Atop Posted June 18, 2009 Share Posted June 18, 2009 Seems like common sense to me.... Playing out live and making it interesting is the least a talent could do... Writing amazing music isn't the most common ability for most musicians... We here at WATMM are an analogue of what society as a whole wished it were more like... All we need is food, drink, toilets, stair masters, drugs, and sex to come out of our computers so as to never need to leave.... the only exception being music makin' time! or book readin' time... or movie watchin' time.... or fappin' time... so many distractions... technology breeds impatience Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest SecondaryCell Posted June 18, 2009 Share Posted June 18, 2009 I also could write a book about this topic, but I don't have the time right now so here are a few statements off the top of my head: - MP3, internet and home computer recording technologies have opened Pandora's box. - If everyone can make music then music makers become less unique. - When everyone can sound great then sounding great will not be enough. - Traditional labels and recording studios previously acted as filters - only if you were unique, extraordinary, or marketable could you hope to have the equipment and distribution to become noticed on a large scale. - Does giving away your music create the perception that it must be worthless? Also, regarding dumping your job and living cheap to allow yourself undisturbed time to create music - if you are young, single and have no dependents then I salute you! The following video "Life and Music" sums it up nicely: If you are married and/or have children then accept the fact that your life is not about you anymore (at least for a long while). Make music your hobby, play with your kids, support your wife, and have a better life. /soapbox Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest SecondaryCell Posted June 18, 2009 Share Posted June 18, 2009 Forgot to add: - If 99% of everything is shit, and there is a hundred thousand times more artists & musicians due to new technologies - then why is there not a hundred thousand times more brilliant, extraordinary music? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chenGOD Posted June 18, 2009 Share Posted June 18, 2009 I also could write a book about this topic, but I don't have the time right now so here are a few statements off the top of my head: 1. MP3, internet and home computer recording technologies have opened Pandora's box. 2. If everyone can make music then music makers become less unique. 3. When everyone can sound great then sounding great will not be enough. 4. Traditional labels and recording studios previously acted as filters - only if you were unique, extraordinary, or marketable could you hope to have the equipment and distribution to become noticed on a large scale. 5. Does giving away your music create the perception that it must be worthless? 1 - what box has it opened? It's caused corporations/labels to rethink distribution methods, and consumers to reconsider how much they will spend on music. 2. - not everyone can make music, nor does everyone have the desire. Music makers are still unique. Maybe it has placed more importance on playing an actual instrument? 3. - of the people who do make music thanks to new technology, even fewer sound good. 4. - marketable. mainstream labels have always been about marketable. 5. - if people were going to get it for free via filesharing anyways (see your point 1) then absolutely not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hahathhat Posted June 18, 2009 Share Posted June 18, 2009 to brandi b: i have a private journal where i write loads like that. try it regarding music: i usually can't be arsed when it comes to promotion. there are thousands of people all working harder and/or willing to stoop lower than me. too many other things and ideas in my life i need to care and feed for. i get maybe 2-4 hours a day average for music before i get pulled into something else or i get distracted by something shiny, and it's better to spend those hours in Cubase than on MySpace. i feel too many people get latched onto promoting their music, rather than making it. there are a lot of children that want to be astronauts, because it's romantic and glamorous. they lose interest when they find out it's largely checklists, drudgery, hard training, and difficult math. the ones that make it simply have a love for difficult math. regarding watmm: WATMM is its own thing, a recreational timesink somewhere between writing (text) and my xbox. i've been trying to cut back. it's good if i want to figure out how to get some sort of reverb or discuss my poop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandi_B Posted June 19, 2009 Author Share Posted June 19, 2009 @ atop - stair masters with all that sounds dangerous :/ ...but I think you've made some fair points. ANd yes it seems like common sense, but it isn't really. @ secondary cell : When everyone can sound great then sounding great will not be enough. What will be enough then? - Does giving away your music create the perception that it must be worthless? I think in many ways it does. In other ways it may make you seem confident if you've already sold your music. But this is one of the most crucial things that i just can't wrap my head around. - If 99% of everything is shit, and there is a hundred thousand times more artists & musicians due to new technologies - then why is there not a hundred thousand times more brilliant, extraordinary music? great question! i like it. i dont know the answer, but i like it. maybe there needs to be a quality control system put in place somehow. @ chen 2. - not everyone can make music, nor does everyone have the desire. Music makers are still unique. Maybe it has placed more importance on playing an actual instrument? I like this too. That's something i've wondered as I was a pianist, and guitarist before i ever touched a synthesizer. I don't know though. Look at guitar hero. There's competitions that are basically becoming liek the new battle of the bands guitar hero. 5. - if people were going to get it for free via filesharing anyways (see your point 1) then absolutely not. this is something i have a hard time with. i fully support file sharing, but there is a buck being made from advertisements on the torrent sites end, which doesn't bug me so much now but what if they start putting ads in your music like live365 does? i don't know. I guess that's why you should host it on your own site, but still tis gonna end up on torrent sites eventually. Maybe that's paranoia speaking (on my end). @ hat I have journal and it helps me very much. but this is something that i wanted to share. I didn't spend a long time editing and writing up outlines.. Sure it would've been more understandable but i just wanted to bounce it off other people. I figured it fit watmm due to the diverse quality of threads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Glitchy Posted June 20, 2009 Share Posted June 20, 2009 an entire box of barbecue shapes. you care because I do Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneToThirtySix Posted June 20, 2009 Share Posted June 20, 2009 What was the thesis statement? I got lost. More than once. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandi_B Posted July 9, 2009 Author Share Posted July 9, 2009 So Trent Reznor of all people just more or less responded to this rant, I'm trying to find a link instead of the email i got. Remarkably positive, considering who it's coming from :/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandi_B Posted July 9, 2009 Author Share Posted July 9, 2009 From the nin message board: http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183 (disclaimer) This was written on a bumpy Euro-bus ride across the wilderness - may ramble a bit but I think the point gets across. TR I posted a message on Twitter yesterday stating I thought The Beastie Boys and TopSpin Media "got it right" regarding how to sell music in this day and age. Here's a link to their store: [illcommunication.beastieboys.com] Shortly thereafter, I got some responses from people stating the usual "yeah, if you're an established artist - what if you're just trying to get heard?" argument. In an interview I did recently this topic came up and I'll reiterate what I said here. If you are an unknown / lesser-known artist trying to get noticed / established: * Establish your goals. What are you trying to do / accomplish? If you are looking for mainstream super-success (think Lady GaGa, Coldplay, U2, Justin Timberlake) - your best bet in my opinion is to look at major labels and prepare to share all revenue streams / creative control / music ownership. To reach that kind of critical mass these days your need old-school marketing muscle and that only comes from major labels. Good luck with that one. If you're forging your own path, read on. * Forget thinking you are going to make any real money from record sales. Make your record cheaply (but great) and GIVE IT AWAY. As an artist you want as many people as possible to hear your work. Word of mouth is the only true marketing that matters. To clarify: Parter with a TopSpin or similar or build your own website, but what you NEED to do is this - give your music away as high-quality DRM-free MP3s. Collect people's email info in exchange (which means having the infrastructure to do so) and start building your database of potential customers. Then, offer a variety of premium packages for sale and make them limited editions / scarce goods. Base the price and amount available on what you think you can sell. Make the packages special - make them by hand, sign them, make them unique, make them something YOU would want to have as a fan. Make a premium download available that includes high-resolution versions (for sale at a reasonable price) and include the download as something immediately available with any physical purchase. Sell T-shirts. Sell buttons, posters... whatever. Don't have a TopSpin as a partner? Use Amazon for your transactions and fulfillment. [www.amazon.com] Use TuneCore to get your music everywhere. [www.tunecore.com] Have a realistic idea of what you can expect to make from these and budget your recording appropriately. The point is this: music IS free whether you want to believe that or not. Every piece of music you can think of is available free right now a click away. This is a fact - it sucks as the musician BUT THAT'S THE WAY IT IS (for now). So... have the public get what they want FROM YOU instead of a torrent site and garner good will in the process (plus build your database). The Beastie Boys' site offers everything you could possibly want in the formats you would want it in - available right from them, right now. The prices they are charging are more than you should be charging - they are established and you are not. Think this through. The database you are amassing should not be abused, but used to inform people that are interested in what you do when you have something going on - like a few shows, or a tour, or a new record, or a webcast, etc. Have your MySpace page, but get a site outside MySpace - it's dying and reads as cheap / generic. Remove all Flash from your website. Remove all stupid intros and load-times. MAKE IT SIMPLE TO NAVIGATE AND EASY TO FIND AND HEAR MUSIC (but don't autoplay). Constantly update your site with content - pictures, blogs, whatever. Give people a reason to return to your site all the time. Put up a bulletin board and start a community. Engage your fans (with caution!) Make cheap videos. Film yourself talking. Play shows. Make interesting things. Get a Twitter account. Be interesting. Be real. Submit your music to blogs that may be interested. NEVER CHASE TRENDS. Utilize the multitude of tools available to you for very little cost of any - Flickr / YouTube / Vimeo / SoundCloud / Twitter etc. If you don't know anything about new media or how people communicate these days, none of this will work. The role of an independent musician these days requires a mastery of first hand use of these tools. If you don't get it - find someone who does to do this for you. If you are waiting around for the phone to ring or that A & R guy to show up at your gig - good luck, you're going to be waiting a while. Hope this helps, and I'll scour responses for intelligent comments I can respond to. TR TopSpin Media info: [topspinmedia.com] ** quick update: Thanks for the insightful comments already - when I get a moment (and a reliable internet connection) I'll respond to some of your very valid points. Please keep in mind - these were just some thoughts I quickly wrote down and posted and not meant to be a complete guide by any means. I've neglected to get into publishing and some other things. I'll update pretty soon. Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/09/2009 09:55AM by trent_reznor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandi_B Posted July 9, 2009 Author Share Posted July 9, 2009 I just wanted to add that i really do not like twitter in the least. I also can't tell who's worse at quickly organizing their thoughts, he or I. Either way I think I am more confused now with what to do with music. I'm just gonna start making acoustic finger style with dnb bass and break beats, followed by breaking my guitar at the end of every set. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vamos scorcho Posted July 9, 2009 Share Posted July 9, 2009 hey brandi b, can i hear your album (the one you mentioned here), get a myspace link or something? also a link for EKT? great thread. these are some things i've been thinking about lately, in relation to the whole "where do i go from this 'album' i've created, one that i think has some brilliance in it, whether or not a single other human being has acknowledged it yet" thing. i'm thinking about mailing demos to sending orbs, mu-ziq, and sonig (mouse on mars label). but i can't seem to convince myself that i have any chance, considering i've only had three other people, one of them a close friend of mine, and one my mom, say anything good about my music. that said i think my music is great (lol). i'm narcissistic like that. i've probably listened to my own album more than any other album. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Adjective Posted July 9, 2009 Share Posted July 9, 2009 very good response from trent, sounds like he knows what's up and he should Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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