plstik Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 BECK: Hang on, let me just tell you what I'm thinking. I'm thinking about killing Michael Moore, and I'm wondering if I could kill him myself, or if I would need to hire somebody to do it. No, I think I could. I think he could be looking me in the eye, you know, and I could just be choking the life out -- is this wrong? I stopped wearing my What Would Jesus -- band -- Do, and I've lost all sense of right and wrong now. I used to be able to say, "Yeah, I'd kill Michael Moore," and then I'd see the little band: What Would Jesus Do? And then I'd realize, "Oh, you wouldn't kill Michael Moore. Or at least you wouldn't choke him to death." And you know, well, I'm not sure. http://videocafe.crooksandliars.com/heather/bill-moyers-journal-rage-radio needs no explanation. (sry if jazz) I bet there are more statements like this already out there, luckily the Internet doesnt forget. But lets see what people will do with that. As I see it people will be disgusted -again- by Palin etc, like they were when they could decide between Obama/McCain. But then again I´m fom europe and I dont know if there is anything else besides the Tea Party movement on the Republican side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azatoth Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Glenn Beck is just saying crazy shit so the real crazies will buy his books, listen to his shows and basically give him money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J3FF3R00 Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 ... which makes it ok. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azatoth Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 FREE SPEACH..MAH CONSTITUTION!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acidphakist Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Politics **yaaaaawwwwnnnn** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J3FF3R00 Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Politics **yaaaaawwwwnnnn** Sounds like you may actually care. Otherwise, you would be posting in the video games thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SR4 Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Politics **yaaaaawwwwnnnn** Sounds like you may actually care. Otherwise, you would be posting in the video games thread. get real plz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awepittance Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 acid **yawwwwwwwwwwwnnnn** sorry i couldn't help myself Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J3FF3R00 Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Politics **yaaaaawwwwnnnn** Sounds like you may actually care. Otherwise, you would be posting in the video games thread. get real plz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patternoverlap Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Because of the severe lack of attention and facilities for people in poor mental health combined with the irresponsible behavior and rhetoric spewed forth by various media outlets, there will be more of this kind of event. . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest yikes Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Because of the severe lack of attention and facilities for people in poor mental health combined with the irresponsible behavior and rhetoric spewed forth by various media outlets, there will be more of this kind of event. . indeed you left out the ease at which anyone can arm themselves cheaply and also i see this as a continuum of karmic debt-for the whole violent country's actions since it's formation America was founded on genocide and violence and racism after all the shootings its hard to be shocked anymore-this is fruition in a metaphysical sense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dale Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Because of the severe lack of attention and facilities for people in poor mental health combined with the irresponsible behavior and rhetoric spewed forth by various media outlets, there will be more of this kind of event. . truth Also, the rhetoric used by the media against the suspect is just breeding more hatred and less understanding. Again, I strongly emphasise that this incident is terrible, but the only way we can progress from here is if we can adopt empathic, rehabilitation methods to assist with his overall psychology as a society. Unfortunately, no matter how much you punish him, you won't bring the victims back to life, so it is an irrelevant, unproductive process. In the words of prison psychiatrist Dr. James Gilligan = "Punishment is just another word for revenge". Restraint to protect society: Yes Punishment or death penalty?: No. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred McGriff Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 n the words of prison psychiatrist Dr. James Gilligan = "Punishment is just another word for revenge". Restraint to protect society: Yes Punishment or death penalty?: No. What's your take on punishment as a deterrent? I'm just wondering if you might risk incentivizing some individuals to get locked up if there's a cush responsibility-free life waiting on the other side of the bars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acidphakist Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 All I'm seeing here is a shit ton of pseudo-intellectual rhetoric bandied by people who, I'm willing to bet, have never once taken to the streets to do anything to promote their own political viewpoints. **yawn** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dale Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 All I'm seeing here is a shit ton of pseudo-intellectual rhetoric bandied by people who, I'm willing to bet, have never once taken to the streets to do anything to promote their own political viewpoints. **yawn** yes I am active in communicating what I'm saying here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dale Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 What's your take on punishment as a deterrent? I'm just wondering if you might risk incentivizing some individuals to get locked up if there's a cush responsibility-free life waiting on the other side of the bars. I understand your concern and it is something I have thought about. The best way of tackling crime is by adopting and rehaping society to promote preventative methods before a crime even occurs. Ultimately, schooling has to change if we want kids to grow into emotionally intelligent adults - meaning that they are shown on how to relate to one another, being empathic towards one another and generally adopting excellent interpersonal skills before they set out into the wider world. From a young age, if you can condition an environment that promotes the well being of everyone in society - I think crime would dramatically decrease if this is implemented correctly. People would feel they are going against sustainable values heavily instilled during school life if they wanted to consider committing a crime against someone. In short, education is the key, and has to fall in place from an early age. But is punishment a deterrent though? Do criminals who commit emotionally driven crimes really consider the long term aspects of their life, and worry about prison for that matter? If you're interested in studying this sort of stuff, I strongly recommend grabbing one of Gilligan's books on violence. I would spend a little more time ranting but I have an assignment to do and it is a little tricky! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sup Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 i knowed some guys like the dude probably, there a bit wierd like a irl troll, or maybe there juist crazy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dale Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 i knowed some guys like the dude probably, there a bit wierd like a irl troll, or maybe there juist crazy Society did a lot of the shaping of this guy. Things that seem completely minimal like calling him a derogatory name in school can easily contribute toward his unhealthy state of mind. Sidenote -- I recall reading an article some where, which basically described an account given by one of his co-workers (not a friend, I think it was just someone he worked with) and when his friend explained that "he needed to get his life back on track", he burst out crying... perhaps he had difficulty opening up to people about his emotions and state of mind? Maybe his parents weren't a lot of help to him? I don't know, I am just speculating here.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred McGriff Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 What's your take on punishment as a deterrent? I'm just wondering if you might risk incentivizing some individuals to get locked up if there's a cush responsibility-free life waiting on the other side of the bars. I understand your concern and it is something I have thought about. The best way of tackling crime is by adopting and rehaping society to promote preventative methods before a crime even occurs. Ultimately, schooling has to change if we want kids to grow into emotionally intelligent adults - meaning that they are shown on how to relate to one another, being empathic towards one another and generally adopting excellent interpersonal skills before they set out into the wider world. From a young age, if you can condition an environment that promotes the well being of everyone in society - I think crime would dramatically decrease if this is implemented correctly. People would feel they are going against sustainable values heavily instilled during school life if they wanted to consider committing a crime against someone. In short, education is the key, and has to fall in place from an early age. But is punishment a deterrent though? Do criminals who commit emotionally driven crimes really consider the long term aspects of their life, and worry about prison for that matter? If you're interested in studying this sort of stuff, I strongly recommend grabbing one of Gilligan's books on violence. I would spend a little more time ranting but I have an assignment to do and it is a little tricky! I would say punishment is an imperfect, at least somewhat effective, but extremely hard to measure deterrent. Agreed that education is key and admire your stance but I don't have the optimism that you do -- at least not in the case of a society like the US with so much diversity in every volatile aspect of living. But you do have to try. And yes this sort of stuff is very interesting me, will check out Gilligan, thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SR4 Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 All I'm seeing here is a shit ton of pseudo-intellectual rhetoric bandied by people who, I'm willing to bet, have never once taken to the streets to do anything to promote their own political viewpoints. **yawn** sorry to say this, but if you do what you say, then you are part of the problem. what we need to act on is not enforcement or spread of political viewpoints. what we need is morality, egalitarianism, common sense, logic, rationality, and above all, compassion, patience, and understanding for people in similar situations that might not fully understand what is happening to and around them. all they know is anger and fear, and they are constantly fed that there is a section of society that is different from them, wants them to suffer even more, wants them to die, thinks they are stupid wastes of life...how do you expect them to react? im not excusing the behavior of anyone, but that's precisely the problem: you see me as excusing it. you want an excuse to throw your anger, bias, and judgmental predispositions on something that isn't the problem, but rather a potential means to slowly ameliorate what is truly destroying this world. you think you are being logical, but what you really want is revenge, suffering to those that don't "get it", to those that you perceive the same types of action and illogical thinking. you want affirmation of your own righteousness, and do not seem to hesitate to play that out wherever possible (i.e. here). and that's how they win. what can be done, and what can be a positive move forward is ACTUAL calm, rational discourse, not yelling at each other across the room. take away the terms left, right, Republican, Democrat. Take out church, God, atheism, race, Islam, and so forth. Move from there. It can be said a million times that you should "talk it out". Yet how many people have the patience, compassion, or tolerance to do so? "Talking it out" is probably the most shat upon way to deal with a situation these days, because quite simply, our way of "talking to each other" is nothing short of primitive pissing contests. and you enforce that by mocking the degree of their activism. watch what Al Franken does here. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SCNs7Zpqo98 try to put aside your beliefs in whatever side you support, or even if you support it all,just stop for a second and listen, actually observe what is taking place here. this is what needs to happen, and it does not happen nearly enough. its far easier to judge and tear each other apart than it is to unite in understanding of each others positions. now im not an idealist. i honestly dont think this is possible anymore. i think we are far too content to make fun and sling shit to feel superior to each other than actually struggle to understand what opposing sides are saying. and i am surely as guilty of it as anyone else in the human race. anyway,say what you want, ive said my piece. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awepittance Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 acidphakist's viewpoints seem fairly typical of one who has 'checked out' of current events and chooses not follow or care much about them (Which is perfectly respectable by the way, i think if you can do this go for it with your all) but as soon as you start judging someone for having passion on an issue who aren't expressing it in the form you prefer, it gets kinda fucking stupid (it's almost akin to saying 'dude you'll never be as rich as george lucas so stop whining about Phantom menace and try making your own star wars movie') and as Smettingham points out, you are frankly more a part of the problem than the arm chair political activists you complain about Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awepittance Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 the Right-wing is doing a massive push back of the attempts to tie this Jared kid to the Right-wing Tea Party movement. this microcosm of talking point wars is very illustrative, of what you might ask? About how much fucking better the republicans are at playing the info-war, just go look at Drudgereport.com to see what i mean or better yet the front page of Foxnews right now. edit: that was actually a really excellent Al Franken video. i wish Al Franken was that thoughtful when he actually casts yay votes on awful policy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest EDGEY Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 The most shocking thing about this event... is that I wasn't shocked by it. Makes me wonder how desensitized I am really am. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lumpenprol Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 Society did a lot of the shaping of this guy. Things that seem completely minimal like calling him a derogatory name in school can easily contribute toward his unhealthy state of mind. lol? I mean you're right I suppose, but I hope you're not drawing any ideas about what would be just punishment based on that. We've all been bullied. This guy just went nuts for whatever reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dale Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 Society did a lot of the shaping of this guy. Things that seem completely minimal like calling him a derogatory name in school can easily contribute toward his unhealthy state of mind. lol? I mean you're right I suppose, but I hope you're not drawing any ideas about what would be just punishment based on that. We've all been bullied. This guy just went nuts for whatever reason. yeah but we all have different experiences, exposed to different people in different environments. Genetics can hold propensities but do not directly "enact" behaviour -- it takes an environmental stimulus. That's the nature of neural structures -- memories/emotions/values/opinions are shaped by the society and environment around you. Those neural connections are made on the basis of environmental interaction. The human mind is extremely malleable. Our brain is big enough to prioritise learning new behaviours over potentially "coded, primitive" behaviours, which are often conveyed in other animals who do not have certain features that we do, such as a large cerebral cortex. I'm sure there is a lot more to his state of mind than just being bullied, or being called a "weirdo" or "loner" by classmates -- however remember that back in school, the currency is popularity. The more popular you are, the more likely you are to potentially remain more stable (psychologically) than someone who does not have as many social interactions - and this is dangerous because we are intrinsically social beings, and we do need to keep our social brains active to maintain a certain level of mental health. A lack of social interactions can't be healthy for the mind. Also another quick point to emphasise -- behaviour is so incredibly complex. I don't feel there is ever one single reason for committing a crime - there could be many variables involved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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