jules Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 yea only poor people would notice that. good call. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delet... Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 haha so it annoys everybody, score a sore point to me .. yae Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oscillik Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 osx is a million times easier to use than pc. and android based their os off of osx no? Android runs a Linux based kernel, so nope. Mac OS X is a Mach based Kernel and too bad when your hardware stops getting updated oS patches. But rich ppl wouldn't notice that would they. what? Android 2.3 runs Linux kernel 2.6.35.7 it receives updates. don't know what you're trying to refer to here. i've no idea what happens with the iOS releases, whether it's kernel has parity with Mac OS X Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaini Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 osx is a million times easier to use than pc. and android based their os off of osx no? Android runs a Linux based kernel, so nope. Mac OS X is a Mach based Kernel and mach is linux based. please try and base your opinions on fact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delet... Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 osx is a million times easier to use than pc. and android based their os off of osx no? Android runs a Linux based kernel, so nope. Mac OS X is a Mach based Kernel and too bad when your hardware stops getting updated oS patches. But rich ppl wouldn't notice that would they. what? Android 2.3 runs Linux kernel 2.6.35.7 it receives updates. don't know what you're trying to refer to here. i've no idea what happens with the iOS releases, whether it's kernel has parity with Mac OS X i think you missed the bus on the topic flow bro. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oscillik Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 osx is a million times easier to use than pc. and android based their os off of osx no? Android runs a Linux based kernel, so nope. Mac OS X is a Mach based Kernel and mach is linux based. please try and base your opinions on fact. it is my understanding that Mach is actually BSD based, not Linux based and Mach is a microkernel, whereas Linux is a monolithic kernel. quite different Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaini Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 ...and BSD is (or was, originally) a unix variant with a more secure user/filesystem. to this day you can drop out to a command prompt on OS X and every linux command you can imagine within reason will work. every bash script you can write within reason will also work. so practically speaking, if you know bash, you know OS X at its most basic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jules Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 I love the word monolith. so yea I hope jobs doesn't die in 6 months. I don't want boxing day bumping this thread in august. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oscillik Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 ...and BSD is (or was, originally) a unix variant with a more secure user/filesystem. schoolboy error there UNIX is not Linux. i say again, Mach is a microkernel. Linux is a monolithic kernel. very different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaini Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 ...and BSD is (or was, originally) a unix variant with a more secure user/filesystem. schoolboy error there UNIX is not Linux. i say again, Mach is a microkernel. Linux is a monolithic kernel. very different. where did i say that UNIX is linux? the syntax is the same on the most part (and i have experience of both, starting with XENIX in 1992 or thereabouts). as regards microkernel/monolithic kernel, do you think when someone turns the ignition key in a car, they're wondering if the engine is a standard piston engine or a wankel engine? user experience is everything. you are incredibly condescending. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oscillik Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 ...and BSD is (or was, originally) a unix variant with a more secure user/filesystem. schoolboy error there UNIX is not Linux. i say again, Mach is a microkernel. Linux is a monolithic kernel. very different. where did i say that UNIX is linux? the syntax is the same on the most part. as regards microkernel/monolithic kernel, do you think when someone turns the ignition key in a car, they're wondering if the engine is a standard piston engine or a wankel engine? user experience is everything. you are incredibly condescending. i may be condescending, but at least i'm condescending and correct whereas you're just condescending and wrong, as per the following and mach is linux based. please try and base your opinions on fact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaini Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 actually, i'm not. Mac OS X (pronounced /ˈmæk ˌoʊ ˌɛs ˈtɛn/ mak oh es ten)[6] is a series of Unix-based operating systems and graphical user interfaces developed, marketed, and sold by Apple Inc. Since 2002, Mac OS X has been included with all new Macintosh computer systems. It is the successor to Mac OS 9, released in 1999, the final release of the "classic" Mac OS, which had been Apple's primary operating system since 1984. Mac OS X, whose X is the Roman numeral for 10 and is a prominent part of its brand identity, is a Unix-based graphical operating system,[7] built on technologies developed at NeXT between the second half of the 1980s and Apple's purchase of the company in late 1996. From its sixth release, Mac OS X v10.5 "Leopard" and onward, every release of Mac OS X gained UNIX 03 certification while running on Intel processors. source for [7]: http://images.apple.com/macosx/pdf/L355785A_UNIX_TB.pdf edit: yeah, linux/unix. for all intents and purposes they're the same unless you're a coder. yawn. i'm more right than you :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chenGOD Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 OS X is actually an OS called Darwin which you can read about there. Mach is not linux based, sorry kaini. Mach is the kernel developed to replace the older kernel in BSD variants of UNIX. However I'm not a CS guy, so I only have a rudimentary understanding of this whole thing. Lots of handset developers probably designed their user interfaces off the iOS user interface though....it's intuitive and easy to understand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oscillik Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 actually, i'm not. Mac OS X (pronounced /ˈmæk ˌoʊ ˌɛs ˈtɛn/ mak oh es ten)[6] is a series of Unix-based operating systems and graphical user interfaces developed, marketed, and sold by Apple Inc. Since 2002, Mac OS X has been included with all new Macintosh computer systems. It is the successor to Mac OS 9, released in 1999, the final release of the "classic" Mac OS, which had been Apple's primary operating system since 1984. Mac OS X, whose X is the Roman numeral for 10 and is a prominent part of its brand identity, is a Unix-based graphical operating system,[7] built on technologies developed at NeXT between the second half of the 1980s and Apple's purchase of the company in late 1996. From its sixth release, Mac OS X v10.5 "Leopard" and onward, every release of Mac OS X gained UNIX 03 certification while running on Intel processors. source for [7]: http://images.apple.com/macosx/pdf/L355785A_UNIX_TB.pdf edit: yeah, linux/unix. for all intents and purposes they're the same unless you're a coder. i'm more right than you :P is a series of UNIX based operating systems the word UNIX keeps getting used a lot there. and you are wrong. Linux and UNIX are NOT the same at all, and not just to coders. Linux, or to use it's proper term GNU/Linux is a free (as in beer) operating system. UNIX is not free as in beer. you are wrong, and you just don't want to admit that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chenGOD Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 LINUX can be considered like UNIX though, because it aims towards POSIX compliance. For all intents and purposes thy are the same, but Linux is a clone which came well after the original UNIXes were developed, including BSD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oscillik Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 LINUX can be considered like UNIX though, because it aims towards POSIX compliance. For all intents and purposes thy are the same, but Linux is a clone which came well after the original UNIXes were developed, including BSD. again, for all intents and purposes they are not the same, due in large part to the fact that UNIX is not a free operating system, whereas GNU/Linux is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaini Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 the word UNIX keeps getting used a lot there. and you are wrong. Linux and UNIX are NOT the same at all, and not just to coders. Linux, or to use it's proper term GNU/Linux is a free (as in beer) operating system. UNIX is not free as in beer. that is stallmanesque semantics. i'm man enough to admit when i'm wrong, but my point that you can drop out to a command prompt and use top, grep, cp, make or gcc (technically part of the GNU compiler collection, yes, i know), vi or emacs (technically part of third-party software that is bundled, yes i know) or any of that other good stuff - it still stands. from the user experience perspective, OSX is a linux or unix system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chenGOD Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 LINUX can be considered like UNIX though, because it aims towards POSIX compliance. For all intents and purposes thy are the same, but Linux is a clone which came well after the original UNIXes were developed, including BSD. again, for all intents and purposes they are not the same, due in large part to the fact that UNIX is not a free operating system, whereas GNU/Linux is. If one licenses UNIX, then one may put it to use in exactly the same manner as Linux. If the license is the only thing that's different, they are, for all intents and purposes, the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oscillik Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 the word UNIX keeps getting used a lot there. and you are wrong. Linux and UNIX are NOT the same at all, and not just to coders. Linux, or to use it's proper term GNU/Linux is a free (as in beer) operating system. UNIX is not free as in beer. that is stallmanesque semantics. i'm man enough to admit when i'm wrong, but my point that you can drop out to a command prompt and use top, grep, cp, make or gcc (technically part of the GNU compiler collection, yes, i know), vi or emacs (technically part of third-party software that is bundled, yes i know) or any of that other good stuff - it still stands. from the user experience perspective, OSX is a linux or unix system. so are you there admitting that factually Mac OS X is not Linux based, but to people who have no idea of the background of the operating systems it would appear as though it is? if so, i can get behind that. if you're still clinging on to your initially wrong statement that Mac OS X is Linux, then sorry, but you're wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaini Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 the word UNIX keeps getting used a lot there. and you are wrong. Linux and UNIX are NOT the same at all, and not just to coders. Linux, or to use it's proper term GNU/Linux is a free (as in beer) operating system. UNIX is not free as in beer. that is stallmanesque semantics. i'm man enough to admit when i'm wrong, but my point that you can drop out to a command prompt and use top, grep, cp, make or gcc (technically part of the GNU compiler collection, yes, i know), vi or emacs (technically part of third-party software that is bundled, yes i know) or any of that other good stuff - it still stands. from the user experience perspective, OSX is a linux or unix system. so are you there admitting that factually Mac OS X is not Linux based, but to people who have no idea of the background of the operating systems it would appear as though it is? if so, i can get behind that. if you're still clinging on to your initially wrong statement that Mac OS X is Linux, then sorry, but you're wrong. no, i am saying that it's unix-based, but to 99% of people the difference is negligible. to the other 1% of people which includes richard stallman, oscillik, and a handful of slashdot posters, it's tremendously important. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oscillik Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 the word UNIX keeps getting used a lot there. and you are wrong. Linux and UNIX are NOT the same at all, and not just to coders. Linux, or to use it's proper term GNU/Linux is a free (as in beer) operating system. UNIX is not free as in beer. that is stallmanesque semantics. i'm man enough to admit when i'm wrong, but my point that you can drop out to a command prompt and use top, grep, cp, make or gcc (technically part of the GNU compiler collection, yes, i know), vi or emacs (technically part of third-party software that is bundled, yes i know) or any of that other good stuff - it still stands. from the user experience perspective, OSX is a linux or unix system. so are you there admitting that factually Mac OS X is not Linux based, but to people who have no idea of the background of the operating systems it would appear as though it is? if so, i can get behind that. if you're still clinging on to your initially wrong statement that Mac OS X is Linux, then sorry, but you're wrong. no, i am saying that it's unix-based, but to 99% of people the difference is negligible. to the other 1% of people which includes richard stallman, oscillik, and a handful of slashdot posters, it's tremendously important. it only matters to me when i'm stating facts, and then being called out as being wrong by someone who was actually wrong themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chenGOD Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Christ don't bring Stallman and his smelly hippy sentiments into the picture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaini Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 pissing contest. that is all i gotta say. you're misinterpreting the reason people develop operating systems to score points. linus developed a MINIX clone which was suited to x86/68k architecures, nothing more. everything else followed from that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oscillik Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 pissing contest. that is all. there's one thing about my personality, which is: if i know factual information, i will defend that factual information until proven otherwise. if someone (yourself) calls me out as being wrong on something that i know to be factually correct, i will defend my position completely. sorry you got in the way of my condescension but it does come out full force when someone challenges something that i know to be true. while i will concede that to the lay person, UNIX and Linux would appear to be the same, technically and factually they are not. and since my original statement was in response to the question "and android based their os off of osx no?", my statement was factually correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaini Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 in response to the question "and android based their os off of osx no?", my statement was factually correct. android is linux-based. OSX is unix-based. the linux kernel was originally a recreation of the unix kernel (or the MINIX kernel, to be precise) which doesn't have the commercial license that unix does. GNU/linux is the linux kernel i mentioned in the previous line with additional tools which turn it into a usable OS. X is a GUI which overlays over any of those kernels. GNOME and KDE are refinements on X which apply a particular look and feel to applications running within the X windowing system. etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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