politics, movements, global concerns and other things i've never had any interest in.

[Meadows and Labyrinths]

i've been thinking about this Occupy movement lately. a friend of mine is really super into it and is knitting scarves and blankets, etc to take up to D.C. sometime soon. whenever she talks about it, i just kind of try to steer the conversation elsewhere because i'm like oil and water when it comes to things of that nature. admittedly, i don't really know what it's entirely about, and whenever i took an ear to listen, it seemed confusing and anyone talking about it didn't seem like they had any real facts or clear goals about what they wanted to accomplish.

 

when my friend was talking about it today, i just said something like "i don't know much about it, i'm too busy working my ass off." and that's true. i work 60 hours a week at two jobs. i have my own place in a beautiful historic town. i make an honest living and i keep to myself. i'm working on eventually opening up a tee shirt store nearby. i couldn't give a fuck less about some hippies camping outside in the middle of a city somewhere.

 

i think my main point of bringing this up to watmm is just to vent a little. the thing that really irks me is the fact that my Occupy friend doesn't even have a job. what right does anyone without a job have to protest? you aren't contributing in any way to any facet of humankind whatsoever, except to bitch. which is what i'm doing right now.

 

thank you.

[Braintree]

Being unemployed is actually a huge part of the movement. You should probably read the "we are the foundation" thread.

[chenGOD]

Must resist - too many term papers to write....

[Guest kokeboka]

Being unemployed is actually a huge part of the movement.

 

 

Exactly. There will always be hypocrites in every protest, but that doesn't make this one less pertinent.

 

Although, I'll agree with you that these protests may not be the best way to hurt those responsible. Come election day, everyone will still vote republican (responsible) or democrat (responsible), people will still deposit their hard-earned in bailed-out bank systems, still accept that key White House officials are former AIG employees, still accept that they need to spend half their lives paying for student loans and health care insurance. Things don't, and shouldn't, have to be this way. I just think the occupy movement (and other similar movements in Europe) may be fighting a PR war against people and institutions who don't really care about PR.

 

Again, I'm all for the movement. I just don't see a major change coming out of it alone. I'd feel differently if, for instance, some of these movements and protests started organizing serious political parties or better yet, bank runs.

[Guest ex-voto]

Being unemployed doesn't mean one doesn't want to work... After having studied for a long time, and not being able to find work that fits your education must be frustrating. I am not giving any judgment here, though just saying that this might be a problem that those activists are facing and want to point out.

[Meadows and Labyrinths]

ahg, look, i knew there'd be some people with a much better understanding and maybe even a passion for the movement here. i'm not trying to bash it in any way, especially because i know nothing about it. i have no right to make an argument either way about it. i guess i was just reacting and venting and i probably look like a douchebag right now, and that's okay, i guess.

 

my unemployed friend hasn't worked in ages. she is percently able to work, but what i neglected to mention is that she lives off of her mother-in-law's money. i was just bitching about it here because i had nothing better to do.

 

like those hippies.

 

(lol)

[Guest Z_B_Z]

the term "hippies" at this point is a complete catch all cliche and has little basis in reality... a weak term for those too lazy to really examine the situation for what it actually is. this isnt a fucking phish concert.

 

btw im currently employed.

 

that was mostly directed at the scum at fox news. venting as well..

[Meadows and Labyrinths]

the term "hippies" at this point is a complete catch all cliche and has little basis in reality... a weak term for those too lazy to really examine the situation for what it actually is. this isnt a fucking phish concert.

 

btw im currently employed.

relax, i'm just having fun. i don't actually feel that strongly about it.

 

in all honestly, i just wanted to catch up with watmm, and since i'm just as socially awkward as the rest of you fucks, i went about it in a strange way.

 

"little basis in reality"... that's something to work yer noggin' around...

[Guest Z_B_Z]

the term "hippies" at this point is a complete catch all cliche and has little basis in reality... a weak term for those too lazy to really examine the situation for what it actually is. this isnt a fucking phish concert.

 

btw im currently employed.

relax, i'm just having fun. i don't actually feel that strongly about it.

 

in all honestly, i just wanted to catch up with watmm, and since i'm just as socially awkward as the rest of you fucks, i went about it in a strange way.

 

"little basis in reality"... that's something to work yer noggin' around...

 

yeah i know, you missed my edit

 

that was mostly directed at the scum at fox news. venting as well..

[Meadows and Labyrinths]

cool.

 

bear with me, i am rusty at internet.

[chenGOD]

cool.

 

bear with me, i am rusty at internet.

rusty at tromboning?

[Meadows and Labyrinths]

Must resist - too many term papers to write....

please, i'd love to hear your thoughts. i find information to be much more palatable when coming from my fellow man, particularly when i've struck a nerve or said something completely malarkey and am being corrected with some real, passionate input.

 

plus, you're awesome.

 

cool.

 

bear with me, i am rusty at internet.

rusty at tromboning?

i don't get it, but probably.

[chenGOD]

You work 60 hours a week? That's not cool. There should be more to life than being a wage slave - and that's what the protests are all about.

I enjoy capitalism, globalization and all the good things they bring into my life (cheaper more powerful computing devices for example), but there are some very serious issues with how the system is being run.

 

A quick laundry list:

1. Corporate money needs to be removed from politics. Hard limits need to be set on how much candidates can receive in donations and how much they can spend on campaigns.
   
2. Corporations need to lose the status of legal personhood. There also needs to be an additional review of the punitive limits that are placed on board members of Limited Liability Corporations.
   
3. Regulation of the financial sector needs a complete overhaul. Reinstating Glass-Steagall would be a good first step. Additionally a move toward Canadian style regulation of banks would be good.
   
4. Higher taxes on the wealthy.
   

 

Some further reading to get you started:

 

Higher Marginal Tax rate and GDP Growth

 

Canadian Banking Article 1 (long one - but worth the read)

 

Canadian Banking Article 2

 

Comparing the Indian and American movements (a useful exercise in revealing some shortcomings in the American protests)

 

That's it for now - and by the way - your friend sounds like a leech. :P

[Guest Z_B_Z]

plus (in the u.s. anyway) actual health care, higher minimum wage, lower cost of living, less sociopathic republican fucks etc..

[Guest Z_B_Z]

dont base an entire economy off of debt you motherfuckers.

[Meadows and Labyrinths]

You work 60 hours a week? That's not cool. There should be more to life than being a wage slave - and that's what the protests are all about.

I enjoy capitalism, globalization and all the good things they bring into my life (cheaper more powerful computing devices for example), but there are some very serious issues with how the system is being run.

 

A quick laundry list:

1. Corporate money needs to be removed from politics. Hard limits need to be set on how much candidates can receive in donations and how much they can spend on campaigns.
   
2. Corporations need to lose the status of legal personhood. There also needs to be an additional review of the punitive limits that are placed on board members of Limited Liability Corporations.
   
3. Regulation of the financial sector needs a complete overhaul. Reinstating Glass-Steagall would be a good first step. Additionally a move toward Canadian style regulation of banks would be good.
   
4. Higher taxes on the wealthy.
   

 

Some further reading to get you started:

 

Higher Marginal Tax rate and GDP Growth

 

Canadian Banking Article 1 (long one - but worth the read)

 

Canadian Banking Article 2

 

Comparing the Indian and American movements (a useful exercise in revealing some shortcomings in the American protests)

 

That's it for now - and by the way - your friend sounds like a leech. :P

thank you, that was very eye-opening. i think i'm just really far removed from my world, perhaps unhealthily so, in a way. and the only window to that world, at times, is my crazy wrecking ball-swinging hopeless romantic leech friend.

 

it's refreshing to hear someones opinion voiced so clearly for once.

 

yeah, i work a lot. and i suppose it would be nice not to. but i guess i don't mind because i'm working towards a goal of my own, in my own way, and i can see the light at the end of the tunnel for my own battles. i'm pretty self centered, honestly. i realize this and i've come to embrace it. i don't like meddling in other people's business too much, and i don't like being told what to do. i think i just perceive that whole world as the exact opposite of that mantra.

 

thanks again.

[chenGOD]

Yeah your healthcare system in the US is fucked up as well.

 

Luke - as long as you have a goal to work towards that's cool. A lot of people just work way too much though, and think that's the way it's supposed to be. Work to live, don't live to work!

[Guest boo]

i'm the same as far as not really getting it but knowing people who are into it.

 

i saw a guy i sort of know on the local news saying "we're not going anywhere". he was just recently in a squat (and not an abandoned house kind of squat, it was like a part of a train station that was going to be done up or something, they built barricades to prevent getting kicked out) that got kicked out. i seriously don't think he cares about any of this stuff, he just sees it as a place to stay for a while. but yeah i dunno.

[Meadows and Labyrinths]

does Skyrim come with healthcare?

[Guest kokeboka]

Comparing the Indian and American movements (a useful exercise in revealing some shortcomings in the American protests)

 

Totally agree with you, and found that article very enlightening. Still, don't you think it's a bit fruitless to be protesting, when most of those people will still re-elect Obama for lack of a better choice? Protesters are demanding a political change that no politician is willing to carry out because it works directly against their interests. The protests are aimed at people capable of moving millions in lobbying, and who can influence the media and thus the general public's perception of what this is all about. And like the article mentions, it's easy to blur out a message when you don't have the movement organized and with an hierarchy.

[Guest Benedict Cumberbatch]

wow luke just wow.

[Meadows and Labyrinths]

wow luke just wow.

could you explain your bewilderment, please? because i come off as a complete jerk and ignoramus at times, and often i really don't mean to.

[Hautlle]

Being unemployed is actually a huge part of the movement.

 

false

 

[Caretstik]

I bet a lot of these 'Occupy' people come from nice middle class backgrounds, unlike council estate urchins like me.

[Guest kokeboka]

Middle class has always been the catalyst for major social and political change, especially if it's an empoverished middle class. Important social authors like Marx, Engels, Chomsky and Rousseau were all very wealthy upper class and probably never had any notion of what it's like to be unemployed, poor or on minimum wage. Still, if it weren't for them, we probably wouldn't have syndicates, minimum wage, welfare, labor laws or social services. This is upper/middle classes defending social justice; what's revolting is when they're out opposing it.