goDel

Hoping for a world where people do not believe dumb shit? Isn't that like hoping to get rid of people altogether? Werent dumb, unfounded beliefs inherent to being human? Wait...what? And basic enlightenment values is code for being high, right?

It was the exact same file Edit: what he ^^^ said

Absolutely. Society needs companies to be able to do those things. But that is no justification for the amounts of profit made and the way pricetags are being put on pills (read: peoples lives). This is a generalisation from my side, and not every company and not every drug is the same. But on a whole, the way big pharma currently pushes their pills is something that needs to change. The way big pharma is doing business is in no way different to Apple selling iPhones. And they're at least as profitable, if not more than Apple. And besides the activity of pricing their pills like iPhones, they're also in the tax-evasion business. Just like Apple. And meanwhile their excuse for the high prices is that they bring so much value to society. Well, yes and no. They also destroying society, because they're making profits from taxpayers money. Money which could have gone to all kinds of things. Education, safety, roads and bridges. All those other things tax is used for. Instead, it goes largely to a happy few. I don't necessarily blame those companies though. They 'play' within what is considered 'legal' (ok, not always and those tax evasion schemes are an entirely different discussion). And the rules essentially allow them to play the game as they are currently doing. It's those rules that need to change. But I'm afraid those transatlantic partnerships are going to do the opposite.

Those billions are often parroted by people. No offense to you particular, candiru. Because these are the only "transparent" numbers which come from a single research which just happened to be funded by the industry itself. So whenever people want to talk 'facts', these are the only available numbers to discuss. Regardless of their value. Fact is, developing drugs costs money. Absolutely. But another fact is, the industry average "return on equity" (=profit) is roughly 20%. Measured over a period (2008-2012) where the global economy shrank because of a financial crisis. (source in dutch can be found here - in linked pdf at the bottom: http://www.nefarma.nl/nieuwsberichten/website/2014/05/deel-van-kritiek-op-farmasector-niet-op-feiten-gebaseerd). Which means that for every dollar the industry spends, it makes $1,20 on average, each year (it adds over more years, like inflation!). This includes any development costs of products which didn't make the cut. The industry often talks about the long times medicines need to develop and the financial risks involved, but in reality, they often have many potential products in the pipeline so they are perfectly fine in spreading their risks (as the average return on equity shows). Also, one of the reason they came up with that billion (it started as 800mln, btw), was that they also calculated 11% return on investment in the costs. So for any dollar spent on R&D, the virtually put that same dollar on a bankaccount with 11% interest and took the amount of money "lost" on developing with respect to putting it on a bank account. The interest is pretty arbitrary (standard in industry) and comes from a time before the global financial crash. Although the pharma industry might use 20%, as that what seems closer to the truth. O, and actual interest rates since the global financial crash are closer to zero. So please take the billion with a huge grain of salt. (It also doesn't take into account the huge variability between different medicines and technological progress which actually might make development cheaper!)

Exactly. Just like any other pharmaceutical company does. The payer will magically absorb the cost increase. And because in the end the entire society pays, you can create huuuuge increases of prices for low volume products without anyone noticing. Thats their logic. Only they will use terms like "creating value for society by saving lives". Its a very cynical industry.

Not sure why this would matter when a producer of a generic could sell globally. The fact there isnt any generic nowhere says that fda regulation is not that relevant in this case. The best solution in this case would be that either the government starts to produce its own low volume generics, or it starts to subsidize private companies to produce these low volume generics. Fda regulation could stay the way it is. And somewhere down the line i hope some lawmakers realize that the market for potentially li fe saving drugs isn't a free market. Producers of life saving drugs shouldn't be allowed to behave like they are Apple selling iphones.

Lol @ the big pharma lobby group distancing themselves from turing ceo. Couldnt be more hypocritical. This guy basically does what every producer of new drugs does when defining the price of a pill. It's got hardly anything to do with production costs and everything to do with optimizing return on investment. The only thing that's different is the language and the lack of transparency. If it's about a new treatment nobody will notice the therapy costs X*1000 of it's actual value. (And you can safely add the actual financial risks into this actual value) http://youtu.be/U-he3_hUWLk In a way we can be thankful for the pricehump, because it makes transparent whats already a widely used practice

Supposedly he's a former hedge fund manager, so the soulless part is right on the money.

See last three pages of FWP thread for (bizarrely long) discussion of my writing style Would read if I would have a clue where to find this mystical FWP thread. Favorite Wine Porn? Funny Word Protocols? bwu..

wait, was that a poem? in what verse?

yeah, that's ridiculous. isn't necessarily a us thing either, btw. just the way the pharma industry tends to make money. i do hope the next us president will be doing something about it though.

nah man, that's mediocre. come on.

I hope she's got a good lawyer. She could add 10 more BMW's to her carpark from the compensation.

just use the wisdom of the crowd and have this thread notify me. ;D

Rushup was brilliant, but my nerdy mind didn't count that as a proper album. What what in the ...?

And suddenly I was being struck with a case of jealousy. I still think he was a tiny bit bitched though.

Or pissed. Asking whether he's ever going to release an album better than Drukqs, while he's already released Syro. It's a backhanded bitchslap wrt Syro. I'm sure mr oozemeister is on his shitlist now. Dissing Syro and all. Also, "quite good"

The lack of new tracks is pissing me right off already! What a slacker! I hope he doesn't think he's allowed to have a life, or anything. *continues to whine for a bit*

allow me to retort... yeah...

Hey, congrats! Hasnt she been on the flannel shirt pics from the beginning? Like 100 years ago? Good to see you finally institutionalized eachothers slave ownership. ;D Missing the flannel, btw. But cigar makes up for it.

that's just awful. btw, it said on the site which ends with a /b/ that walmart stopped selling some types of guns? true?

Your fanstatus has been removed indefinitely.

PSA, we love you longtime!!!

On a slightly more positive note: two americans helped to stop a tragedy from happening when an individual had intentions to kill some people on a high speed train with a kalashnikov, amongst other things. Supposedly with terrorist intentions. Thanks to the Americans (one or both of them being marines - various sources state different things) the individual was overrun and put in control. Interesting side note: the americans weren't armed. Apparently it's possible to solve situations like these without guns. I repeat, without using a gun. And yes, that also counts for Americans. My faith in Americans has been restored. They actually are able to prevent tragedies from happening without any guns. Nobody died, and the armed individual has been put into custody. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/paris-amsterdam-train-shooting_55d77eb6e4b04ae4970340ff?kvcommref=mostpopular