keltoi Posted November 18, 2009 Author Share Posted November 18, 2009 chen why can't you accept that people here find this wrong, as readily as you can conclude that they are wrong for thinking it so? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keltoi Posted November 18, 2009 Author Share Posted November 18, 2009 so, let's take this conversation to the next level. assume: all pain is temporary. you only live once. you only die once. questions: if you have to die, why not die in the most interesting and entertaining manner possible? you only get to do it once, why not elect for the maximum experience? assume: there is an all powerful, immortal god. god creates the universe in order to experience it, from all perspectives, in all ways. if you need a reason, think about why you read a book or go to the movie. you appreciate the unexpected, the unknown. imagine knowing everything. you'd crave a little of the unexpected, too. so, god goes to the movies. he suspends his infinite powers. decides to play all the parts. decides to experience the fullness of his creation. and holds nothing back. god is the man, and god is the fish. question: does morality exist in such a universe, or is it merely an illusion imposed by our intentionally limited perspective? lol? what utter pish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan C Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 As a vegan, I'm declaring war on asians for killing the poor little fishy. Scummy bastards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest theSun Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 i wonder what iaiain c would say about this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest eichel Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 the "net of meanings" was my shortened form of clifford geertz': "culture is a self-woven tapestry of meaning". im just writing my final examn (M.A in sociology) on human rights and universalism vs. cultural relativism is a part of it. in that context cultural relativism has not the best connotation, at least there are only few social scientists who stay on that side. but as the discussion is merely a western thing, its getting complicated again ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest eichel Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 lol, just saw that human rights were mentioned in the meantime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redruth Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 i think it's dangerous if when something is popularly excepted in a culture and through years and years is naturalized into common tradition that it then can be called unquestionable and untouchable. (and unapproachable by outside cultures) are we not all here to help each other and grow together? cultural traditions are being developed right now. the car is a tradition, i could give 1000 more examples. we need to open up our hearts so we can grow past old patterns in falseness and find a new beginning together where those humans with the most power don't dictate future tradition. (like is being done now and has been done in the past) instead we must become soft and sensitive enough in our hearts again to know The Truth in all things without question. (a natural internal scale if you will) most i fear can not really weigh things out anymore on this scale. what they believe has been programmed in and dictated to them through the winners of past struggles to introduce and protect 'tradition'. (and i speak to all of us, not just one side or the other on this thread) some traditions are healthy, some are not...but they are not to just be blindly excepted. and it is not taboo to question them with our hearts and our minds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keltoi Posted November 18, 2009 Author Share Posted November 18, 2009 stop writing in stanzas you pretentious tosser Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redruth Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 stop writing in stanzas you pretentious tosser im going to stanza on you while you toss my salad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plum Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 cruelty is a facet of nature, sadly it's one humanity excels at. emo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Yegg Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 no different to torturing a cat imo. in some cultures this may be acceptable, but in mine it is not. therefore i am perfectly within my rights to say this is wrong. why you 'well travelled, open-minded' people are obsessing over this one word i don't know. But yet it's okay to eat pork that comes from pigs who spend the entirety of their lives in their own shit? Shitty things are constantly done to animals domestically and yet this stupid fish is the convenient subject for everyones moral outrage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Clitterhaus Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 This (carp) fish is a metaphor for compassion. And it really exposed a few peoples twisted logic, it really brought a few fucked up idealisms into the open. Mainly the whole goofy "yeah, im not 100% asian but i did hang out there a lot and i can really appreciate how these guys exist, man, i was there. I Really appreciate their culture. I don't think we can judge the cruelty here. But these guys are some really cultured dudes who know what their about, don't piss them off, man. Hey, im just expessin my opinions. Now excuse me while i get back to my thesis on sports science" It just aint happenin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rabid Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 Aw shit guys, you have a lot to learn about the world. Eating live fish is torture? Get off your computers and do something worthwhile. Eh? It's not the eating of a live thing that's bothersome. It's the catching and frying while it's still alive. You're basically just torturing it before it's eaten, rather than just eating the damn thing. While I wouldn't cause any animal needless pain, I don't think that complaining about something like this is worthwhile. That's why I said, if torture bothers you then get up and go help other people instead of worrying about animals, especially animals that probably don't feel pain the way we do. Oh and animals don't feel sorry for themselves - like modern humans do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chenGOD Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 keltoi: because wrong is not the right word. Different. Diiiiiiiiffffffffeeeeeerrrrrrrreeeeeeeennnnnnnntttttttttttt. eichel: did your prof not go over the fact that cultural relativism has been co-opted to be equivocated with moral relativism? They are quite distinct. remember that cultural relativism in Boas' terms is a method, not a doctrine. In none of my posts did I say the cultures are equal..or at least I hope I didn't. They are different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rabid Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 <snip> You basically want to force your morals and ideals on other people. read up on the spanish inquisition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chenGOD Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 This (carp) fish is a metaphor for compassion. And it really exposed a few peoples twisted logic, it really brought a few fucked up idealisms into the open. Mainly the whole goofy "yeah, im not 100% asian but i did hang out there a lot and i can really appreciate how these guys exist, man, i was there. I Really appreciate their culture. I don't think we can judge the cruelty here. But these guys are some really cultured dudes who know what their about, don't piss them off, man. Hey, im just expessin my opinions. Now excuse me while i get back to my thesis on sports science" It just aint happenin. Since this post is directed at me, I'm going to respond personally, and not as a moderator on the board. Fuck you. I didn't "hang out there". I lived there. For a total of 10 years. So it's not so much that I appreciate "their" culture it's more that I became acculturated (for the record, Koreans tend to think of Chinese as being quite low in their eating habits). I don't know if you can understand the difference between those two concepts. Now go back to watching your WWE you ignorant prick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest abusivegeorge Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 ChenGOD DON'T POST, your post count is ideal for this thread right now lol. Oh you did it, twice. shit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redruth Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 <snip> You basically want to force your morals and ideals on other people. read up on the spanish inquisition. force? spanish inquisition? militant islam? roman catholic church? look up the word admonish my friend and that will be your answer. no one can be forced to Truly except anything. you can't force someone to change what is written in their heart. a version at best, but not really. why would anyone want to anyway. it's about genuinely trying to help those who will be helped, not forcing them. i would only want someone to Truly believe. all force is going around in circles. we must equip ourselves with knowledge so The Truth can stand self evident. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chenGOD Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 troon: accept and except mean different things... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rabid Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 No offense troon but I dont read your posts, learn to be concise and then I wont have to skim them. *admonishes* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chaosmachine Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 lol? what utter pish. eh, I was hoping someone would at least try to debate the points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoodie Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 lol? what utter pish. eh, I was hoping someone would at least try to debate the points. and the truth comes out. troon is a chaosmachine dupe. well played, sir. well played. edit: oh goddamn, i didn't read the author of that post. it WAS chaosmachine. i just assumed it was troon because of the format and philosophical pretense. umm, nevermind? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chaosmachine Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 lol. awesome. a discussion of nihilism is just too much to expect from this thread, i guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kakapo Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 so, let's take this conversation to the next level. assume: all pain is temporary. you only live once. you only die once. questions: if you have to die, why not die in the most interesting and entertaining manner possible? you only get to do it once, why not elect for the maximum experience? assume: there is an all powerful, immortal god. god creates the universe in order to experience it, from all perspectives, in all ways. if you need a reason, think about why you read a book or go to the movie. you appreciate the unexpected, the unknown. imagine knowing everything. you'd crave a little of the unexpected, too. so, god goes to the movies. he suspends his infinite powers. decides to play all the parts. decides to experience the fullness of his creation. and holds nothing back. god is the man, and god is the fish. question: does morality exist in such a universe, or is it merely an illusion imposed by our intentionally limited perspective? This is about Joyrex and the secret forum, isn't it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plisb Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 kind of a triple facepalm as we're not getting anywhere here, or am I maybe just too self-centered. I just want to add an example of my experience of folks putting grass straws in wasps to make them fly straight up, cutting of limbs from frogs, playing baseball with frogs, carrying wild baby-mice in small boxes to show off for each other. the N.E.D.M.-cat story is another example. Oh and I should not forget the video that started this thread. To some, torture is clearly okay, to others it's not. I think this shows to what extent you respect life, and not only your own little universe - again, unaware (e.g. childhood/cultural influence) or not (kind of the more depressing alternative, being aware of the torturing). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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