france bans the face veil/burqa

[keltoi]

.

[Blir]

Is it election day? Seems to be with all these POLLS!

 

 

 

[psn]

Hooray for fascism.

[Guest Adjective]

does this mean makeup and masks are banned in public as well?

[luke viia]

just say no to banning cloth

[Blir]

For real though, free speech and stuff. So many people died in France defending free speech and for something like this to happen is a real shame.

 

I'd like to know what Babar has to say (the WATMMer, not the elephant)

[keltoi]

I'd like to know what Babar has to say (the WATMMer, not the elephant)

 

i'd prefer to hear what the elephant has to say on the matter

[Guest Rambo]

if they had the chance, muslims would explode every single one of you so pardon me while i go and get my violin guys

[acidphakist]

Just as my year in Singapore was ending, there was scuttlebutt over banning this stuff. The reasoning was, however, that the young girls had no choice but to wear what amounted to winter clothing in the hot jungle sun.

[Guest disparaissant]

i'd like both to weigh in, i hear the elephant is a raging islamophobe

 

f'realz though i think it's stupid to wear a face covering because an invisible sky man wants you to but i wont begrudge you the right to do something stupid, so wahey.

[Blir]

f'realz though i think it's stupid to wear a face covering because an invisible sky man wants you to but i wont begrudge you the right to do something stupid, so wahey.

 

Pretty much sums up my point of view. It'd be like banning mohawks, minus the religious angle. However I think I'd be more in favour of mohawk banning. At least burqa's make you look like a walking pint of Guiness. And that makes me thirsty.

[QBLA]

what about ninjas? They can parade around with their faces half covered?

[keltoi]

no law against ninjas as far as i know

[eugene]

i'd like both to weigh in, i hear the elephant is a raging islamophobe

 

f'realz though i think it's stupid to wear a face covering because an invisible sky man wants you to but i wont begrudge you the right to do something stupid, so wahey.

 

this is an easy "i'm a liberal, so fuck you !" answer. this isn't just about simple stupidity, it is inherently evil, a culture that celebrates oppression of women and exploits a backing of modern democracy. moreover, it persuades those women that they should be ashamed of revealing themselves which is even more fucked up imo. i find it comparable to the ban on foot binding in china where many women ignored it and continued binding their foot in secret because they were just culturally wired that way. basically "freedom of speech" shouldn't be taken as a dogma, there's a lot to discuss..

 

 

a disclaimer for twats that'll go "you wacist !!11!one " - i have exactly the same opinion on our own ultra orthodox jews and their ways.. bus lines where women must sit in the back and all that jazz..

[Guest Iain C]

it is a stupid, reactionary, anti-feminist law designed to appease right-wing fuckheads and neo-nazis (France is full of 'em). Sarkozy is a toad.

[Guest Ranky Redlof]

right on!

as if those women do it out of their own will. it's a symbol of oppression not a symbol of free will.

[eugene]

it is a stupid, reactionary, anti-feminist law designed to appease right-wing fuckheads and neo-nazis (France is full of 'em). Sarkozy is a toad.

 

i can see a possible argument behind other points but how is it anti-feminist ?

[cear]

Burqa has been forbidden for quite a while now in Belgium. I feel it's a simple matter of security. Anyone can be under that burqa.

 

(Think about banks, hotels, restaurants, etc. Not quite comfortable when someone walks in completely covered. At least I wouldn't feel so..)

 

I don't understand the banning of the veils in public though. As long as theirs some face visible, who cares..

 

Quite a difference:

[Guest Iain C]

it is a stupid, reactionary, anti-feminist law designed to appease right-wing fuckheads and neo-nazis (France is full of 'em). Sarkozy is a toad.

 

i can see a possible argument behind other points but how is it anti-feminist ?

 

imposing a diktat (primarily backed by male politicians and a patriarchal, authoritarian political order) on a woman's right to dress how she chooses in public seems anti-feminist to me. what's more, it criminalises the very women who it ironically proclaims to be "victims".

[Guest rumbo]

The freedom to choose oppression.

[Salvatorin]

what about me? I'm thinking about starting a book/movie/religion where people cover themselves up and renounce their identities.

[Guest disparaissant]

i'd like both to weigh in, i hear the elephant is a raging islamophobe

 

f'realz though i think it's stupid to wear a face covering because an invisible sky man wants you to but i wont begrudge you the right to do something stupid, so wahey.

 

this is an easy "i'm a liberal, so fuck you !" answer. this isn't just about simple stupidity, it is inherently evil, a culture that celebrates oppression of women and exploits a backing of modern democracy. moreover, it persuades those women that they should be ashamed of revealing themselves which is even more fucked up imo.

 

I feel compelled to quote Jason and the Argonauts, the song from XTC's seminal album English Settlement.

I was in a land where men force women to hide

their facial features,

and here in the west it's just the same

but they're using make-up veils.

 

That said, Iain C nailed it. Not everyone who wears a veil is forced to, one of my best friends in school wore one simply because she wanted to. Who are you (or Sarkozy, or indeed any other member of the patriarchy/kyriarchy) to tell anyone what they can and can't do?

It's fucked when someone is forced to wear a veil, but that's not the case 100% of the time.

 

Some people like being modest.

Some people like dressing like sluts.

Some people wear sweatpants to the store.

It ain't your body, so leave it ahhhht.

 

Edit: Just to throw you a bone, I have just as much of a problem with radfems who say I'm not a real woman because I shave my armpits.

[eugene]

it is a stupid, reactionary, anti-feminist law designed to appease right-wing fuckheads and neo-nazis (France is full of 'em). Sarkozy is a toad.

 

i can see a possible argument behind other points but how is it anti-feminist ?

 

imposing a diktat (primarily backed by male politicians and a patriarchal, authoritarian political order) on a woman's right to dress how she chooses in public seems anti-feminist to me. what's more, it criminalises the very women who it ironically proclaims to be "victims".

the bold part is a good point.

but i really doubt there's freedom of choice here, those women don't really have a choice of not wearing this if they want to be part of their community. they protest this ban because they have no choice. they weren't offered an option of real freedom as most of us see it, i believe..

[Blir]

i'd like both to weigh in, i hear the elephant is a raging islamophobe

 

f'realz though i think it's stupid to wear a face covering because an invisible sky man wants you to but i wont begrudge you the right to do something stupid, so wahey.

 

this is an easy "i'm a liberal, so fuck you !" answer. this isn't just about simple stupidity, it is inherently evil, a culture that celebrates oppression of women and exploits a backing of modern democracy. moreover, it persuades those women that they should be ashamed of revealing themselves which is even more fucked up imo. i find it comparable to the ban on foot binding in china where many women ignored it and continued binding their foot in secret because they were just culturally wired that way. basically "freedom of speech" shouldn't be taken as a dogma, there's a lot to discuss..

 

 

a disclaimer for twats that'll go "you wacist !!11!one " - i have exactly the same opinion on our own ultra orthodox jews and their ways.. bus lines where women must sit in the back and all that jazz..

 

See, I'm with you on the oppression of women thing and I personally hate the idea of the burqa. I just don't think government should be able to ban things to that degree, if people want to buy into a religion that makes them out to be shit then it's still their call.

[Guest disparaissant]

dammit now i have to listen to english settlement fuck you sarkozy