live deep fried fish

[Guest Yegg]

The restaurant is just flaunting how fresh their cuisine is, that's all.

 

call me old fashioned, but i'd prefer to see a tank of live fish over a dodgy youtube video with sadistic undertones.

 

Tanks are often just for show, it's not definitive proof of freshness!

 

Also, it's just a fish. What meat producers do to more highly evolved animals in the West is many times more appalling.

Again, neurological unity--a fish is not just a fish but its suffering usually goes faster than cattle and chickens

 

It is just a fish because it cannot be horrified at the concept of being eaten alive. Cows cry before being led into the slaughterhouse.

On a neurological level, we can probably feel the same magnitude of pain but it's a psychological concept that has everyone up in arms over this.

[Guest Etch]

I am an avid fisherman. When I set out fishing I think of the fish I might be lucky enough to catch that day. I also consider the ceremony and the philosophy of huntsmanship, the art of play, the thrill of the catch and the nourishment a fish will bring. There is also the kill. The kill has a different set of emotions to the hunt, for me it is always solemn, respectful and calculated. I never catch more than I will eat.

 

That grotesque display of preparation runs a parralell with the very attitudes that I resent the most in mankind. The treatment is disrespectful to the animal, to its life, to its beauty. It is an attempt to demonstrate total controll through humilliation of the creature. There was a time when animals were Gods, they were our first gods, and now this. I am not a religious person, but I do know right from wrong. And this is wrong.

[Guest Yegg]

It's funny something as trivial as this can offend everyones delicate Eurocentric sensibilities.

The motive behind this preparation is not the control and humiliation of nature, it's just braggadocio. The industry of animal husbandry and meat production, wherein the animal only exists to be eaten and the animal's birth, life, and death is pre-determined by business, is far more sickening then any method of food preparation could be. It's a profound violation of stewardship.

 

There was a time when animals were Gods, they were our first gods, and now this. I am not a religious person, but I do know right from wrong. And this is wrong.

[Guest Glass Plate]

Oh no they fried the living fish god.

[chenGOD]

there is a dichotomy though: we can understand the concept, a fish cannot.

 

FUCK man, what aren't you getting? When you shove a katana blade in me, I "get" it; I can say, "there is an attacker, this is going to hurt." I fall down and continue to be in misery. The fish has the same neurology so while, no, he's not flopping around trying reason concepts, he's in fucking P__A___I___N in the same manner you are. The lack of a forebrain does not preclude you to being in pain. Studies on all neurons show that things like Substance P, bradykinins, and other indicators of pain (found in us by the way)--are found in lower creatures with any organized nervous system.

I fully understand this. The fish has a reflex. The dichotomy I'm talking about is in comprehension. Read back to my point about where my line is. The reason i think it's fine to consume a fish like this (I would be opposed to this if it were strictly for show) is because a fish cannot tell you "this is going to hurt so please don't".

 

I don't think animals are equal to humans, and I believe that if you are consuming or using the majority of the animal you can kill the fucker however you please.

So I don't support the fur trade, I don't support sport hunting, etc.

[chenGOD]

I do know right from wrong. And this is wrong.

 

Some people think it's wrong for you to catch and eat fish no matter how respectful you are to the fish.

What's your answer to them?

 

Your cultural bias does not give you the right to tell other people what is right or wrong.

[ktait2]

We weep for a bird's cry, but not for a fish's blood. Blessed are those with a voice.

[Dr Clitterhaus]

A nameless quote. How profound.

 

Bad culture who does this to creatures. They have a history of this kinda bullshit and it shows lack of respect. Destroying and torturing things is part of their culture. Theres not really any way of justifying that bullshit, no matter how hard you try and turn it into an "intelligent" arguement. Anyone with eyes can see that its reprehensible.

[Guest Gump]

I am an avid fisherman. When I set out fishing I think of the fish I might be lucky enough to catch that day. I also consider the ceremony and the philosophy of huntsmanship, the art of play, the thrill of the catch and the nourishment a fish will bring. There is also the kill. The kill has a different set of emotions to the hunt, for me it is always solemn, respectful and calculated. I never catch more than I will eat.

 

That grotesque display of preparation runs a parralell with the very attitudes that I resent the most in mankind. The treatment is disrespectful to the animal, to its life, to its beauty. It is an attempt to demonstrate total controll through humilliation of the creature. There was a time when animals were Gods, they were our first gods, and now this. I am not a religious person, but I do know right from wrong. And this is wrong.

 

as an avid game fisherman myself i feel exactly the same.

[Hoodie]

people have cultural biases, yeah, but i don't see how this is at all about culture. americans eat fish, mexicans eat fish, norwegians eat fish, koreans eat fish... there's no cultural tauboo associated with them like there is with dogs and other furry animals that westerners love and easterners love to eat.

 

deep frying a live fish just seems pointless to me; it doesn't have to do with the fact i'm a dirty westerner with evil american ideals. what do you get out of consuming food like that? it's interesting to look at for a bit, i suppose, like a chicken with its head cut off. it's just a novelty though. kinda grotesque, you have to eat that and it hasn't even been cleaned.

[Guest abusivegeorge]

people have cultural biases, yeah, but i don't see how this is at all about culture. americans eat fish, mexicans eat fish, norwegians eat fish, koreans eat fish... there's no cultural tauboo associated with them like there is with dogs and other furry animals that westerners love and easterners love to eat.

 

deep frying a live fish just seems pointless to me; it doesn't have to do with the fact i'm a dirty westerner with evil american ideals. what do you get out of consuming food like that? it's interesting to look at for a bit, i suppose, like a chicken with its head cut off. it's just a novelty though. kinda grotesque, you have to eat that and it hasn't even been cleaned.

 

You really, really turn me on.

[Hoodie]

people have cultural biases, yeah, but i don't see how this is at all about culture. americans eat fish, mexicans eat fish, norwegians eat fish, koreans eat fish... there's no cultural tauboo associated with them like there is with dogs and other furry animals that westerners love and easterners love to eat.

 

deep frying a live fish just seems pointless to me; it doesn't have to do with the fact i'm a dirty westerner with evil american ideals. what do you get out of consuming food like that? it's interesting to look at for a bit, i suppose, like a chicken with its head cut off. it's just a novelty though. kinda grotesque, you have to eat that and it hasn't even been cleaned.

 

You really, really turn me on.

 

[Guest KY]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bPtnHBKW-Pw

 

americans are such pussies

[chenGOD]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bPtnHBKW-Pw

 

americans are such pussies

 

I've eaten that many a time. Delicious with red pepper paste.

[Guest beatfanatic]

I think a better interpretation of "Dominion" in the Bible y'alls was talking about--and I'm by no means Christian--is "stewardship." Stewardship connotes good management so that both parties propagate and you create harmony. This means to not fucking chop up creatures alive, pull their skin off alive, shove them in 20 to crate, let them stand around in their own shit, put them in concrete barracks that don't allow them to turn around, slit them open alive so you can eat the still beating heart, decimate populations of bears and tigers for hilarious child's play concepts of medicine with no scientific basis, kill one of the most amazing predators about whom we know little just for a couple kg. of its fin, put fucking ice skates on a bear and punish it until it skates, use long bullhooks to dig into the flesh of an elephant to make it rear up and stand on its hind legs, stuff chickens into barracks and throw them against the wall when your bored or spit chewing tobacco in its face, throw cinder blocks on pig's heads when they won't die, send cattle upside down to bleed out when they're not quite stunned from the bolt gun, tying a rope around a bull's cock and balls, which pisses him off so badly, that's what generates the "bucking" for all those yee-haw hayseeds.

 

I've never had a single problem with what men do to each other because we are a sick, baseless creature. Growing up, I had this illusion that somehow animals would be spared our sickness but the opposite is true. There is no God or any Heaven that would have us...maybe Islam's got some room; the eastern religions wouldn't have us.

 

I would have you anytime xxx...

[Guest eichel]

as culture is "a net of meanings", i would really like to know what deeper meaning this torture has. or is it only for the lulz?

 

no offense chengod, but besides your cultural relativism (not including circumcision and resource-wasting stuff) you didnt show any arguments pro-fish-torture by now. please enlighten us.

 

and sure you can give your opinion to things you experience. i even think its a must, to stand up for your values.

[plisb]

The reason i think it's fine to consume a fish like this (I would be opposed to this if it were strictly for show) is because a fish cannot tell you "this is going to hurt so please don't".

 

I don't think animals are equal to humans, and I believe that if you are consuming or using the majority of the animal you can kill the fucker however you please.

So I don't support the fur trade, I don't support sport hunting, etc.

 

It's not far away, but I don't wanna facepalm all of this as it's a really important matter on how we view and think about the world and its beings.

 

1. What is it about the fish being cooked and served alive, that is not strictly for show?

 

2. You know that the fish can feel pain, it is suffering. You actively choose to continue hurting it. Why? Because you are superior to it? Because you can? Because the fish isn't smart enough to realize it's fucked?

 

3. I do not get this: "...I believe that if you are consuming or using the majority of the animal you can kill the fucker however you please." - Are you saying that if I was to eat the most part of the fish, I could kill it however I want? If so, I still don't get the point of that statement, other than it shows a lack of empathy.

 

4. Bringing up fur trade and hunting for sports, I feel you should be aiming at how the animals are treated badly, but out of what you say it seems that is not the matter.

[joshuatxuk]

 

1. What is it about the fish being cooked and served alive, that is not strictly for show?

 

 

That's my question still after reading this thread. Boiling a lobster is off-putting to many, but still a means to kill it nonetheless. Eating live octopus is still eating like any other animal would. But frying a fish partially so it's alive, then serving it in a exotic presentation isn't some cultural tradition of anyone. It's a half-baked idea of some desperate resturant owner to shock and appease tourists and "thrill-seeking" foodies.

[Fred McGriff]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lTVXfCbos-o

[Dr Clitterhaus]

as culture is "a net of meanings", i would really like to know what deeper meaning this torture has. or is it only for the lulz?

 

no offense chengod, but besides your cultural relativism (not including circumcision and resource-wasting stuff) you didnt show any arguments pro-fish-torture by now. please enlighten us.

 

and sure you can give your opinion to things you experience. i even think its a must, to stand up for your values.

Great post. His cultural relativism thing was pretty fucking hazy.

[chenGOD]

as culture is "a net of meanings", i would really like to know what deeper meaning this torture has. or is it only for the lulz?

 

no offense chengod, but besides your cultural relativism (not including circumcision and resource-wasting stuff) you didnt show any arguments pro-fish-torture by now. please enlighten us.

 

and sure you can give your opinion to things you experience. i even think its a must, to stand up for your values.

 

The only thing I'm trying to tell you guys is that different cultures have different ways of doing things, and just because it's different, doesn't make it "right" or "wrong".

The fish doesn't have a concept of torture - yes it feels pain but it doesn't know that it's pain from being fried or pain from being bitten from a shark.

Fine: this is a unique method of preparing food that due to the endorphins released while the fish is in flight mode enhances the flavor. The cultural aspect of eating this is participating in an experience that is part of acculturation.

 

Remember that cultural relativism is not the same as moral relativism. Please don't confuse the two or paint them with the same negative brush. I don't know where you read that culture is a "net of meanings", but in my opinion that is merely one part of culture. To be lazy and copy/paste from wikipedia (since i'm in class right now lol) culture is "An integrated pattern of human knowledge, belief, and behavior that depends upon the capacity for symbolic thought and social learning".

[keltoi]

no different to torturing a cat imo. in some cultures this may be acceptable, but in mine it is not. therefore i am perfectly within my rights to say this is wrong.

 

why you 'well travelled, open-minded' people are obsessing over this one word i don't know.

[chenGOD]

The reason i think it's fine to consume a fish like this (I would be opposed to this if it were strictly for show) is because a fish cannot tell you "this is going to hurt so please don't".

 

I don't think animals are equal to humans, and I believe that if you are consuming or using the majority of the animal you can kill the fucker however you please.

So I don't support the fur trade, I don't support sport hunting, etc.

 

It's not far away, but I don't wanna facepalm all of this as it's a really important matter on how we view and think about the world and its beings.

 

1. What is it about the fish being cooked and served alive, that is not strictly for show?

 

2. You know that the fish can feel pain, it is suffering. You actively choose to continue hurting it. Why? Because you are superior to it? Because you can? Because the fish isn't smart enough to realize it's fucked?

 

3. I do not get this: "...I believe that if you are consuming or using the majority of the animal you can kill the fucker however you please." - Are you saying that if I was to eat the most part of the fish, I could kill it however I want? If so, I still don't get the point of that statement, other than it shows a lack of empathy.

 

4. Bringing up fur trade and hunting for sports, I feel you should be aiming at how the animals are treated badly, but out of what you say it seems that is not the matter.

 

1. Because you eat the fish afterward.

 

2. Is feeling pain the same as suffering? The fish has no concept of suffering. It reacts to pain. And yes, man is superior to animal. I think I already said that I believe in the idea of human exceptionalism.

 

3. I don't have empathy for fish, because it has no capacity for empathy.

 

4. I don't think animals should be treated badly for sport or if the whole product is not used.

[chaosmachine]

so, let's take this conversation to the next level.

 

assume:

 

all pain is temporary.

you only live once.

you only die once.

 

questions:

 

if you have to die, why not die in the most interesting and entertaining manner possible? you only get to do it once, why not elect for the maximum experience?

 

assume:

 

there is an all powerful, immortal god.

god creates the universe in order to experience it, from all perspectives, in all ways.

if you need a reason, think about why you read a book or go to the movies. you appreciate the unexpected, the unknown. imagine knowing everything. you'd crave a little of the unexpected, too.

 

so, god goes to the movies. he suspends his infinite powers. decides to play all the parts. decides to experience the fullness of his creation. and holds nothing back.

 

god is the man, and god is the fish.

 

question:

 

does morality exist in such a universe, or is it merely an illusion imposed by our intentionally limited perspective?

[chenGOD]

no different to torturing a cat imo. in some cultures this may be acceptable, but in mine it is not. therefore i am perfectly within my rights to say this is wrong.

 

why you 'well travelled, open-minded' people are obsessing over this one word i don't know.

 

You are within your rights to say that this is "wrong" in your culture.

To quote a criticism on the UN Declaration of Human rights

The rights of Man in the Twentieth Century cannot be circumscribed by the standards of any single culture, or be dictated by the aspirations of any single people. Such a document will lead to frustration, not realization of the personalities of vast numbers of human beings.