How does the World view China these days?

[zlemflolia]

heres what hillary clinton thinks of china

 

 

Edited May 8, 2021 by cyanobacteria

[ignatius]

7 hours ago, cyanobacteria said:

heres what hillary clinton thinks of china

 

 

i mean.. she's not wrong is she?  i don't totally agree w/how she framed the situation a "we tried" and it's all their fault. also china was like the 2nd or 3rd stop right? first businesses went down to mexico then hopped around and landed in china because the labor was cheapest.. so it's not like in the short term it wasn't mutually beneficial to serving greed.. but obviously having some things made in america is a national security issue and might simplify some things. 

 

[Thu Zaw]

In responding to the thread title:

 

A distinction must always be made whether one is discussing the government of a nation or the culture and people of a nation. Hatred of another country's government should never lead you to hate the people of that country. They probably hate their government as much as you do.

 

Another factor to consider is your own ethnocentricity: the human trait of making judgements about a culture other than one's own. One must recognise the cultural bias that comes with viewing another's culture from the perspective of one's own. Human's will always use their own culture as a benchmark against which to make a comparison with others. Can you be objective and impartial? 

 

Conversely, one must recognise that the people in the culture they are viewing are also affected by their own cultural experience, and also hold biases against cultures outside of their own.

 

Next, one has to have a level of compassion for those who have been raised in different cultures to your own; recognise that their traditions, practices, values, etc. cannot be judged against the cultural environment of one's own culture. Can you accept the behaviours of values of others within the context of their own culture, even if those behaviours or values are taboo in your own?

 

Are you cognisant of the effect of propaganda and the pressure of cultural conformity on your own worldview and the worldview of others?

 

Do you have first hand experience of the culture you are critiquing? Do you have a breadth of experience of life outside of your own culture? Are your ideas informed by experience, research, casual observation, or just prejudice?

 

 

A video which really highlights how differently people raised in other cultures are affected by their cultural and political environment. I saw a comment in this thread criticising the Chinese people for not holding their government to account. China is a single-state party and has been for generations. Opposition parties don't exist. Dissent is silenced. The concept of democracy is rarely discussed in schools. It's not part of the collective narrative.

This was a really interesting fly-on-the-wall documentary about introducing Chinese to children to the nature of democracy.

 

The CCP is making a lot of enemies around the world currently. See Taiwan, Philippines, Myanmar, India, Uyghur situation...

Chinese people are as varied as citizens of any other country. 

Edited May 8, 2021 by Thu Zaw

[zlemflolia]

3 hours ago, ignatius said:

i mean.. she's not wrong is she?  i don't totally agree w/how she framed the situation a "we tried" and it's all their fault. also china was like the 2nd or 3rd stop right? first businesses went down to mexico then hopped around and landed in china because the labor was cheapest.. so it's not like in the short term it wasn't mutually beneficial to serving greed.. but obviously having some things made in america is a national security issue and might simplify some things. 

 

shes completely right in her analysis, the bourgeoisie often reveal the truth.  they must, or else they wouldn't be effective.  she knows what's up. she just has the wrong perspective on it as if she needs to stop them

Edited May 8, 2021 by cyanobacteria

[cichlisuite]

lol @ hillary

it's really funny how usa scrambles to put out the fire that is china now. subsidize domestic production growth... of course, the big capital is not going to put a penny into it. the tax payers will, by way of promising jobs which will be payed as low as possible. flol

intel is already lobbying to make a factory in the eu. but of course eu will have to subsidize it, according to their memo. flol

[Cryptowen]

current power rankings for favoured usa vs china popular longterm outcomes:

1. dune prequel everybody goes to space & gets their own planet to fuck around on scenario
2. north america federates into warring tribal states, at least some of which are run by militant eco-cultists scenario
3. madmax ATVs and machine guns collapse/global warming induced global sahara desert scenario
4. china takes over the world but they aren't dicks about it scenario
5. everybody gets UBI & things are just kinda chill i guess scenario
6. guys trying to make virtual reality porn accidentally create the matrix scenario
7. gotta go work 996 shifts in chinese glass factory with no eye protection scenario
8. jeff bezos becomes neofeudal overlord, gotta work in the amazon factory, mandatory marvel movie screenings every weeknight scenario

[Silent Member]

I'll have number 5, please.

Edited May 8, 2021 by Silent Member

[zlemflolia]

1. china advances its means of production decade by decade

2. by 2035 china absorbs the entire global capitalist economy, making america irrelevant

3. by 2040 china achieves socialism a decade ahead of schedule, eliminating professional managerial positions because the workers have been taught to be self organized

4. by 2045 china's socialism is firmly in place

5. on the first day of 2046 china releases a global communist manifesto to teach the rest of the global proletariat to self organize, sending millions of socialist ambassadors worldwide

6. by 2050 the global bourgeoisie has been completely crushed as china has successfully exported its revolution slowly over the decades, and in the final steps in a stronger way.  the chinese military crushes all opposition and puts all the bourgeoisie into prison who resist the proletariat revolution

7. by 2060 global socialism has been achieved

8. by 2065 global socialism has been firmly put into place

9. by 2070 the struggle to achieve communism has begun

...

10. by 2100 communism has been achieved and no more states or money are needed, all property is communal and humanity is finally free of bourgeois oppression

Edited May 8, 2021 by cyanobacteria

[chenGOD]

https://foreignpolicy.com/2021/05/07/china-bhutan-border-villages-security-forces/

China building villages for Chinese residents in a foreign country with no consent from said foreign government. 

[ignatius]

4 hours ago, cyanobacteria said:

1. china advances its means of production decade by decade

2. by 2035 china absorbs the entire global capitalist economy, making america irrelevant

3. by 2040 china achieves socialism a decade ahead of schedule, eliminating professional managerial positions because the workers have been taught to be self organized

4. by 2045 china's socialism is firmly in place

5. on the first day of 2046 china releases a global communist manifesto to teach the rest of the global proletariat to self organize, sending millions of socialist ambassadors worldwide

6. by 2050 the global bourgeoisie has been completely crushed as china has successfully exported its revolution slowly over the decades, and in the final steps in a stronger way.  the chinese military crushes all opposition and puts all the bourgeoisie into prison who resist the proletariat revolution

7. by 2060 global socialism has been achieved

8. by 2065 global socialism has been firmly put into place

9. by 2070 the struggle to achieve communism has begun

...

10. by 2100 communism has been achieved and no more states or money are needed, all property is communal and humanity is finally free of bourgeois oppression

somewhere in there you need to add climate catastrophe forces mass migrations, famines, anarchy.  also, potential for AI and robotics taking over vast swaths of life. at least a few exponential advances in technology in parts of life from medicine, biotech, transportation, power generation etc. 

anticipating the future is a gamble. sometimes it's obvious what will happen or possible to predict a few possible outcomes and hedge your bets. china does have 100 year plans and this is something the USA doesn't do. at least not in any way they want to share with us. 

i suspect a lot of cyberpunk syfy things will happen, sometimes in expected ways and often in surprising ways.  we don't know what future leaders will do, who they will be, what will change and how countries will deal with many many things. 

i think the only safe bet is to invest in high ground and seek out a place a few hundred feet above sea level not in any flood plain. 

edit: i'd also add that when the Gangotri glacier that feeds the Ganges retreats back over the mountain and into china and india's most important river dwindles.. well.. we might see some shit go down. and long before that india will run into water problems. 

Edited May 9, 2021 by ignatius

[brian trageskin]

4 hours ago, cyanobacteria said:

1. china advances its means of production decade by decade

2. by 2035 china absorbs the entire global capitalist economy, making america irrelevant

3. by 2040 china achieves socialism a decade ahead of schedule, eliminating professional managerial positions because the workers have been taught to be self organized

4. by 2045 china's socialism is firmly in place

5. on the first day of 2046 china releases a global communist manifesto to teach the rest of the global proletariat to self organize, sending millions of socialist ambassadors worldwide

6. by 2050 the global bourgeoisie has been completely crushed as china has successfully exported its revolution slowly over the decades, and in the final steps in a stronger way.  the chinese military crushes all opposition and puts all the bourgeoisie into prison who resist the proletariat revolution

7. by 2060 global socialism has been achieved

8. by 2065 global socialism has been firmly put into place

9. by 2070 the struggle to achieve communism has begun

...

10. by 2100 communism has been achieved and no more states or money are needed, all property is communal and humanity is finally free of bourgeois oppression

 

[ignatius]

10 minutes ago, chenGOD said:

https://foreignpolicy.com/2021/05/07/china-bhutan-border-villages-security-forces/

China building villages for Chinese residents in a foreign country with no consent from said foreign government. 

fuck. 

israel can do it why can't china? 

[custom knob]

9 hours ago, cyanobacteria said:

1. china advances its means of production decade by decade

2. by 2035 china absorbs the entire global capitalist economy, making america irrelevant

3. by 2040 china achieves socialism a decade ahead of schedule, eliminating professional managerial positions because the workers have been taught to be self organized

4. by 2045 china's socialism is firmly in place

5. on the first day of 2046 china releases a global communist manifesto to teach the rest of the global proletariat to self organize, sending millions of socialist ambassadors worldwide

6. by 2050 the global bourgeoisie has been completely crushed as china has successfully exported its revolution slowly over the decades, and in the final steps in a stronger way.  the chinese military crushes all opposition and puts all the bourgeoisie into prison who resist the proletariat revolution

7. by 2060 global socialism has been achieved

8. by 2065 global socialism has been firmly put into place

9. by 2070 the struggle to achieve communism has begun

...

10. by 2100 communism has been achieved and no more states or money are needed, all property is communal and humanity is finally free of bourgeois oppression

Crushing people seems to be a necessary part of it

[zlemflolia]

12 minutes ago, custom knob said:

Crushing people seems to be a necessary part of it

what are you talking about

[ignatius]

16 minutes ago, custom knob said:

Crushing people seems to be a necessary part of it

part of everything forever really. 

[Satans Little Helper]

13 hours ago, Cryptowen said:

current power rankings for favoured usa vs china popular longterm outcomes:

1. dune prequel everybody goes to space & gets their own planet to fuck around on scenario

I'd pay to see this happening. Space expansion now please!

[Thu Zaw]

 

[prdctvsm]

[auxien]

https://www.wsj.com/articles/china-to-ease-limits-on-births-allowing-couples-to-have-three-children-11622447583?mod=hp_lead_pos1

Quote

China said Monday that it would allow all married couples to have as many as three children and provide government support for education and child rearing, a move that comes as Beijing struggles to reverse a worsening demographic situation that presents a host of social and economic challenges.

The shift comes more than five years after Beijing ended its decades long “one-child policy” to let all couples have two children, and follows the May 11 release of census figures showing China’s population on the cusp of a historic turning point after years of rapid growth.

The announcement came after a Monday meeting of the Politburo, the Chinese Communist Party’s top decision-making body, chaired by leader Xi Jinping—a signal of concern over the demographic situation at the country’s highest levels. State-run Xinhua News Agency said the change would “improve the country’s population structure, actively implement the national strategy to respond to the aging population, and maintain the country’s demographic advantage.”

only 5 years after changing the one-child policy they've upped it again...they're obviously very worried about their future of possibly a billion aging people over the next decades just drawing on the system.

America (Japan is the worst apparently, and other countries i'm sure) has been openly worried about the same for years of course.

https://www.census.gov/library/stories/2018/03/graying-america.html

Quote

Although declining fertility plays a role, the driving force behind America’s aging is the baby boomers. As one of the largest generations in the country, boomers leave a substantial imprint on the population. They swelled the ranks of the young when they were born and then the workforce as they entered adulthood.

Now, boomers will expand the number of older adults as they age. Starting in 2030, when all boomers will be older than 65, older Americans will make up 21 percent of the population, up from 15 percent today.

By 2060, nearly one in four Americans will be 65 years and older, the number of 85-plus will triple, and the country will add a half million centenarians.

...

We project three-and-a-half working-age adults for every older person eligible for Social Security in 2020. By 2060, that number is expected to fall to two-and-a-half working-age adults for every older person.

i'm beginning to see a new perspective on why zombie stories have been so popular the last decade or so...the aging (undying) growing and growing, feeding on the living. 

the growing human population as a whole is the bigger problem imo, but this huge percentage jump in the aging over our lifetimes is more eventful than i think many recognize. 

[ignatius]

i read another story yesterday about declining birth rates and draining rural places that pour into cities.. it's happening everywhere. 

"the long slide"

https://archive.is/855QG

Quote

 

Fewer babies’ cries. More abandoned homes. Toward the middle of this century, as deaths start to exceed births, changes will come that are hard to fathom.

 

it's an interesting read. here's a few paragraphs:

All over the world, countries are confronting population stagnation and a fertility bust, a dizzying reversal unmatched in recorded history that will make first-birthday parties a rarer sight than funerals, and empty homes a common eyesore.

Maternity wards are already shutting down in Italy. Ghost cities are appearing in northeastern China. Universities in South Korea can’t find enough students, and in Germany, hundreds of thousands of properties have been razed, with the land turned into parks.

Like an avalanche, the demographic forces — pushing toward more deaths than births — seem to be expanding and accelerating. Though some countries continue to see their populations grow, especially in Africa, fertility rates are falling nearly everywhere else. Demographers now predict that by the latter half of the century or possibly earlier, the global population will enter a sustained decline for the first time.

A planet with fewer people could ease pressure on resources, slow the destructive impact of climate change and reduce household burdens for women. But the census announcements this month from China and the United States, which showed the slowest rates of population growth in decades for both countries, also point to hard-to-fathom adjustments.

 

The strain of longer lives and low fertility, leading to fewer workers and more retirees, threatens to upend how societies are organized — around the notion that a surplus of young people will drive economies and help pay for the old. It may also require a reconceptualization of family and nation. Imagine entire regions where everyone is 70 or older. Imagine governments laying out huge bonuses for immigrants and mothers with lots of children. Imagine a gig economy filled with grandparents and Super Bowl ads promoting procreation.

[auxien]

1 hour ago, ignatius said:

i read another story yesterday about declining birth rates and draining rural places that pour into cities.. it's happening everywhere. 

"the long slide"

https://archive.is/855QG

it's an interesting read. here's a few paragraphs:

All over the world, countries are confronting population stagnation and a fertility bust, a dizzying reversal unmatched in recorded history that will make first-birthday parties a rarer sight than funerals, and empty homes a common eyesore.

Maternity wards are already shutting down in Italy. Ghost cities are appearing in northeastern China. Universities in South Korea can’t find enough students, and in Germany, hundreds of thousands of properties have been razed, with the land turned into parks.

Like an avalanche, the demographic forces — pushing toward more deaths than births — seem to be expanding and accelerating. Though some countries continue to see their populations grow, especially in Africa, fertility rates are falling nearly everywhere else. Demographers now predict that by the latter half of the century or possibly earlier, the global population will enter a sustained decline for the first time.

A planet with fewer people could ease pressure on resources, slow the destructive impact of climate change and reduce household burdens for women. But the census announcements this month from China and the United States, which showed the slowest rates of population growth in decades for both countries, also point to hard-to-fathom adjustments.

The strain of longer lives and low fertility, leading to fewer workers and more retirees, threatens to upend how societies are organized — around the notion that a surplus of young people will drive economies and help pay for the old. It may also require a reconceptualization of family and nation. Imagine entire regions where everyone is 70 or older. Imagine governments laying out huge bonuses for immigrants and mothers with lots of children. Imagine a gig economy filled with grandparents and Super Bowl ads promoting procreation.

thanks for linking that, it is a good read. the talk of China's population being basically cut in half over the next ~100 years is crazy. crazy good imo, shrinking populations are overall a good thing, but just crazy to imagine the cities and countries being so empty compared to now. i think the outro sums up the reasons why:

Quote

Anna Parolini tells a common story. She left her small hometown in northern Italy to find better job opportunities . Now 37, she lives with her boyfriend in Milan and has put her desire to have children on hold.

She is afraid her salary of less than 2,000 euros a month would not be enough for a family, and her parents still live where she grew up.

“I don’t have anyone here who could help me,” she said. “Thinking of having a child now would make me gasp.”

 

[prdctvsm]

^#empty cities in china

[dingformung]

The world is dreamt and dreamed of. Maps are images of memory, which in turn is narrative and is constantly transmitted to entities lying between the humanly perceivable units of time, which then react accordingly and make the world manifest in this way or in a slightly or strongly changed manner.

[chronical]

10 minutes ago, dingformung said:

The world is dreamt and dreamed of. Maps are images of memory, which in turn is narrative and is constantly transmitted to entities lying between the humanly perceivable units of time, which then react accordingly and make the world manifest in this way or in a slightly or strongly changed manner.

Such is the China way!

[prdctvsm]