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Israeli-Palestinian conflict


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8 hours ago, drillkicker said:

Wow, it really sucks that all their neighbors just started hating them for some reason.

True, but when Israel was founded said neighbors started organizing pogroms against THEIR OWN Jewish population for no particular reason, thereby driving people who had been living in these countries for almost two millennia to flee to the militant Zionist state that had just been founded and that originally this Jewish population had little sympathy or support for.

 

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1 hour ago, KovalainenFanBoy said:

so where's eugene

Oh god no


at first i was naive in thinking that he was just trolling but actually he was a major prick

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3 minutes ago, auxien said:

surprised we haven't solved this yet, thread's been up for over a day. chop chop IDM nerdz. 

You’re right. This thread is nowhere near constructive enough.

I’ll start: Israel should be wiped off the map. So should the people who think that’s a good idea.

Problem solved.

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9 hours ago, rhmilo said:

True, but when Israel was founded said neighbors started organizing pogroms against THEIR OWN Jewish population for no particular reason, thereby driving people who had been living in these countries for almost two millennia to flee to the militant Zionist state that had just been founded and that originally this Jewish population had little sympathy or support for.

Yeah, I'm still not sympathetic.  Sorry.

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Yeah my last post was all over the place!

I don't know why I said 'some reason' as I know the exact reason.

total badgerbonkers

 

 

 

 

Edited by beer badger
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it really pays to spend a lot of time digging into the history. it is such a complex and dynamic series of events, over the last 100 years, over there. and this is a prime case for exercising the eminently important practice of cross-referencing information. read how both sides view the same events. it is one of the most pronounced instances of conflicting information in the modern world. cross-referencing information is how you learn spins, learn to recognize language patterns that enable misleading propaganda, and learn journalistic practices that evince proper skepticism. you look at two articles that cover the same story, side by side, and wonder how they can be so different, and that draws you into the mechanics of information, propaganda, and journalism.

Edited by very honest
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Not really, cos of condoms & belligerent sti's, the original prophylactic form of social distancing

Hang on, fk, Jews & Palestinians? Put condoms over gun barrels. Nobel Peace prize imminent, thanks, yes owe it all to this thread, sorted

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it really pays to spend a lot of time digging into the history. it is such a complex and dynamic series of events, over the last 100 years, over there. and this is a prime case for exercising the eminently important practice of cross-referencing information. read how both sides view the same events. it is one of the most pronounced instances of conflicting information in the modern world. cross-referencing information is how you learn spins, learn to recognize language patterns that enable misleading propaganda, and learn journalistic practices that evince proper skepticism. you look at two articles that cover the same story, side by side, and wonder how they can be so different, and that draws you into the mechanics of information, propaganda, and journalism.

New York Times runs stories often reading “Palestinian insurgents kill 3 Israelis.”


you get to paragraph four and they FINALLY say 16 Palestinians were also killed. 5 of whom were civilians and 11 of whom were defending against the 3 Israelis MILITANTS attacking them

this kind of story happens every week in “the paper of record”
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2 hours ago, dr lopez said:


New York Times runs stories often reading “Palestinian insurgents kill 3 Israelis.”


you get to paragraph four and they FINALLY say 16 Palestinians were also killed. 5 of whom were civilians and 11 of whom were defending against the 3 Israelis MILITANTS attacking them

this kind of story happens every week in “the paper of record”

There was a fascinating book by a Dutch journalist (Joris Luyendijk) about this about ten years ago. He explained it by the Israelis having very slick PR departments that not only take Western journalists by the hand and show them exactly what they want them to see but also that Israeli's talk to Western journalists in a language that they understand, making it much more likely that their views are being put across.

The Palestinians, on the other hand, have no such thing. They can't afford to drive Western journalists around and when they give press conferences they're held in abominable English and using language that Westerners can't understand or feel sympathy for*.

The result is that even Western journalists who sympathize with the Palestinians (and there very well may be a lot of them, although maybe not in the US) find it very difficult to get their viewpoints across. The Israeli viewpoint pretty much is the default.

 

 

* remember "the mother of all battles"? In Arabic, that's apparently a normal figure of speech for "a big battle". In English - but also in Dutch and I imagine in other Western languages as well - it just sounds ridiculous.

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9 hours ago, dr lopez said:


New York Times runs stories often reading “Palestinian insurgents kill 3 Israelis.”


you get to paragraph four and they FINALLY say 16 Palestinians were also killed. 5 of whom were civilians and 11 of whom were defending against the 3 Israelis MILITANTS attacking them

this kind of story happens every week in “the paper of record”

i don't recall the times using the term insurgents to refer to palestinians, but maybe you can prove me wrong. it's true that israel has used harsh measures on the palestinians numerous times, and i'm not hear to defend that. it's also true that palestinians have engaged in attacks deliberately intended for random israeli civilians many times, and i don't agree with people who support such attacks.

i like the times, and i think it's filled with noble, careful, incisive people, many of whom are at the top of the field of journalism, and who have internalized the practices of skepticism and accuracy, like cross-referencing information, fact-checking, vetting sources, stating source attribution in articles, and chosing words carefully.

Edited by very honest
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