takeshi Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 Btw. am I the only who think that the bad guy seemed like some 80s bad guy from an Arnold movie? He was one of the best things about the film to me. I wanted to see more of him being a badass. For Awepittance, I saw it again the other day and I still like it. The dialogue is cheesy in places and the storyline didn't really go anywhere unexpected but I give it more of a pass than I normally would because the world created is so immersive. I don't think I've ever seen face capture used so well in a film, usually the lips are off or the eyes seem like they don't focus on anything. The best compliment I can pay is that after a while I didn't notice I was watching special effects. Also, 3D really is the only way to see this film. Did anyone else notice the terrible wig, Jake was wearing through the second half of the film, after he'd shaved his beard? It was just weird to me because I noticed little things like how they digitally replaced his legs, to show how atrophied they were but nobody noticed or said anything about the shitty wig he was wearing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaen Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 just saw it i can sum it up like this: meh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khov Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 i think that was fabulous, truly mindblowing but also a bit dumb. its like a fireworks i would just have enjoyed a better or more original screenplay (its Mission vs dances with wolves vs Pocahontas), nothing new under the sun, no characters (the gi joe dude !?). but still fantastic to watch. well, i'm more into bergman, so.. :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest analogue wings Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 Some movies you hear about for so long that you almost don’t really believe you’ll ever see it. You always think of it as being something far off in the distance somewhere, then next thing you know it’s there and you weren’t even ready. Everybody’s rushing to get their thoughts online, but I’m a little slower than some people because I want time to process it. I know alot of people are curious what I think about this highly anticipated sci-fi release. I’m sure opinions will be all over the place, but I gotta say that no matter whether you are disappointed or blown away it’s really exciting to see an old favorite coming back, trying to give the fans something new. It’s quite a time to be a fan of these types of movies. I’m talking of course about UNIVERSAL SOLDIER 3, the new one which is gonna reunite Dolph Lundgren with Jean-Claude Van Damme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zazen Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 Just got back from seeing it, I've been reading about this movie and wondering what it would be like for six months. I really liked it, in a kind of - "if we are going to have blockbuster movies, I'd rather they be like this" kind of way. Something like Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind, or I Heart Huckabees, or Memento or (insert your favourite thoughtful movie here) will always impress me more than a blockbuster like Avatar, but its still a very fine film and I'm very impressed by Cameron's talents, which stretch from the very technical side right the way across to the artistic realm. We all pretty much agree that the visuals are amazing. Plot and story wise: although I knew quite a lot about this movie from watching the trailers and reading the various leaks over the last six months, and I pretty much knew how the story was going to play out (I mean, you can figure that out from the trailer) there were still lots of parts that made me think 'oh, thats a neat way of doing that'. If you havent seen it yet, dont read my Spoiler, because I'm going to talk about those neat bits: Most of all, and most thought provoking of all: I knew this was a film where the humans were the invaders and the bad guys, but it took that concept to quite an extreme. The line near the end of the movie: "The Aliens were sent back home to their dying planet" ... think about that line and the implications ... the movie doesnt really spell it out, but it hints earlier on that Earth is in deep shit and Unobtainium is so valuable because its helping to solve that problem, or work around the problem. Avatar ends with Jake leaving his human body behind, and a couple of his scientist friends staying with the Na'vi. The rest of the humans are sent back to their wrecked planet, where presumably they will die as a species unless they find another planet like Pandora to exploit, or come back and try to take Pandora again. This film's happy ending is basically hinting at the end of the human race. Thats pretty radical for a blockbuster that millions of people will see. I thought this film would be more like the humans and the na'vi coming to an understanding, learning how to co-exist in the universe, or something. But thats not how it ends. Think about other big sci-fi films/franchises: Independence Day - humans win there, by being human. Sure, there are some bad humans in that film, but overall humanity wins through. Or, say, Transformers - the giant robots find some useful and spirited allies in some of the humans, and they fight on together. Star Trek - humans rock, in those stories. Doctor Who - the doctor admires the human spirit, and is generally very interested in protecting them. Granted, the idea that humans suck as a species is not particularly original in Sci-fi, but its pretty unusual in big-budget blockbuster seen-by-millions Sci-Fi. In the final confrontation with Quaritch, when he says "How does it feel to be a traitor to your race, Sully?", Quaritch is literally right. Its not just that he sees things differently from Jake, a political disagreement about the best way forward for the human race. It is literally true - Jake's actions, in getting the planet to unite against the humans, may well lead to the destruction of his (former) race. Also, artistically, there's something obvious but powerful going on in parallel with this message - as a viewer you naturally identify more and more with Jake and the Na'vi, and enjoy the Pandora scenes much more than the grey, dull human scenes in the base. So at the end when you see your race being packed off home to oblivion, you totally go with it. A lot of reviews have said that the movie has an environmental message - and thats true, but its sortof more than that. Its like a meta-environmental message: that humans are fatally flawed, will most likely mess up this planet, and then if the universe is really unlucky, they'll make it into space and start messing up other places too. Avatar, like Bill Hicks, views humans as basically 'A virus with shoes'. I could go on about that for a while (like, is Cameron just choosing such a message because its topical, or has all his underwater nature study made him really believe that?). In a time when we real humans are struggling to make an agreement to (rightly or wrongly) limit Co2 emissions, which is a short step along a road we have to face someday - that is, learning how to live as a race on a planet with limited resources - and in a week where we failed quite badly to even make short steps along that path, this aspect of the film really affected me. But here's the other stuff that I thought was neat: - the bit where he says "but who's got a date with the chief's daughter?" - Tsu'Tey the chief-in-waiting, who loses Neytiri as a mate, and then gets upstaged by Jake. His character arc is predictable, sure, but I liked the way it was done, and his death scene was epic - when Augustine is wounded, Jake does not go to human technology to help her, but goes the Na'vi way. And I kinda like that she gets uploaded into the planet-mind - Neytiri was awesome in so many scenes and in so many ways - Jake was a very likable protagonist, and the whole thing about him being in a wheelchair was a very well chosen device - I really liked how conflicted Jake is in the middle of the movie - he would rather stay with the Na'vi than get his legs back, but he is still stuck in a web of confused purposes. Again, I knew this would be part of the story but I really like the way it was done. When he's in the base with Quaritch and Augustine and Quaritch plays one of his reports back to him, you can see how lost he is. The confused way he tried to help the Na'vi by getting them to leave home tree, and the predicament he is in after that - not trusted by the Na'vi or the humans - I really felt for him at that point. And the way he finds out of that predicament is suitably paradigm-shifting. - the kiss between Neytiri and Jake - I knew that scene was coming, but I thought the scene was really well done, and it was amazing to think that I was watching two CGI creatures kiss - when Neytiris mother helps Jake and Augustine escape from their bonds just before the fall of Hometree - thought that was a nice touch - the scene where Neytiri meets Jake in his human body - again, I had guessed that they would meet like that at some point in the movie - cos thats just such a sci-fi type thing to happen - but it was beautifully done. - how totally badass Quaritch was, on two occasions just popping an airlock so he could shoot at Jake, and not really worrying about stuff like being able to breathe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Etch Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 I didnt like avatar for the same reasons i dont like psytrance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Siegecow Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 your a fag? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred McGriff Posted December 22, 2009 Author Share Posted December 22, 2009 - the kiss between Neytiri and Jake - I knew that scene was coming, but I thought the scene was really well done, and it was amazing to think that I was watching two CGI creatures kiss - when Neytiris mother helps Jake and Augustine escape from their bonds just before the fall of Hometree - thought that was a nice touch - the scene where Neytiri meets Jake in his human body - again, I had guessed that they would meet like that at some point in the movie - cos thats just such a sci-fi type thing to happen - but it was beautifully done. - how totally badass Quaritch was, on two occasions just popping an airlock so he could shoot at Jake, and not really worrying about stuff like being able to breathe what's cool about the kiss is that jake probably had two boners at the same time, his navi boner and his regular human boner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lumpenprol Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 I still haven't seen the flick, but in regards to any kissing, don't forget there was a kiss in the Final Fantasy movie too. In fact I was very surprised that that kiss went over as well as it did; it was much less laughable than I expected going into it. I can only imagine since things have improved since then that it's even more compelling in Avatar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awepittance Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 Just got back from seeing it, I've been reading about this movie and wondering what it would be like for six months. I really liked it, in a kind of - "if we are going to have blockbuster movies, I'd rather they be like this" kind of way. Something like Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind, or I Heart Huckabees, or Memento or (insert your favourite thoughtful movie here) will always impress me more than a blockbuster like Avatar, but its still a very fine film and I'm very impressed by Cameron's talents, which stretch from the very technical side right the way across to the artistic realm. We all pretty much agree that the visuals are amazing. Plot and story wise: although I knew quite a lot about this movie from watching the trailers and reading the various leaks over the last six months, and I pretty much knew how the story was going to play out (I mean, you can figure that out from the trailer) there were still lots of parts that made me think 'oh, thats a neat way of doing that'. If you havent seen it yet, dont read my Spoiler, because I'm going to talk about those neat bits: Most of all, and most thought provoking of all: I knew this was a film where the humans were the invaders and the bad guys, but it took that concept to quite an extreme. The line near the end of the movie: "The Aliens were sent back home to their dying planet" ... think about that line and the implications ... the movie doesnt really spell it out, but it hints earlier on that Earth is in deep shit and Unobtainium is so valuable because its helping to solve that problem, or work around the problem. Avatar ends with Jake leaving his human body behind, and a couple of his scientist friends staying with the Na'vi. The rest of the humans are sent back to their wrecked planet, where presumably they will die as a species unless they find another planet like Pandora to exploit, or come back and try to take Pandora again. This film's happy ending is basically hinting at the end of the human race. Thats pretty radical for a blockbuster that millions of people will see. I thought this film would be more like the humans and the na'vi coming to an understanding, learning how to co-exist in the universe, or something. But thats not how it ends. Think about other big sci-fi films/franchises: Independence Day - humans win there, by being human. Sure, there are some bad humans in that film, but overall humanity wins through. Or, say, Transformers - the giant robots find some useful and spirited allies in some of the humans, and they fight on together. Star Trek - humans rock, in those stories. Doctor Who - the doctor admires the human spirit, and is generally very interested in protecting them. Granted, the idea that humans suck as a species is not particularly original in Sci-fi, but its pretty unusual in big-budget blockbuster seen-by-millions Sci-Fi. In the final confrontation with Quaritch, when he says "How does it feel to be a traitor to your race, Sully?", Quaritch is literally right. Its not just that he sees things differently from Jake, a political disagreement about the best way forward for the human race. It is literally true - Jake's actions, in getting the planet to unite against the humans, may well lead to the destruction of his (former) race. Also, artistically, there's something obvious but powerful going on in parallel with this message - as a viewer you naturally identify more and more with Jake and the Na'vi, and enjoy the Pandora scenes much more than the grey, dull human scenes in the base. So at the end when you see your race being packed off home to oblivion, you totally go with it. A lot of reviews have said that the movie has an environmental message - and thats true, but its sortof more than that. Its like a meta-environmental message: that humans are fatally flawed, will most likely mess up this planet, and then if the universe is really unlucky, they'll make it into space and start messing up other places too. Avatar, like Bill Hicks, views humans as basically 'A virus with shoes'. I could go on about that for a while (like, is Cameron just choosing such a message because its topical, or has all his underwater nature study made him really believe that?). In a time when we real humans are struggling to make an agreement to (rightly or wrongly) limit Co2 emissions, which is a short step along a road we have to face someday - that is, learning how to live as a race on a planet with limited resources - and in a week where we failed quite badly to even make short steps along that path, this aspect of the film really affected me. But here's the other stuff that I thought was neat: - the bit where he says "but who's got a date with the chief's daughter?" - Tsu'Tey the chief-in-waiting, who loses Neytiri as a mate, and then gets upstaged by Jake. His character arc is predictable, sure, but I liked the way it was done, and his death scene was epic - when Augustine is wounded, Jake does not go to human technology to help her, but goes the Na'vi way. And I kinda like that she gets uploaded into the planet-mind - Neytiri was awesome in so many scenes and in so many ways - Jake was a very likable protagonist, and the whole thing about him being in a wheelchair was a very well chosen device - I really liked how conflicted Jake is in the middle of the movie - he would rather stay with the Na'vi than get his legs back, but he is still stuck in a web of confused purposes. Again, I knew this would be part of the story but I really like the way it was done. When he's in the base with Quaritch and Augustine and Quaritch plays one of his reports back to him, you can see how lost he is. The confused way he tried to help the Na'vi by getting them to leave home tree, and the predicament he is in after that - not trusted by the Na'vi or the humans - I really felt for him at that point. And the way he finds out of that predicament is suitably paradigm-shifting. - the kiss between Neytiri and Jake - I knew that scene was coming, but I thought the scene was really well done, and it was amazing to think that I was watching two CGI creatures kiss - when Neytiris mother helps Jake and Augustine escape from their bonds just before the fall of Hometree - thought that was a nice touch - the scene where Neytiri meets Jake in his human body - again, I had guessed that they would meet like that at some point in the movie - cos thats just such a sci-fi type thing to happen - but it was beautifully done. - how totally badass Quaritch was, on two occasions just popping an airlock so he could shoot at Jake, and not really worrying about stuff like being able to breathe great effin breakdown, loved reading the stuff in your spoiler tags! a lot of reviewers are complaining about a 'generic' heavy handed message, but what they fail to mention is what you did in the top parts of your spoiler. I really don't think a movie since maybe ET or the day the earth stood still (original) has a movie delivered a similar message with the same impact and also was nice to read kcinsu's review i have to ask zazen, how in hell do you explain to a small child (and im assuming you might have attempted to since you took some to it) how the Navi in Avatar are not 'real' and how Pandora is not a real place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lala Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 oh, and people, sit so the screen is almost filling your view. i went to 2 other films to calibrate my 3d at my cinema, and we booked the best seats in the house. made a difference, we loved it. amazing visuals Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred McGriff Posted December 22, 2009 Author Share Posted December 22, 2009 i wonder if jake was navi horny or if he had human fetish horniness for navi. like when he is occupying the navi body does that mean he feels the traditional navi horniness or what. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
o00o Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 i wonder if jake was navi horny or if he had human fetish horniness for navi. like when he is occupying the navi body does that mean he feels the traditional navi horniness or what. lol post of the day Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zazen Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 i have to ask zazen, how in hell do you explain to a small child (and im assuming you might have attempted to since you took some to it) how the Navi in Avatar are not 'real' and how Pandora is not a real place. I went with my nephews who are 12 and 15, so no reality-explaining problems for them. They both said it was 'good' but weren't as fundamentally impressed as me. I guess they are used to growing up in a world where graphics are improving on a Moore's-law curve, and they don't have the history of I do of seeing T2 and Aliens as a kid. They could appreciate the step change though. Perhaps they're just both better at keeping their cool than me : ) oh, and people, sit so the screen is almost filling your view. i went to 2 other films to calibrate my 3d at my cinema, and we booked the best seats in the house. made a difference, we loved it. amazing visuals Back in August I saw the 15-minute preview footage in 3D at an iMax, and yesterday I saw the movie on a regular sized screen in 3D. There really was a big difference as far as I can tell: because the iMax screen is so much bigger, the depth of the 3D is proportionally bigger too. The 3D on the regular screen was good, but perhaps too subtle (or perhaps it was so good that I just wasn't noticing it), whereas the 3D on iMax was more constantly impressive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zazen Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 what's cool about the kiss is that jake probably had two boners at the same time, his navi boner and his regular human boner. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
o00o Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 Back in August I saw the 15-minute preview footage in 3D at an iMax, and yesterday I saw the movie on a regular sized screen in 3D. There really was a big difference as far as I can tell: because the iMax screen is so much bigger, the depth of the 3D is proportionally bigger too. The 3D on the regular screen was good, but perhaps too subtle (or perhaps it was so good that I just wasn't noticing it), whereas the 3D on iMax was more constantly impressive. I still have to do this it was very impressive in the normal 3d version so I am really curious about the imax one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zazen Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 other neat stuff: - the start, when jakes coming out of the shuttle in his wheelchair, and a big mining truck goes past with na'vi arrows stuck into its tyres - the fact the the Amp suits have an ignition key and exhaust fans out the back - I really liked the framing of the shot when Jake, Grace and the other scientist are in the jail cell, with jake slumped over in his wheelchair between the other two 18 hours after seeing this film I have a strange urge to return to that world ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred McGriff Posted December 22, 2009 Author Share Posted December 22, 2009 blue boobie sides cookie monster has a navi boner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
o00o Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 other neat stuff: - the start, when jakes coming out of the shuttle in his wheelchair, and a big mining truck goes past with na'vi arrows stuck into its tyres - the fact the the Amp suits have an ignition key and exhaust fans out the back - I really liked the framing of the shot when Jake, Grace and the other scientist are in the jail cell, with jake slumped over in his wheelchair between the other two 18 hours after seeing this film I have a strange urge to return to that world ... yeah me too I really have to be stopped from seeing it tonight even so I have just seen it yesterday Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Benedict Cumberbatch Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 i liked how the navi had tiny blue boobies but sighorny weaver designed her avatar to have a huge rack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred McGriff Posted December 22, 2009 Author Share Posted December 22, 2009 that is an astute observation as are most of zazen's. nice work fellas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Benedict Cumberbatch Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 YOUR REAL LEGS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awepittance Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 *throws air punches in amp suit* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Calx Sherbet Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 http://www.mtv.com/movies/news/articles/1535402/06292006/story.jhtml Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Benedict Cumberbatch Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 it was great but please no sequel(s). do something new. it could really (jake)sully the 1st avatar film to make sucky cash in sequels Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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