North Korea attacks South Korea

[chenGOD]

Gary: no-one will initiate conflict with North Korea because they don't want to be responsible for the deaths of millions of Korean and Japanese citizens. Do try and keep up old chap.

There's no vague hope that if Kim Jeong Eun succeeds his father he will be more lenient, the old guard will still be in place. The focus should be on diplomacy, because diplomacy got us a lot further than any sort of military action or sanctions.

[halisray]

Haven't we already tried at diplomacy and they just turn their backs and laugh at us? (us being "allies")

Don't Americans despise communists? Or would this be seen as more of a dictatorship? Either way I don't see how the US will be diplomatic in this.. how can they be diplomatic? NK won't give up their nuclear arms or the way they treat their citizens.. not sure what will happen... exciting either way.

[Npoess]

http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/2010/11/tension_in_the_koreas.html

[SR4]

Gary: no-one will initiate conflict with North Korea because they don't want to be responsible for the deaths of millions of Korean and Japanese citizens. Do try and keep up old chap.

There's no vague hope that if Kim Jeong Eun succeeds his father he will be more lenient, the old guard will still be in place. The focus should be on diplomacy, because diplomacy got us a lot further than any sort of military action or sanctions.

 

 

 

can everyone fucking relax?

[SR4]

Haven't we already tried at diplomacy and they just turn their backs and laugh at us? (us being "allies")

Don't Americans despise communists? Or would this be seen as more of a dictatorship? Either way I don't see how the US will be diplomatic in this.. how can they be diplomatic? NK won't give up their nuclear arms or the way they treat their citizens.. not sure what will happen... exciting either way.

 

NK certainly is not indicative of communism. The reason the Soviet Union/PRC were singled out is because of what they represented in terms of a possible Comintern during the Cold War. Let's not forget, we were almost completely unaware of the Sino-Soviet split until the late 1960s/early 1970s, from the Western European/US perspective Communism was going to dominate Asia.

 

North Korea is pretty much laughable to most countries, specifically due to the peculiar nature of their existence...very few, if any of these circumstances exist at present worldwide. THey aren't exactly a platform for propping up communism in the slightest.

[Joyrex]

Shit's getting real: US Destroyer deployed to the area...

[chenGOD]

Joyrex: The ship is being deployed for military exercises that had been planned before the shelling.

 

Halisray: the Agreed Framework and Sunshine Policy were good opportunities, unfortunately the US/South Korea pulled out of their commitments for building the Light-Water Reactors under the Agreed Framework, and Dubya screwed the South on the Sunshine Policy by calling the North part of the Axis of Evil and sending John Bolton to negotiate with the North (who had previously called Bolton "human scum").

 

I am not saying the North is blameless, of course they have done some truly heinous things to their own people, and they also play a lot of brinkmanship, but the media and the State Department work very hard to make it out like the West hasn't done anything to fuck with the North Koreans.

[Guest Gary C]

Guarantee there's a nuclear sub underneath that carrier. Just incase.

[delet...]

listen to chen, he knows all.

[SR4]

Joyrex: The ship is being deployed for military exercises that had been planned before the shelling.

 

Halisray: the Agreed Framework and Sunshine Policy were good opportunities, unfortunately the US/South Korea pulled out of their commitments for building the Light-Water Reactors under the Agreed Framework, and Dubya screwed the South on the Sunshine Policy by calling the North part of the Axis of Evil and sending John Bolton to negotiate with the North (who had previously called Bolton "human scum").

 

I am not saying the North is blameless, of course they have done some truly heinous things to their own people, and they also play a lot of brinkmanship, but the media and the State Department work very hard to make it out like the West hasn't done anything to fuck with the North Koreans.

 

to be fair though, its not like N.Korea doesn't go out of its way to fuck with every other nation on earth that deals with it. The refugee camps within China alone are pissing them off well enough.

 

but you are right, the concern is a military coup/power transfer, not whether the new "Dear Leader" will change policy. Realistically the Kims are puppet heads, I'm incredibly doubtful that they have that much involvement in public policy other than constantly refining Juche to fit their aims. And even if they are, the incredible agricultural failures of the early 90s should be enough evidence of their incompetence. The military is well aware that if they keep the Kims in power, the keep the minds of the people. However we shouldn't be so naive as to assume the military is somehow unified behind Kim Jong-Il's chosen successor. There are always backroom politics involved, and we shouldn't be surprised if there is one military wing holding up Jong-Un, and another holding up Kim Jong-Nam and so on. Again, the limited info we receive only allows us to speculate, but I think most Korean and American officials know that an ousting in anyway of the Korean leaders can have incredibly destabilizing and risky effects.

[kaini]

Is JP a nuclear power? I bet they'd take NK off the face of the Earth in retaliation, and who knows what kind of can of worms that would open for Iran, Russia, China, Pakistan, India, and the US

 

japan will never, ever use nuclear weapons.

[Guest dese manz hatin]

this nigga be watchin you

 

[lumpenprol]

http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/2010/11/tension_in_the_koreas.html

 

Hottie alert!

 

[kaini]

http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/2010/11/tension_in_the_koreas.html

 

Hottie alert!

 

 

israeli army is most poontastic army

[lumpenprol]

amusingly, the link you posted is blocked in China.

 

In times like these, I turn to those with the real-world experience necessary to provide deep insight into the conflict. People like Sarah Palin:

 

"This speaks to a bigger picture here that certainly scares me in terms of our national security policy. But obviously we’ve gotta stand with our North Korean allies."

- Sarah Palin

[SR4]

as much as i abhor saying this, i think people have blown that quote way out of proportion...she was corrected pretty quickly. its common to misstep now and then....i don't genuinely think she thought N.Korea was our ally.

[lumpenprol]

yeah, I keep forgetting you guys are probably watching a loop of her saying it live, and completely saturated media coverage, I just happened to stumble across it on the web today - I have no clue as to context. I haven't watched any tv apart from DVDs for over a year, and the US seems like a faraway, quaint little backwater now.

[Guest dese manz hatin]

FREUDIAN SLIP

[delet...]

yeah, I keep forgetting you guys are probably watching a loop of her saying it live, and completely saturated media coverage, I just happened to stumble across it on the web today - I have no clue as to context. I haven't watched any tv apart from DVDs for over a year, and the US seems like a faraway, quaint little backwater now.

 

well done ..

[kaen]

my mum is supposed to be stopping over in s.korea on her way back from oz next week, hopefully they will re-route to singapore instead

[lumpenprol]

*mental image of kaen's mom bursting through north korean DMZ drywall*

[Guest Blanket Fort Collapse]

lol

[chenGOD]

Smetty: I think Kim Jeong Il actually has a fair amount of power, and the analyst from the Heritage Foundation (ex CIA Northeast Asia analyst) I was fortunate enough to go and hear actually downplayed the idea of factionalism.I don't completely agree with him in that he thinks there isn't any factionalism, but I do agree that KJI has a fair amount of power. He was a very reasonable guy, he used to work at the Brookings institute, so he did have quite a balanced outlook.

I do agree with the idea though that the hawks in the North are syaing "Look, even though Kim Jeong Eun is coming to power, we're pulling some strings over here as well." Kim Jeong Eun's succession is far from guaranteed, and if KJI snuffs it quick, that's when shit will get hairy. I can't see the generals who fought in the Korean War eagerly agreeing to listen to a 27 year old punk kid, and you know Jeong Eun's older brother is gonna make his own play (although all he really wants to do is go to Tokyo Disneyland lol).

 

Anyways, anyone outside of the South Korean military advocating a more aggressive stance can go fuck themselves.

[delet...]

some of the people npr used to wheel out from the brookings institute for opinion, never seemed that left oriented to me. Always a right of centre, council on foreign relations type mindset.

[chenGOD]

I think that while the Brookings institute is not leftist, it is certainly more socially oriented than the Heritage foundation.