SR4 Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 its difficult because when anyone tries talk about these things its like trying to quantify the unquantifiable.. it makes you realize how incredibly feeble words and language can be.. "the map is not the territory" also it can be easy to disappear up your own ass when it comes to "airy fairy" subjects.. something ive been guilty of in the past.. at the end of the day, mystery is just as important as meaning “If you think you know what the hell is going on, you're probably full of shit.” - robert anton wilson well said Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rambo Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 well it fundamentally is a mystery. We can't talk about it we can only talk around it. One of the funniest things about this is that enlightenment can 'happen' to 2 people and they can't even describe what it's like to each other, which is obvious really, because if they could describe it to each other they'd be able to describe it to anyone else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SR4 Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 well it fundamentally is a mystery. We can't talk about it we can only talk around it. One of the funniest things about this is that enlightenment can 'happen' to 2 people and they can't even describe what it's like to each other, which is obvious really, because if they could describe it to each other they'd be able to describe it to anyone else. GODDAMN this is the thing I always think about when i think "enlightenment" and laugh at how fucking EVERYTHING IS>>>>>>>IT IS AHDFLGHBOFUIERTP$*(T%&U86 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rambo Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atop Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 Love the mystery... Expect the random... It is all a big maybe... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rabid Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 i used to argue about the meaning of life all the time. funny thing is, now that i've figured it out i can't be assed anymore Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SR4 Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 but you posted here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lumpenprol Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 i used to argue about the meaning of life all the time. funny thing is, now that i've figured it out i can't be assed anymore this basically works for me. If you submerge yourself in things the whole question seems to lose its importance. For me life isn't about contemplation so much as engagement with the world, as much as I can handle. It's made me a much happier person. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rabid Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 i used to argue about the meaning of life all the time. funny thing is, now that i've figured it out i can't be assed anymore this basically works for me. If you submerge yourself in things the whole question seems to lose its importance. For me life isn't about contemplation so much as engagement with the world, as much as I can handle. It's made me a much happier person. Exactly. live in what you can see and touch and life won't be meaningless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Z_B_Z Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 i get nothing out of being a hardcore realist, but i will say that without action, contemplation is just masturbation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SR4 Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 oh fuckin' cmon now....who here said life was meaningless? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atop Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 If you believe it is then it is.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meadows and Labyrinths Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SR4 Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chenGOD Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 i used to argue about the meaning of life all the time. funny thing is, now that i've figured it out i can't be assed anymore this basically works for me. If you submerge yourself in things the whole question seems to lose its importance. For me life isn't about contemplation so much as engagement with 20 year old chinese vagina, as much as I can handle. It's made me a much happier person. Altered to better represent reality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atop Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest naos Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 that's where my personal philosophy conflicts with buddhism, i feel that you need to experience suffering just as much as happiness or peace, you have to get a 100% picture. most of our suffering is something we don't want to give away. that's the problem. to suffer consciously, in gnosticism, means to acumulate a certain type of energy. it's not physical suffering, but sort of "against one's habits and degenerative ways" suffering. "to separate fine from the coarse"? the path is wide, but the doors are narrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Masonic Boom Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 This thread seems to have derailed into a long discussion of what, exactly Buddhism or Enlightenment or whatever means when the very concept seems (to me at least) to focus on its very unknowableness. If that path works for you, then well and good. But to ME (perhaps because I'm too engaged in Samsara or perhaps because I'm too deeply entrenched in the western concepts and philosophy with which I was trained, both consciously and through cultural osmosis) it is just not the answer. My mum is a priest, she can talk to me all day long about Jesus and talk about Christian concepts but that has no meaning to me either, as it's a personal experience of meaning that I just don't share. It's like... the last time I was in Paris my brother took me to see some Japanese opera. All of the translations were in French, a language that I don't speak. So I could watch and listen to the opera progress. I could even enjoy it. I might even have gathered some emotional content out of it - though this was much harder than you'd think, as all the movement and vocal emotive was so stylised (in a cultural style I have little knowledge of) that I could not tell what was going on. ^^^^^^now I could consume this. I could even ENJOY this, as a cultural experience. But I did not *UNDERSTAND* it, and I can never draw any MEANING out of that experience. This is kind of how I feel about Buddhism. It depends on a whole bunch of assumptions and symbols and cultural context that I don't have the vocabulary to truly understand. So I look for meaning in other ways. Basically the ways I described in my first post on this thread. p.s. I do think that suffering is an inherent part of life, and an important one. I was told, when younger, that it was "character building." It doesn't always build character in the same - or even good - ways. But to disregard it is to disregard a hell of a lot of the human experience and what indeed makes us human. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Blanket Fort Collapse Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 music and video games are the most consistently important things in my life, without them life would barely be worth it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redruth Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 enlightenment is the understanding of the way things truly are now and a glimpse into the certainty of knowing how they truly should be. it is about being given the ability to see with the truth past the view of the world that is commonly excepted. first this new perspective is disturbing, then it is confusing, then it is more wondrous then can ever be imagined. enlightenment is more about seeing things for what they truly are then it is about inner peace, although a certain type of peace will come and is necessary to sooth the intense pain of seeing. for the true nature of this place is far different then it posses itself to be, far different then the pretty picture that is presented to us. enlightenment is also about being given true knowledge and wisdom to help people, to help all that is in need of understanding itself. to be a walking talking solution for all which suffers in this world. i don't even like to use the word enlightenment because presently it has so many misleading connotations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rambo Posted January 28, 2010 Share Posted January 28, 2010 I think that word gets used in a variety of ways doesn't it? What you are talking about is nothing like the enlightenment i was talking about, not even remotely similar things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gaarg Posted January 28, 2010 Share Posted January 28, 2010 I like this thread for its seriousness. We really have a lot to debate on this matter, don't we? Some of you wrote really good things. In the last month I've been observing how my mental consciousness keeps giving my emotions a hard time. Its actually quite sadistic most of the time. Example: I eat a well prepaired meal and enjoy it as I should, but I keep getting these "some people haven't got anything to eat", "this is very unhealthy", "you eat like a pig" thoughts. And that's just a simple everyday example. I kinda understand that my body just wants to be taken care of and will be good to me if I do. My feelings (emotions) will be satisfied if I'm a good and competent person, who also takes good care of his body. Now my mental state is obviously a problem, as I keep making and seeing problems I can't solve and that projects all through different layers of me. It sucks, because I can't be happy this way. And I find meaning to MY life in being happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ian Posted January 28, 2010 Share Posted January 28, 2010 The few moments of true happiness we experience in life is as good as it gets, there is nothing better, so searching for a state outside this is fruitless since you've already found it. Happiness is also temporary, it comes in states; you cannot be happy all the time. Don't beat yourself up over little things; not being the greatest music maker in the world, making mistakes in your favourite sport, saying no when you should have said yes, etc., etc. Imposing these things on yourself will just increase your stress levels and lower your enjoyment, which leads to less states of happiness. As far as i can tell, the greatest purpose you can hope to find is the pursuit of a goal that you're passionate about which will transcend your lifetime. There's no objective purpose without subscribing to religious codebooks, and they were made from the eyes of someone else's passion. You'll know when you find something you're passionate about, keep looking, try new things, try everything that you can which you haven't, who knows where your passion will be found. As they say, there's no return ticket, so keep looking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Masonic Boom Posted January 28, 2010 Share Posted January 28, 2010 True, about the word "Enlightenment" - it's one of those things that means so many different things to so many different people (from Gallileo to Buddha) that's it's quite dangerous to use without qualifying. See also words like: soul, god, religion, spirituality You almost need to define the word before you can debate it. Which is a fun debate to be having anyway, so long as people stay respectful and polite - which everyone here has, which is both astonishing and inspiring. I like the fact that threads like this one can exist. And coexist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redruth Posted January 28, 2010 Share Posted January 28, 2010 True, about the word "Enlightenment" - it's one of those things that means so many different things to so many different people (from Gallileo to Buddha) that's it's quite dangerous to use without qualifying. See also words like: soul, god, religion, spirituality You almost need to define the word before you can debate it. Which is a fun debate to be having anyway, so long as people stay respectful and polite - which everyone here has, which is both astonishing and inspiring. I like the fact that threads like this one can exist. And coexist. so true on all counts .... anyone can say they are a 'this' or a 'that', but until they define the 'how', until they define the details then it is really impossible to know what they mean, it is empty words. there is wrong and there is right, no matter how far we have become from knowing its true definition. (i have a problem just blindly coexisting, i think this word could use some definition as well) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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