September 11 2001 Conspiracy Thread

[jules]

no im with you. i dont understand why there isnt a huge uproar. the pentagon barely gets any talk and that was very obviously not a plane.

[delet...]

 

not sure what happened to #1 there. the way i see it, there are more questions than answers - which means, whatever happened, we (the public) are not getting the entire story. i could easily see the Bush administration simply letting an attack take place (even if they didn't know exactly what it was) to have an excuse to invade Iraq. it's obvious Jr was trying to fulfill a legacy.

 

Does no one else find these points alarming? I don't get why questions regarding the biggest attack in American history gets laughed at.

 

it gets laughed at because most people aren't media savvy and never will be. We have to just keep chipping away, it'll get there.

[Guest pulsewarrior]

why does the bldg 7 collapse announcement always factor in? i dont understand that one.

 

they announced the collapse of the building before it fell...how did they know it would fall...???????

 

ohhhh i don't know, but it was bombarded by debris from collapsed skyscrapers, caught ablaze and burned for about 7 straight hours, spurred by reserve tanks of diesel fuel for backup generators? just a hunch that people may have assumed it was going to go....or maybe the announcement was just misinformation in one of the most chaotic days in US history.

[Guest pulsewarrior]

Hundreds of people reported feeling and hearing explosions right before the buildings collapsed... Wake up...

 

you should watch the session that popular mechanics did, in response to many of the popular conspiracy theories including loose change. i would have to say they thoroughly routed every bullshit conspiracy out there.

[Guest nene multiple assgasms]

Hundreds of people reported feeling and hearing explosions right before the buildings collapsed... Wake up...

 

you should watch the session that popular mechanics did, in response to many of the popular conspiracy theories including loose change. i would have to say they thoroughly routed every bullshit conspiracy out there.

 

[vertsk8er419]

it doesn't matter how they collapsed you monkeys, they orchestrated it so there is all this conflicting information, and heated discussion and confusion, get the fuck over that, talk about information overload. it's much simpler, what matters is that the powers that be knew about it and let it happen. it was mass-murder, and that exactly what they wanted; a reason to murder more people for more power, to invade more, divide more, and destroy more.

[luke viia]

those loose change guys seem like dicks

 

pop sci FTW

[Guest Helper ET]

i apologize to everyone who tried to make an honest effort

 

this thread, has shown that this board is inundated with children, who are incapable of adult discussion, and a sophisticated interaction of ideas

 

sorry for trying

 

*fart jokes*

 

*anti-conspiracy 9/11 gibberish*

 

*general retardedness*

 

last post

 

watmm fail

 

fuck you

[sysyphus]

"The plain, sad reality... is that the 9/11 Commission Report, despite the vast quantity of labor behind it, is a cheat and a fraud. It stands as a series of evasive maneuvers that infantilize the audience, transform candor into iniquity, and conceal realities that demand immediate inspection and confrontation. At the core of all these failures lies a deep wariness of earnest, well-informed public debate."

 

...but not on watmm.

[delet...]

Re: et

 

what did you expect. it's always been an uphill battle pushing things like this. I remember the hard time we used to have just trying to convince people that the iraq and afghan wars were a wrong and that we needed to exit them pronto. Over time though people have come around. Like i said, you just have to keep chipping away, don't lose heart. And most of all don't be a sour grapes holding whiny schnizenor.

 

[eugene]

a few years ago, the 9/11 conspiracy topic would usually spark a few pages of serious discussion. not just here, pretty much anywhere you go, internet or just social situations. now it seems like everyone believes that either the government attacked itself, or that it was caused by some secret powerful elite group (illuminati, nwo, etc. - idiots still think it was terrorists)

 

so just to be clear, mostly everyone here believes it was all a lie, and it was a self inflicted attack, in one way or another?

who did it then

 

why is terrorists so outlandish

 

illuminati eh.

 

its outlandish because there is a retarded amount of evidence suggesting that the government / illuminati planned and operated the entire thing. and when i say theres a retarded amount of information about it, i mean, if you go and read all of it (it will take you months), you would have to be a retard to still believe it was terrorists

 

so im not saying terrorists dont exist, or that they cant attack the US in a significant way, im saying that this time, it was a self inflicted / illumninati attack, and theres more than enough evidence to convince a normal, rational, reasonable person to believe that it was not terrorists

 

i cant believe this is still happening, nine years later, people still thinking it was terrorists, but i guess thats what this is all about. so lets do this. i will fight this till the death of my watmm account, right here, in this thread. i will be the last poster of the thread, i promise. ill log off and go to sleep and live my life and all that, but i will leave no argument left unresolved. i will leave no question unanswered. and i will allow no disinformation to be posted without my defending of the truth

 

go

 

 

i apologize to everyone who tried to make an honest effort

 

this thread, has shown that this board is inundated with children, who are incapable of adult discussion, and a sophisticated interaction of ideas

 

sorry for trying

 

*fart jokes*

 

*anti-conspiracy 9/11 gibberish*

 

*general retardedness*

 

last post

 

watmm fail

 

fuck you

 

[karmakramer]

i apologize to everyone who tried to make an honest effort

 

this thread, has shown that this board is inundated with children, who are incapable of adult discussion, and a sophisticated interaction of ideas

 

sorry for trying

 

*fart jokes*

 

*anti-conspiracy 9/11 gibberish*

 

*general retardedness*

 

last post

 

watmm fail

 

fuck you

 

NOOOO ET!

[luke viia]

Serious discussion indeed... Get asked to provide some info and respond by calling everyone children incapable of adult discussion. That was definitely the adult way to respond.

[chenGOD]

Re: et

 

what did you expect. it's always been an uphill battle pushing things like this. I remember the hard time we used to have just trying to convince people that the iraq and afghan wars were a wrong and that we needed to exit them pronto. Over time though people have come around. Like i said, you just have to keep chipping away, don't lose heart. And most of all don't be a sour grapes holding whiny schnizenor.

 

you're not trying to equate "not believing in illuminati conspiracy" with "agreeing with the invasions of Afghanistan and Iraq" right?

[Guest yikes]

i was local when this happened

there were 3-4 israeli nationals filming it from wehawken NJ -laughing and high fiving each other-who were arrested and then deported

i saw some fucking weird unidentified object hovering over the site with stuff hanging down- i was not alone-other people pointed and saw it

the smell and stench of fried electrical death hung in the air for months

seeing fighter jets flying in low formation near my house a few hrs after the event was freaky

when downtown finally reopened it was a macabre ghost town

anyone who makes joke about this shit is a fucking asshole of the highest order

yes this was an inside job anyone who doesn't belive that is a fucking ostrich w/ their head in the sand

if you read any kind of amerikkan history you would realize that the bush crime family has been involved in all kinds of nefarious activity since the JFK assassination.

these people are not human and are LORDS of our world

they call the shots,start wars etc

i was at the apex of my DJ career and the night life in NYC was heavily affected by the event

no one wanted to come into town and party for a year and many cool nightclubs went out of business

i saw squarepusher on the west side waterfront in late august w/the WTC in the backround

i am waiting for the smallpox outbreak

[awepittance]

those loose change guys seem like dicks

 

pop sci FTW

 

yeah unfortunately people too often try to take down the messenger rather than the message. Websites like 'screw loose change' for example, spend 90% of their efforts going after the creator Dylan Avery.

 

Again this is the problem with trying to get real information in regards to 9/11, people will get turned off by the messenger if they rub them the wrong way (avery, alex jones, david icke) , often times these messangers are not eloquent enough or good enough to deliver the message properly.

 

if you think that loose change 'debate' proves either side of any case you need to do some further examination.

 

Loose change 1 & 2 are completely filled with disinformation, i think they are probably the worst and least clarifying 9/11 truth documentaries in existence .

 

if any of the super dismissive people around here actually watched 9/11 press for truth or Improbable Collapse or even Power of Nightmares, they wouldn't be so quick to dismiss this stuff. but again these can be written off by the comfortable individual as 'those are just conspiracy theory movies' infinite loop

 

how could someone watch a debate between editors from popular mechanics and 2 college kids who made a free google video movie on their computer would be some sort of final clarification 'ah so there actually was no conspiracy, cleared all up' wtf? can you really not see how unbalanced that debate is? I mean at least level the playing field a little, Dylan looks stoned out of his mind in that interview

 

The war on terror isn't about frightening people, although some wish to use it for that exact purpose. It's about defeating those who seek to destroy us.

 

wow

[awepittance]

9/11 Press for Truth, non speculative 9/11 movie that lays out how the family members are the ones who had to press for an investigation which they never actually got, just a show

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3979568779414136481#

Improbable Collapse: best speculative doc, focusing only on the seemingly impossible events of 3 steel framed skyscrapers fully collapsing from fire damage

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hER03tV-nSU

Power of Nightmares, a very detailed 3 hour long documentary on the BBC that details how the bush administration hypes up and even fabricates terrorist threats to gain more power for themselves

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2798679275960015727#

[Guest nene multiple assgasms]

would anyone like to offer any evidence (with references) for their claims? if not, then I don't see the point of this thread.

[Guest Gary C]

My overall idea is that it wasn't an inside job, or that at least no-one in power knew about it until the last minute. Personally I think that Al Qaeda were so properly rehearsed and had such detailed information gathered through spies that they could have done whatever they wanted that day, and did.

I'm even willing to believe that maybe Al Qaeda had bombs planted (vans?) in the base of the towers too.

 

I don't believe that the American government attacked itself or that they allowed the attacks to happen, but I think they were completely incapable of doing anything about it.

 

Rich Arabs can do whatever they want in business matters, that leads into political, and then some bankers crazy brother gets his boys to fly a couple of planes.

[awepittance]

would anyone like to offer any evidence (with references) for their claims? if not, then I don't see the point of this thread.

 

google is pretty good website i hear, if there are claims made in this thread you find compelling, disagreeable, offensive, shocking, etc let me know what they are and i will hand in your lap evidence with references

[awepittance]

but I think they were completely incapable of doing anything about it.

 

The Bush administration lied about how much of a 'surprise' this attack was, but for some reason unlike the WMD lie this lie is still believed by many even with ample evidence to prove the contrary

 

here are some prior warnings including specifics you might be interested in...

 

1. NY Times: Bush Warned bin Laden Would Hijack Planes

"The White House said tonight that President Bush had been warned by American intelligence agencies in early August that Osama bin Laden was seeking to hijack aircraft..."

http://www.nytimes.com/2002/05/16/politics/16INQU.html

2. CNN: Bush briefed on hijacking threat before 9-11

"President Bush's daily intelligence briefings in the weeks leading up to the September 11 terror attacks included a warning of the possibility that Osama bin Laden's al Qaeda network would attempt to hijack a U.S.-based airliner, senior administration officials said Wednesday."

http://www.cnn.com/2002/US/05/15/bush.sept.11/index.html

3. UK Guardian: Bush knew terrorists would hijack planes

"George Bush received specific warnings in the weeks before 11 September that an attack inside the United States was being planned by Osama bin Laden's al-Qaeda network, US government sources said yesterday?. The memo received by Bush on 6 August contained unconfirmed information passed on by British intelligence in 1998 revealing that al-Qaeda operatives had discussed hijacking a plane to negotiate the release of Sheikh Omar Abdel Rahman, the Muslim cleric imprisoned in America for his part in a plot to blow up the World Trade Centre in 1993."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/september11/story/0,11209,718312,00.html

4. Sunday Herald: Britain warned Bush to expect 9-11 al-Qaeda hijackings

"Britain gave President Bush a categorical warning to expect multiple airline hijackings by the al-Qaeda network a month before the September 11 attacks which killed nearly 3000 people and triggered the international war against terrorism."

http://www.sundayherald.com/24822

5. Village Voice: Officials Warned of Plans to Attack DC, NY with Planes

"The U.S. government had received repeated warnings of impending attacks?and attacks using planes directed at New York and Washington?for several years. The government never told us about what it knew was coming."

http://www.villagevoice.com/issues/0332/mondo4.php

6. AP: 9/11 report, Rice conflict; Bush got specific data on threats

"...the briefing given to the president a month before the suicide hijackings included recent intelligence that al-Qaida was planning to send operatives to the United States to carry out an attack using high explosives."

http://www.sunspot.net/business/nationworld/bal-te.rice29jul29,0,2620591.story?coll=bal-business-headlines

7. MSNBC: White House Briefed on Imminent bin Laden Attack

"One such CIA briefing, in July 2001, was particularly chilling and prophetic. It predicted that Osama bin Laden was about to launch a terrorist strike 'in the coming weeks,' the congressional investigators found. The intelligence briefing went on to say: 'The attack will be spectacular and designed to inflict mass casualties against U.S. facilities or interests. Attack preparations have been made. Attack will occur with little or no warning.'"

http://msnbc.msn.com/id/3067907/

8. MSN: Condoleezza Rice's False Statement

A: "The overwhelming bulk of the evidence was that this was an attack that was likely to take place overseas."

- White House National Security Adviser Condoleezza Rice, in a May 16 news briefing.

B: "Bin Laden Determined to Strike in U.S."

- Title of the CIA's Aug. 6 briefing memo to President Bush . . .

http://slate.msn.com/?id=2066154

9. Newsweek: Day before 9-11, Pentagon Generals Cancelled Flights

"On Sept. 10, NEWSWEEK has learned, a group of top Pentagon officials suddenly canceled travel plans for the next morning, apparently because of security concerns."

http://www.msnbc.com/news/629606.asp (link dead)

10. SF Gate: Mayor got 8-hour warning Before 9-11 Attacks ? September 12, 2001

For Mayor Willie Brown, the first signs that something was amiss came late Monday when he got a call from what he described as his airport security - - a full eight hours before yesterday's string of terrorist attacks -- advising him that Americans should be cautious about their air travel.

11. Florida State: Jeb Bush Declares Martial Law 9-7-01

"Based on the potential massive damage to life and property that may result from an act of terrorism at a Florida port, the necessity to protect life and property from such acts of terrorism..."

http://www.state.fl.us/eog_new/eog/orders/2001/september/eo2001-261-09-07-01.html

12. CBS News: Ashcroft Avoided Commercial Travel Prior to 9-11

"In response to inquiries from CBS News over why Ashcroft was traveling exclusively by leased jet aircraft instead of commercial airlines, the Justice Department cited what it called a "threat assessment" by the FBI, and said Ashcroft has been advised to travel only by private jet for the remainder of his term."

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2001/07/26/national/printable303601.shtml

13. UK Independent: Taliban Mole Warning Ignored

"Weeks before the terrorist attacks on 11 September, the United States and the United Nations ignored warnings from a secret Taliban emissary that Osama bin Laden was planning a huge attack on American soil."

http://news.independent.co.uk/world/politics/story.jsp?story=331115

14. NY Times: "President Mubarek Warned US of Al Qaeda Plot”

"Egyptian intelligence warned American officials about a week before Sept. 11 that Osama bin Laden's network was in the advance stages of executing a significant operation against an American target, President Hosni Mubarak said in an interview on Sunday."

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/abstract.html?res=F30D16F73B5E0C778CDDAF0894DA404482

15. Village Voice: US Ignored France Warnings

"A key point in unraveling why the FBI failed to follow up leads on Al Qaeda terrorism now centers on the Bureau's contemptuously brushing aside warnings from French intelligence a few days before 9-11."

http://www.villagevoice.com/issues/0222/ridgeway2.php

16. Intl. Herald Tribune: White House Ignored Arab Warnings

"When the hubbub about what the White House did or didn't know before Sept. 11 dies down, Congressional or other investigators should consider the specific warnings that friendly Arab intelligence services sent to Washington in the summer of 2001."

http://www.iht.com/articles/58269.html

17. UK News-Telegraph: Israel issued urgent warning of large-scale terror attacks

Israeli intelligence officials say that they warned their counterparts in the United States last month that large-scale terrorist attacks on highly visible targets on the American mainland were imminent."

http://news.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml;$sessionid$52PMOXQAADW5PQFIQMGSFFOAVCBQWIV0?xml=/news/2001/09/16/wcia16.xml&sSheet=/news/2001/09/16/ixhome

18. NY Post: FBI Warned D.C. It Was A Target

"A Minnesota FBI agent investigating Zacarias Moussaoui testified yesterday that he notified the Secret Service weeks before Sept. 11 that a terror team might hijack a plane and 'hit the nation's capital.'"

http://www.nypost.com/news/nationalnews/57848.htm

19. Yahoo News: FBI Warnings Ignored

"An FBI supervisor, sounding a prophetic pre-Sept. 11 alarm, warned FBI headquarters that student pilot Zacarias Moussaoui was so dangerous he might 'take control of a plane and fly it into the World Trade Center,' a congressional investigator said in a report Tuesday."

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story2&cid=512&ncid=716&e=4&u=/ap/20020924/ap_on_go_co/attacks_intelligence

20. Independent: America had 12 warnings of aircraft attack

"American intelligence received many more clues before the 11 September attacks than previously disclosed, that terrorists might hijack planes and turn them into weapons, a joint congressional committee was told yesterday."

http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/story.jsp?story=334633

21. Washington Post: 9/11 Probe Says Agencies Failed to Heed Attack Signs

"U.S. intelligence agencies received many more indications than previously disclosed that Osama bin Laden's terrorist network was planning imminent "spectacular" attacks in the summer of 2001 aimed at inflicting mass casualties."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A36754-2002Sep18.html

22. Yahoo News: Spy Agencies Had Pre-9/11 Threats on U.S. Soil

"U.S. intelligence agencies picked up threats of attacks inside the United States and of using airplanes as weapons during the spring and summer before last year's Sept. 11 attacks, but were more focused on the possibility of an assault overseas, a congressional source said on Tuesday."

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story2&cid=578&ncid=578&e=1&u=/nm/20020917/ts_nm/attack_congress_intelligence_dc

23. Vanity Fair: Bin Laden Relatives Secretly Evacuated From NY

"Patrick Tyler of the New York Times is reporting from Washington: 'In the first days after the attacks on Sept. 11, the Saudi Arabian ambasador to Washington, Prince Bandar ibn Sultan, supervised the urgent evacuation of 24 members of Osama bin Laden's extended family from the United States fearing they might be subjected to violence.'"

http://www.guerrillanews.com/cgi-bin/wwwthreads/showflat.pl?Cat=&Board=gnn&Number=204363&page=1&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=0&part=all

24. Sydney Morning Herald: Administration Told US agents “Back off bin Ladens”

"US special agents were told to back off the bin Laden family and the Saudi royals soon after George Bush became president, although that has all changed since September 11, it was reported today."

http://www.old.smh.com.au/news/0111/07/world/world100.html

25. Ha'aretz Daily: CEO Says Workers Warned Hours Before World Trade Center Hit -- FBI Investigating

"Odigo, the instant messaging service, says that two of its workers received messages two hours before the Twin Towers attack on September 11 predicting the attack would happen, and the company has been cooperating with Israeli and American law enforcement, including the FBI, in trying to find the original sender of the message predicting the attack."

http://www.haaretzdaily.com/hasen/pages/ShArt.jhtml?itemNo=77744

26. NY Times: White House Approved Secret Evacuation of Bin Ladens After 9-11

"Richard Clarke, who ran White House crisis team after Sept 11 terror attacks, says top White House officials personally approved evacuation of dozens of influential Saudis, including relatives of Osama bin Laden, from United States in days after Sept 11, when most flights were grounded." http://www.truthout.org/docs_03/090503A.shtml

27. Tampa Tribune: Bodyguards tell of Secret Bin Laden Flight

"The hastily arranged flight out of Raytheon Airport Services, a private hangar on the outskirts of Tampa International Airport, was anything but ordinary. It lifted off the tarmac at a time when every private plane in the nation was grounded due to safety concerns after the Sept. 11 attacks. "

http://www.dirtybush.com/connectthesedots.html

28. UK Minister: "Bush had Foreknowledge of 9-11 attacks"

"...it is not surprising that some have seen the US failure to avert the 9/11 attacks as creating an invaluable pretext for attacking Afghanistan in a war that had clearly already been well planned in advance."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/september11/story/0,11209,1036588,00.html

 

and for good measure i will post this cringe worthy embarrassing video again

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k3I2iQ65Hng

[karmakramer]

I think because Cheney and Bush have lied many times in the past and misled the public, and because that "Press for Truth" documentary raises many interesting questions, its unreasonable to assume anything. Which includes finding 9/11 conspiracy information laughable. I mean does no one else find it odd how much the Bush administration talked about 9/11 when campaigning? Their constant need to remind the public is evidence of their favoritism of what happened, at least in terms of how it helped improve their parties position in the US. They divided this country by radicalizing their own supporters, and now they have created a monster that believes anything and everything they say. If that isn't a nicely wrapped present from Osama to Bush, I don't what is. You'd think the biggest attack on American soil would have been treated with more respect and honor by someone who was truly devastated on that day.

 

I wouldn't be surprised if the GOP also wanted Obama to beat out Hilary, because it would keep the news/media focused on this stupidity (muslims are the devil!). There doesn't need to be any truth to anything the GOP says anymore. They are a force which minds no one and repeats anything until it sticks, which it has and will continue doing. This war has just begun, and as much as I love the history of the United States, I don't know how much longer I can stay. We are living in times of true fear under a monopolistic media state. Fear sells and the GOP is providing ample doses of it. We have become addicted.

[awepittance]

i just can't believe that so many people are willing to give a sociopathic administration the benefit of the doubt that they were 'incompetent' on 9/11.

 

back before the 2004 election it wasn't as 'taboo' to suggest Bush had specific foreknowledge of 9/11, now the neocons have effectively squashed that debate as 'a conspiracy theory'

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b_SDGb-TJcU&p=B72F5A0C61E8A423&playnext=1&index=34

[karmakramer]

It truly is amazing Awepittance. It all comes down to human nature though and our fear of being accused of stupidity. Logical questions though are a sign of intelligence in my opinion, and the questions that have been rasied in some of the links you have provided are logical and they deserve answers.

[delet...]

Re: et

 

what did you expect. it's always been an uphill battle pushing things like this. I remember the hard time we used to have just trying to convince people that the iraq and afghan wars were a wrong and that we needed to exit them pronto. Over time though people have come around. Like i said, you just have to keep chipping away, don't lose heart. And most of all don't be a sour grapes holding whiny schnizenor.

 

you're not trying to equate "not believing in illuminati conspiracy" with "agreeing with the invasions of Afghanistan and Iraq" right?

 

Oh, really !!>? Is that what was getting him down, my bad for just assuming that it was about 11-09 just cause that's what it says on the outside of this threads tin and i didn't bother reading any of the threads insides beyond the previous page.

 

But illuminati eh, haha soz.