibrium between individualism and collectivism in human evolutionary development. Those people that are individualistic tend to reproduce more within their societies but societies that have high levels of individualism don't fair well in competition with societies with high levels of collectivism. So there's this kind of push-pull evolutionary effect that keeps the human societies from turning into something akin to ant colonies but also keeps them from turning into chaotic the strongest takes all competitive societies. 

[dcom]

11 minutes ago, Thu Zaw said:

He has some interesting ideas on this topic.

Thank you for that, will check it out; altruism vs. egoism (and egoistic altruism), empathy vs. apathy are always interesting discussion topics - e.g. the bystander effect - and the inflation and deflation of the individual/self/ego in Western and Eastern societies.

Edited May 18, 2021 by dcom

[dcom]

2 minutes ago, zkom said:

So there's this kind of push-pull evolutionary effect that keeps the human societies from turning into something akin to ant colonies but also keeps them from turning into chaotic the strongest takes all competitive societies. 

I think we're witnessing the rise of many strongman-controlled, winner-take-all societies.

[Thu Zaw]

This is a book on my list to read. it outlines how the Western world uniquely made a switch from Collectivist society to Individualist. It probably has some relevant points. 

[usagi]

On 5/17/2021 at 5:05 AM, BCM said:

 

Bill Gates.wav 1.82 MB · 25 downloads

 

[BCM]

oh yes

[Limo]

23 minutes ago, dcom said:

I think we're witnessing the rise of many strongman-controlled, winner-take-all societies.

Not sure if these societies are winning, however. As far as COVID-19 is concerned these societies aren't doing so great (here I'm not counting China as a winner-take-all society, btw, as despite it being controlled by a strongman it very much takes collective action).

[drome]

There’s a big push in the media to guilt trip people into having the vaccine. If you don’t have it, they say you are selfish. It is in-fact SELFISH to PRESSURISE people to have an EXPERIMENTAL vaccine, created in a matter of months. Who knows what impact this rushed vaccine will have on us. Don’t bow to this abusive coercion, masquerading as kindness.

Edited May 19, 2021 by drome

[brian trageskin]

3 minutes ago, drome said:

There’s a big push in the media to guilt trip people into having the vaccine. If you don’t have it, they say you are selfish. It is in-fact SELFISH to expect people to have an EXPERIMENTAL vaccine, created in a matter of months. Who knows what impact this rushed vaccine will have on us. Don’t bow to this abusive coercion, masquerading as kindness.

 

[ignatius]

12 minutes ago, drome said:

There’s a big push in the media to guilt trip people into having the vaccine. If you don’t have it, they say you are selfish. It is in-fact SELFISH to expect people to have an EXPERIMENTAL vaccine, created in a matter of months. Who knows what impact this rushed vaccine will have on us. Don’t bow to this abusive coercion, masquerading as kindness.

what i'm hearing is they're not only trying to tell you you're selfish but are also saying people who don't get the vaccine are a tinfoil hat wearing paranoid person w/delusions of grandeur. 

you're probably right though.. you're better off taking your chances with the COVID virus. there's no proven cases of anyone having long lasting effects from the virus other than, no boner, penis smaller, lung scarring, brain fog, multi system failure, black mold in the lungs, organ inflammation, heart problems, persistent fatigue, low blood pressure, muscle pain, blood clots leading to strokes, diminished lung capacity, storming the capital, joining a Q cult... 

[Alcofribas]

33 minutes ago, drome said:

is in-fact SELFISH to expect people to have an EXPERIMENTAL vaccine, created in a matter of months.

is this “selfish” tho?

[Limo]

39 minutes ago, drome said:

There’s a big push in the media to guilt trip people into having the vaccine. If you don’t have it, they say you are selfish. It is in-fact SELFISH to expect people to have an EXPERIMENTAL vaccine, created in a matter of months. Who knows what impact this rushed vaccine will have on us. Don’t bow to this abusive coercion, masquerading as kindness.

Nothing experimental about this vaccine. It's 1970s science stuck on some 2010 tech. Very much tried and tested.

And don't get me started on those adenovirus vaccines. That's positively old school.

[ignatius]

japan in the middle of another bad surge of infections as olympics approach. 

[dcom]

1 hour ago, drome said:

It is in-fact SELFISH to expect people to have an EXPERIMENTAL vaccine, created in a matter of months.

The millions, maybe billions of people who want to get vaccinated and get rid of the disease are selfish? The ones who are putting their money where their mouth is by not whining about minor inconveniences or transient side-effects? Those trusting the whole of humanity to pull their weight so we can get back to (relative) normalcy? The health-care workers who have toiled tirelessly caring for people who do not "believe" in COVID-19, patients gasping for breath and dying in agony, alone, while a vaccine is available? The people who volunteered en masse - in numbers many times more than was needed - for the first human trial stages of each vaccine, putting their life on the line for the vaccines to be validated as safe?

I don't think you have a grasp of what selfish - let alone unselfish - means.

Edited May 18, 2021 by dcom

[iococoi]

[ignatius]

3 minutes ago, iococoi said:

"Before you kiss your mother w/that mouth..."

[Satans Little Helper]

2 hours ago, drome said:

There’s a big push in the media to guilt trip people into having the vaccine. If you don’t have it, they say you are selfish. It is in-fact SELFISH to expect people to have an EXPERIMENTAL vaccine, created in a matter of months. Who knows what impact this rushed vaccine will have on us. Don’t bow to this abusive coercion, masquerading as kindness.

It's a government planned zombie apocalypse. It's so obvious when you've put on your tinfoil hat the right way. Don't understand why people don't see it. Bunch of blood sucking capitalist fascists. And communist as well. The worst.

*goes off and listens to some EXPERIMENTAL music way too loud because I'm SELFISH

[Himelstein]

If it is, I think I may still want to be a zombie, instead of a survivor. 

Edited May 18, 2021 by Himelstein

[ignatius]

it's funny that the USA version of Utopia came out at the start of the pandemic and had to have disclaimers about it being a fiction etc.  british version is better imo. USA version is different and sort of gives up the game early on. tells it a bit different. music in the british version is far superior as are several of the key characters. 

 

[Himelstein]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcchicago.com/news/coronavirus/ohio-sees-increase-in-covid-vaccinations-after-1-million-lottery-announcement/2513171/%3famp
 

I’m entered into this haha

[YEK]

So my stepdad thinks that covid was created to bring attention away from Biden's presidency. He also said that the vaccine was made before they released the virus... and other crazy shit but I stopped paying attention to what he was saying. Wtf. He doesn't want the shot, I guess you can't force someone to get it, right. Oh, and we're Canadian.

Edited May 19, 2021 by yekker