Salvatorin Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 So I was thinking about how with all the social networking sites active these days, it is possible to piece together a very comprehensive idea of how 'the world' reacted at a given moment in recent history. For example, if, for one day, you compiled every video/audio recording available (from the internet, news broadcasts, security footage, etc.) + every statement posted or published online or otherwise + anything else that can be archived...you would have a very well defined piece of 'reality' from a certain date and time. This makes me think about what archiving really means as the technology to perform it expands. If the technology keeps expanding, the 'resolution' of a historical event will increase. If you then think about it, with every improvement of tech, the ability to 'travel' back in time increases. We have cameras now that can record the light and depth signals w/in a period of time in 3-d space/reality. It is not hard to postulate that there could be cameras in the future capable of recording the molecular (atomic, quantum, etc.) happenings within 3-d space...and from there on is it not easy to say that the cameras (or the tool of archiving) would be recording reality to the fullest. So let's say that in the future the whole earth and everything on it is being 'recorded', down to every atom, as time progresses. What would distinguish the 'history of the world' being played from a certain point onward from reality? From the perspective of the viewer the people going about their lives would have predetermined lives, but would the people in the 'film' think that? Would they be thinking? What would even constitute reality if it could be played right back to you in the highest resolution imaginable? People could 'travel' back in time and relive the past, like on the holodeck. I'm kind of confused in the most essential ways about what I'm talking about, but on a less speculative level, the idea that using the internet at all is kind of a passive way of cementing your place in 'history' is kind of bizarre. It makes me think that the speculation as to whether google is becoming a conscious AI is very pertinent...It has much of the world's current knowledge at its disposal, plus every extant online social interaction between humans (think facebook, twitter, watmm, youtube, etc.). I watched the documentary 'we live in public' and I think Josh Harris knows that are our archivization (or watever) is happening more and more. There is a lot to say and my head is kind of spinning about it. So let me hear some ideas, links, books, etc. ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luke viia Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 I think I know what you're getting at. This may be of interest to you and your ideas: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RE4ce4mexrU Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rambo Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 You might want to look at this http://wikibin.org/articles/quantum-archeology.html. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salvatorin Posted April 11, 2011 Author Share Posted April 11, 2011 I think I know what you're getting at. This may be of interest to you and your ideas: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RE4ce4mexrU That is amazing. It also sort of makes me feel sad, like this is a symbol of the coming death of much of what has been traditionally considered human. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redruth Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 what your describing is going on right now salvatorin, your just speaking of it in technological terms edit: a few months back i mentioned here at watmm the dangers of freezing dimensional reality in present day photograph and film but no one paid me much attention. do you think that a photograph has no deeper attachment to its image origin? time and time again we give little thought to the repercussions of our actions, partly because we don't fully understand them but that is not the entire reason. we are also under a type of spell. virtual reality is already represented as our internet experience and will eventually be lifted to its fully weaponized version if time goes on. so immersive and all consuming that many will lose touch with the 'real world' entirely, some already have. this is not the only tool for this type of deception, the world is strewn with them, everybody loves them. there is a lot more to this whole experience then most fully understand or want to understand. most have a hard time breaking free from their programming Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandi_B Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 I u Salvatorin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest EleminoP Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 I Salvatorin too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redruth Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 i salvatorin three Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Z_B_Z Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 a few months back i mentioned here at watmm the dangers of freezing dimensional reality in present day photograph and film but no one paid me much attention. do you think that a photograph has no deeper attachment to its image origin? care to expand on this a bit more? this logic would apply to audio recordings too, no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awepittance Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 A+ post, that's all i have to add for now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salvatorin Posted April 11, 2011 Author Share Posted April 11, 2011 thx for the <3's a few months back i mentioned here at watmm the dangers of freezing dimensional reality in present day photograph and film but no one paid me much attention. do you think that a photograph has no deeper attachment to its image origin? care to expand on this a bit more? this logic would apply to audio recordings too, no? troon I think I remember you posting something about how the resolution of the cameras people commonly use these days removes the sentimentality of memory, I guess I associated it in my mind w/ some kind of 'uncanny valley' of perceived memory/reality vs. actual dimensional reality....(hauntology)? I think that I see the resolution of present day archives as an essentially nonhuman process that, in the past has seemed beneficial for a while due to its function as a preservation of knowledge and culture...but now is becoming more of an automatic thing (its hard for me to think of what to call it)—it's (it being the capturing of reality thru video and the internet) digging its way into our brains, our thought processes, replacing what was subjective experience w/ this big hivemind-ish objective thing! Hivemind being really key here, because this process (of archiving ourselves) is unfolding in a highly emergent fashion...however...the emergence-ness of it (en masse) is being completely taken advantage of (if no reigned over) by the infrastructure providing it (ie. isp providers, gov't, corporations, etc.) sorry if that is an incoherent rant. I'm trying to make my thoughts and what they imply accessible, though. No crypticness from me. This isn't poetry class. And not that I really am complaining, it's more of a genuine question: why do you often drop verbal cues that suggest some extra information that none of us have? Are you trying to post your opinions in a covert fashion? Because if so, I suppose I support what you are doing. Everything you do on the internet is potential evidence for your future death sentence. I've adopted a 'well fuck it' attitude for the time being, but I plan on 'dropping out' of the internet in due time. !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Gbiscuit Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 Posting in a Zeitgeist thread. Interesting conversation regardless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redruth Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 thx for the <3's a few months back i mentioned here at watmm the dangers of freezing dimensional reality in present day photograph and film but no one paid me much attention. do you think that a photograph has no deeper attachment to its image origin? care to expand on this a bit more? this logic would apply to audio recordings too, no? troon I think I remember you posting something about how the resolution of the cameras people commonly use these days removes the sentimentality of memory, I guess I associated it in my mind w/ some kind of 'uncanny valley' of perceived memory/reality vs. actual dimensional reality....(hauntology)? I think that I see the resolution of present day archives as an essentially nonhuman process that, in the past has seemed beneficial for a while due to its function as a preservation of knowledge and culture...but now is becoming more of an automatic thing (its hard for me to think of what to call it)—it's (it being the capturing of reality thru video and the internet) digging its way into our brains, our thought processes, replacing what was subjective experience w/ this big hivemind-ish objective thing! Hivemind being really key here, because this process (of archiving ourselves) is unfolding in a highly emergent fashion...however...the emergence-ness of it (en masse) is being completely taken advantage of (if no reigned over) by the infrastructure providing it (ie. isp providers, gov't, corporations, etc.) sorry if that is an incoherent rant. I'm trying to make my thoughts and what they imply accessible, though. No crypticness from me. This isn't poetry class. And not that I really am complaining, it's more of a genuine question: why do you often drop verbal cues that suggest some extra information that none of us have? Are you trying to post your opinions in a covert fashion? Because if so, I suppose I support what you are doing. Everything you do on the internet is potential evidence for your future death sentence. I've adopted a 'well fuck it' attitude for the time being, but I plan on 'dropping out' of the internet in due time. !! listen, i've got to be getting to some sleep. it's been far to long since i've had any and it's beyond late so i'll need to continue this some other time. the quote of your memory regarding what i've said in past about freezing dimensional reality is slightly skewed but no harm, i'll attempt to reconstruct it or paste it when i've the chance. as far as anonymity and the internet are concerned, there is a lot one must learn before one openly talks on the internet if one wants to keep his or her true identity from being known. i won't go into details because it isn't really appropriate here at the watmm, but there are many resources and such you can find with a little motivation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Z_B_Z Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 the vibe in here is turning paranoid.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chenGOD Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 And not that I really am complaining, it's more of a genuine question: why do you [troon] often drop verbal cues that suggest some extra information that none of us have? Are you trying to post your opinions in a covert fashion? He doesn't have any extra information - when you post vague shit it's easier to mold what you said to fit events after the fact. It's basically straight up cowardice. sorry for the hijack - the thread topic is really interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zephyr_Nova Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 I like where you're going with this, Salv. Keep on ponderin'! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boxus Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 great ideas, this really got me thinking! i love that ted talk, the way he focuses on archiving of language. the word maps are incredible, they give you a powerful sense of transcending time. i'm excited to see what other linguistic developments will come out of this kind of research, the internet continues to make corpus data more and more immensely rich. this all makes me think of videodrome, probably since i just watched it a few days ago. i think that film captures the blurring borders between reality and recording really well. especially the character brian o blivion, who only appears on tv in pre-recorded form. lost highway is all about this too. that series of videotapes is so haunting to watch, the idea of being recorded by an unknown entity while you sleep, and seeing yourself doing things you don't remember... also inland empire, though it's more about acting vs. reality, not as much surveillance vs. reality. a lot of david lynch's films have something to do with this real vs. recorded theme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hahathhat Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 So let's say that in the future the whole earth and everything on it is being 'recorded', down to every atom, as time progresses. What would distinguish the 'history of the world' being played from a certain point onward from reality? From the perspective of the viewer the people going about their lives would have predetermined lives, but would the people in the 'film' think that? furthermore, if you recreate an event where people suffer/die, what is the morality of that ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Babar Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 I think I know what you're getting at. This may be of interest to you and your ideas: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RE4ce4mexrU i haven't watched the vid yet, but it seems this guy isn't really watching the birth of new words, but his son's new productions. A few months ago, some linguist heard on TV a French singer employ the word "toomuchité" (literally 'toomuchity'). He searched for the word on google, and stumbled upon google live search feature. He was then able to observe the use of the word growing among twits in real time. toomuchité (it happened on October 14th) This is quite interesting because it sheds new lights on the whole new/old dilemma : when you analyze a social phenomenon through time, you can mention its date of initial appearance or the moment it has become of common use (which is vaguely estimated). With data provided by these new tools which are basically social captors, you can cross-analyze multiple phenomenons, and analyze the hierarchical structure of information-spreading (toomuchité already existed, but he started popping up when this singer employed it. If we had a way to analyze the meaning of what gets written on the web, we could even measure how much we're influenced by, say, mainstream media. And make social forecasts, just like Meteorology. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Blanket Fort Collapse Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zephyr_Nova Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 this all makes me think of videodrome, probably since i just watched it a few days ago. i think that film captures the blurring borders between reality and recording really well. especially the character brian o blivion, who only appears on tv in pre-recorded form. Love that movie so much, possibly my favorite Cronenberg. EVERYBODY GO WATCH VIDEODROME! And eXistenZ as well, if you're looking to further blur that fantasy vs reality line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rambo Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 A good little interview on the Global brain/Hive Mind that i read a couple of weeks ago. The interviewer is Ben Goertzel (quite a well known AI researcher) http://hplusmagazine.com/2011/03/16/francis-heylighen-on-the-emerging-global-brain/ Another interview which is possibly a bit weirder about Hive Mind/consciousness/immortality http://hplusmagazine.com/2011/02/23/beyond-the-borg/ Actually, the whole hplus site is really good, i probably read about 80% of the articles on there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salvatorin Posted April 11, 2011 Author Share Posted April 11, 2011 That m.i.t video is nice and mushy, but hasn't the US / European governments been using similar data collecting scheme's for 'security' reasons for years now, filter out words like bomb in internet traffic / emails et cetera? I forgot the name, but I remember a picture of two large white dome structures where this collecting happens. made me think of this: (x-files) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redruth Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 it has become clear to us now that it is inappropriate to continue speaking on such deep metaphysical themes here at the watmm. to the relief of many of you this account will cease its spouting and instead concentrate solely on music and general conversation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salvatorin Posted April 11, 2011 Author Share Posted April 11, 2011 it has become clear to us now that it is inappropriate to continue speaking on such deep metaphysical themes here at the watmm. to the relief of many of you this account will cease its spouting and instead concentrate solely on music and general conversation. oh come on, man. I'm interested. Don't be like that. It's childish. WATMM has always been a place where idm, metaphysical themes, lulz, and poop coexist in harmony. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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