johnnix Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 Please tell me the difference between Al-Jazeera and Russia Today in regards to the coverage of the events happenning in Gaza/Syria/RDC/Cameroon/Senegal/Mali...I see the news here in Belgium and it's not just biased, it is clearly partisan either way.I saw Abby Martin, on national tv here in Belgium, but what does it tells you? It's free press and thinking, but when all you news feeder is Abby RT, what does it say about how "WE" "the west" view the geopolitcal implications of those crisis? Sorry I'm a bit drunk so I probably didn't quite formulate my thoughts clearly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
usagi Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 yes, I'm not quite sure what you're saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delet... Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 I learn a lot more about reality watching RT than i do my local news which is wall to wall propaganda on any issue of international import if it mentions it at all. This doesn't mean that i take everything verbatim. I test everything based on merit given past experience with the issue at hand, the players involved and the way the story is being framed, this is deciphering reality 101 and should be used in every part of your life, not restricted to interpreting the news. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnix Posted August 4, 2014 Author Share Posted August 4, 2014 The thing I meant is that I grew up trusting Belgian news/reporting, and I think it was safe to assume our reporters are doing their job quite faithfully.But now I kind of doubt every news outlet...How do you try to keep informed without reliying to some kind of mainstream news feed?I mean is it really possible to pretend to be "truly" aware? where does the propaganda end/begin? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eggs Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 Abby Martin is hot...tho Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adieu Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 The thing I meant is that I grew up trusting Belgian news/reporting, and I think it was safe to assume our reporters are doing their job quite faithfully. But now I kind of doubt every news outlet... How do you try to keep informed without reliying to some kind of mainstream news feed? I mean is it really possible to pretend to be "truly" aware? where does the propaganda end/begin? Are you saying you think Abby Martin is spreading propaganda? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnix Posted August 4, 2014 Author Share Posted August 4, 2014 In a way she is.... obviously not consciously, but you can see for example Eugene's reactions to her speeches and how he's entitled to defending his nation's actions. You can sort of see it too in Ukraine, who his to say that the eastern people of Ukraine are not genuinly wanting to secede from the central Kiev government?Is it because "we"(the EU and NATO) want to expand to the east after promissing to the russian in the 90's that we won't?Why do we call foul play on the russians all the while stomping the agreements whe madz 20 years ago?Is it fair play then,?nwae, it was surprising seeing Awe's sis on tv lolI tried to explain who she is to my parents but they didn't believe me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
usagi Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 ... I think it was safe to assume our reporters are doing their job quite faithfully. never. But now I kind of doubt every news outlet... always. but that's just me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
may be rude Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 finding out what really happened in the other room 5 minutes ago can prove impossible. apprehending reality is about approximations. it's important to take things with a grain of salt and look for the other half of the story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
autopilot Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 Recently in her JRE appearance, Abby Martin pretty much outright said that you won't get unbiased news about anything Russia-related from RT, but that the platform is useful in that they allow people like her & Lee Camp to do scathing commentary on USA & the rest of the world that would otherwise be non-existent in news sources like CNN, MSNBC, or FOX. As long as 'news' sources are funded by parties with agendas though, which pretty much all the televised ones are, you're not going to get something 100% objective, whatever that means. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awepittance Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 I saw Abby Martin, on national tv here in Belgium, but what does it tells you? can you explain the context? a link would be helpful also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnix Posted August 4, 2014 Author Share Posted August 4, 2014 Call me naive but I still have faith in some people, call them "news reporters' or whatever you want, but they exist...To Usagi, are you the kind to just dismiss anything you can read/hear just based on the fact that it may be biased?I'm pretty much an optimist because I DO think that there are people who try to get facts straight and pass it on to the worldIt's getting harder and harder to separate the wheat from the chaff, or so we think... 50 years ago it probably was worse than now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnix Posted August 4, 2014 Author Share Posted August 4, 2014 I saw Abby Martin, on national tv here in Belgium, but what does it tells you? can you explain the context? a link would be helpful also. I don't have a link but it was a short excerpt highlighting the shortcommings of the israeli rhetorics on defense, like you would use an audio sample to illustrate a point Nobody would pay attention, I just recognized her face and attitude and it struck me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnix Posted August 4, 2014 Author Share Posted August 4, 2014 And that's kind of the point, you have these points of view, transmitted without context nor warningsI'm not saying Abby's right or wrong, but the fact that you can hear her thoughts out of context like it's some kind of truth is a bit frightening... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
usagi Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 To Usagi, are you the kind to just dismiss anything you can read/hear just based on the fact that it may be biased? no, I'm not that kind. I wouldn't use the word "dismiss". when it comes to things like this, I'm with vh in thinking that apprehending the truth of the matter is often an approximation at best, because of all the complicated bullshit involved. I don't generally follow the news but when I do hear or read something, I'll use whatever faculties at my disposal - facts, probabilities and intuition - to try and determine what the truth of the matter is. while trying to keep in mind that it's all a big house of cards, really, because whatever assumptions I, or anyone, throw into the equation can cause it all to collapse. I could be dead wrong about something. I have no way of knowing for sure unless I'm a first-hand witness. I'm not sympathetic at all to people who work in the industry. I think most journalists don't know how to do their real jobs, and are the grown-up equivalents of that yappy kid you used to know in kindergarten who, during recess, would find something embarrassing out about some other kid and run around yelling it to the whole playground. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnix Posted August 4, 2014 Author Share Posted August 4, 2014 To Usagi, are you the kind to just dismiss anything you can read/hear just based on the fact that it may be biased? no, I'm not that kind. I wouldn't use the word "dismiss". when it comes to things like this, I'm with vh in thinking that apprehending the truth of the matter is often an approximation at best, because of all the complicated bullshit involved. I don't generally follow the news but when I do hear or read something, I'll use whatever faculties at my disposal - facts, probabilities and intuition - to try and determine what the truth of the matter is. while trying to keep in mind that it's all a big house of cards, really, because whatever assumptions I, or anyone, throw into the equation can cause it all to collapse. I could be dead wrong about something. I have no way of knowing for sure unless I'm a first-hand witness. I'm not sympathetic at all to people who work in the industry. I think most journalists don't know how to do their real jobs, and are the grown-up equivalents of that yappy kid you used to know in kindergarten who, during recess, would find something embarrassing out about some other kid and run around yelling it to the whole playground. A+ post, would read again.... ;) I mostly agree with you, but then you seem to think most reporters are hacks while I tend to think most of them are really commited to doing a good job, but maybe sometimes caught in the mainstream way of thinking. Cerntainly there are many who are just like you funnily described, but I think they are a tiny fraction of the profession at large Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Braintree Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 Most reporters are hacks. Just like most music sucks, and most art is shit. It's merely a numbers game when talking about "most." Anyhow, they're a bunch of complacent shitheads. /drunkpost Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awepittance Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 I saw Abby Martin, on national tv here in Belgium, but what does it tells you? can you explain the context? a link would be helpful also. I don't have a link but it was a short excerpt highlighting the shortcommings of the israeli rhetorics on defense, like you would use an audio sample to illustrate a point Nobody would pay attention, I just recognized her face and attitude and it struck me interesting Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goDel Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 So this is what you get when you combine a drunk thread with a political one.. A thread about Abby. Cute! Hey Johnoise, didnt know you were residing in Belgium. A case of belgian beer attraction?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
klore Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 it's not a surprise to find news paper or TV channel partisan that defend their opinions, in france all the political sides are represented naturally there and there we just chose what to read/follow/watch they all do sort of propaganda, some are outrageously obvious what makes them ridiculous, others are more subtle and subliminal, dunno which one is more dangerous Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Friendly Foil Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 I like that one time RT used a vidja game screenshot in a segment on child soldiers. That was cool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delet... Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 To Usagi, are you the kind to just dismiss anything you can read/hear just based on the fact that it may be biased? no, I'm not that kind. I wouldn't use the word "dismiss". when it comes to things like this, I'm with vh in thinking that apprehending the truth of the matter is often an approximation at best, because of all the complicated bullshit involved. I don't generally follow the news but when I do hear or read something, I'll use whatever faculties at my disposal - facts, probabilities and intuition - to try and determine what the truth of the matter is. while trying to keep in mind that it's all a big house of cards, really, because whatever assumptions I, or anyone, throw into the equation can cause it all to collapse. I could be dead wrong about something. I have no way of knowing for sure unless I'm a first-hand witness. I'm not sympathetic at all to people who work in the industry. I think most journalists don't know how to do their real jobs, and are the grown-up equivalents of that yappy kid you used to know in kindergarten who, during recess, would find something embarrassing out about some other kid and run around yelling it to the whole playground. A+ post, would read again.... ;) I mostly agree with you, but then you seem to think most reporters are hacks while I tend to think most of them are really commited to doing a good job, but maybe sometimes caught in the mainstream way of thinking. Cerntainly there are many who are just like you funnily described, but I think they are a tiny fraction of the profession at large What has happened is that the thoughtful and innately sceptical individuals get weeded out of the job of journalism, so all you are left with are the dumb and the nihilistic line towing show ponies. Also loi at usagi's analogy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
essines Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 The weekly paper I get in the villiage I work in, The Coast Reporter, is pretty transparent reporting. It's also a free paper for residents of the coast I live on in which the highlight is the weekly police report that is almost exclusively drunk drivers and teens or someone stole a boat/only came to a rolling stop at a 4 way intersection. My point is the people who publish this paper are the people I would consider to be genuine journalists. Bias might come in to play in an article about something like the yearly fibre arts festival (it's a contentious issue, not all citizens like fibre arts) but generally it's people writing down facts regardless of how boring they are and the fact that no one fucking cares. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
usagi Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 The weekly paper I get in the villiage I work in, The Coast Reporter, is pretty transparent reporting. It's also a free paper for residents of the coast I live on in which the highlight is the weekly police report that is almost exclusively drunk drivers and teens or someone stole a boat/only came to a rolling stop at a 4 way intersection. My point is the people who publish this paper are the people I would consider to be genuine journalists. Bias might come in to play in an article about something like the yearly fibre arts festival (it's a contentious issue, not all citizens like fibre arts) but generally it's people writing down facts regardless of how boring they are and the fact that no one fucking cares. fair play. as you hint, their reporting is nice and transparent because their jobs are fairly straightforward. the bigger the issue that is being discussed, the more global lines it crosses, the more players/stakes there are involved, and the more entrenched the views/opinions, the less clear shit is and the more complicated/hazy the issue becomes. that's where the big-time reporters and journalists fail to do their jobs imo. I think they get sucked into the maelstrom without even really realising it and before they know it they're propping up something they never had any affiliation with when they - a lot of them with honourable intentions - decided to go into journalism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnix Posted August 10, 2014 Author Share Posted August 10, 2014 The weekly paper I get in the villiage I work in, The Coast Reporter, is pretty transparent reporting. It's also a free paper for residents of the coast I live on in which the highlight is the weekly police report that is almost exclusively drunk drivers and teens or someone stole a boat/only came to a rolling stop at a 4 way intersection. My point is the people who publish this paper are the people I would consider to be genuine journalists. Bias might come in to play in an article about something like the yearly fibre arts festival (it's a contentious issue, not all citizens like fibre arts) but generally it's people writing down facts regardless of how boring they are and the fact that no one fucking cares. fair play. as you hint, their reporting is nice and transparent because their jobs are fairly straightforward. the bigger the issue that is being discussed, the more global lines it crosses, the more players/stakes there are involved, and the more entrenched the views/opinions, the less clear shit is and the more complicated/hazy the issue becomes. that's where the big-time reporters and journalists fail to do their jobs imo. I think they get sucked into the maelstrom without even really realising it and before they know it they're propping up something they never had any affiliation with when they - a lot of them with honourable intentions - decided to go into journI This is right on point IMO Journalism as an immaculate concept is only achievable if it's done at the most basic level, like the exemple essines told I guess everyone of us has acces to a local newspaper which is more close to the truth when it comes to local news But like usagi says, as soon as you're talking geopolitics it becomes another thing alltogether, you can't possibly cross-check the facts yourself, unless you go there yourself And then it becomes a matter of trust; you put your trust (or not) in people who do the job of reporting the news to you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.