I am now convinced that capitalism is evil

[zlemflolia]

2 hours ago, Summon Dot E X E said:

A rather reductionist response, as I expected.

China has a state capitalist economy, every bit as imperialist as the United States or Britain ever was, and it is simultaneously communist in its brutal censorship, repression, attempts at information dominance, and in general, its strategy of 5th generation warfare against every non-member of the CCP on Earth. In fact, they are waging war on the world THROUGH capitalism. By using what could fairly be called slave labor to produce things so cheaply, they have spread their influence and gotten their tentacles in everything. Canadian real estate and NBA celebrities, for instance.

I said beware false dichotomies, don't pose them to me!

I wish the Chinese people were free. I wish that all people were free. To say and do what they want. I just don't know how to get there. Absolute power corrupts absolutely.

communists have the right goal in mind.  you can critique historical and present methods.  if you have no alternative path, what value is there in that overall position? 

the main issue that socialist and communist countries face is vicious reaction from capitalist countries who want to force them into subservience again, and from the capitalists of their own country. 

utopian socialists of marx's time wanted to build special compounds with farming and communal labor and hope to just branch off and achieve a peaceful and fair society, but it's not actually viable.  so he analyzed capitalism itself and theorized how it behaves and what you must do to fight it, and so far he's been so right that global wars have been fought to suppress those who believe in marxism and socialism.  violence perpetrated by the capitalists. 

so its not fair to say "both socialists and capitalists do so and so" no you must rather look at the mode of production and determine through theory and practice how it must transform, and the soviet union, china, cuba, etc. show the path forward, even though they have a long way to go

 

 

[milkface]

Facts. Utopian Marxism is beyond useless and poses ZERO danger to the system. It's just a lazy copout to always be right and for nothing to actually change.

[cichlisuite]

22 hours ago, Summon Dot E X E said:

There's really no precedent for what's happening now with the hyper-connectedness of the internet, the addictive, soul-destroying power of social media, and the god-like potential of AI which will certainly be wielded by those unworthy of that type of power.

Beware false dichotomies, false tribes, false information, manipulated emotions, and manufactured consent.

I'd add to that, which is probably most important happening right now is the completely untouchable strata of enormous capital holders, virtually exempt from legislation and accountability, that transcended its by-design-and-by-ideology separation from governments, wielding the power of the markets and the power of governments at the same time. Where governments shape its long-term strategy along with the interests of biggest corporations, effectively bypassing all 'rules' (if there ever were any) of the free market and separation of powers. The most recent example of this travesty is probably the race of semiconductor manufacturers against China.

This is what really worries me. In the name of national grand strategy on world stage and inner stability, corporations are playing such a huge role, that the entities are no longer separate, but rather one huge funnel of capital and global power that shape the legislation for the benefit of a nation, and in reality, it's just opening the back door wide open to seize infrastructure at large and even shape diplomatic relations with other (allied) countries, where such national interests are also capital interests, and therefore further expanding into these 'acquired' markets (allied nations) by means of treaties (defense (offense really, i mean c'mon), commerce & manufacturing (taiwan), infrastructure (ukraine) and resources (also ukraine)).

I'm just waiting to see how the west is buying up the entire ukraine by leasing military capability. The bill is getting heavier. You think Ukrainians have the ability to ever pay it all back? It's effectively the end of their sovereignty. I'm not trying to stir in ukraine per-se, just setting a most recent example.

[prdctvsm]

[iococoi]

[auxien]

Quote

The US government should confiscate 100% of any money that Americans make above $999m, the leftwing independent senator Bernie Sanders said late last week.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/may/02/bernie-sanders-interview-chris-wallace-tax-rich

truths 

[EdamAnchorman]

1 hour ago, auxien said:

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/may/02/bernie-sanders-interview-chris-wallace-tax-rich

truths 

And there should be a 100% inheritance tax above $1 million (although this would be so easy to get around).

[ignatius]

40 minutes ago, randomsummer said:

And there should be a 100% inheritance tax above $1 million (although this would be so easy to get around).

trusts, partnerships etc. there's other ways to go after the tax dollars. 

i think, no matter how many youtube videos show in 100 different ways how much money a billion dollars actually is, people don't have a concept of it.. not the mainstream anyways.  it's crazy how much money it is. if people realized really how much it is they'd be more ok w/taxes on the super wealthy. but, so many people see themselves as potential super rich people for some reason that they are afraid it means they won't have a chance to attain it or something. 

[iococoi]

Quote

Elizabeth Holmes is going to prison – with a $500m bill

'Liz' learns you don't screw over rich people

https://www.theregister.com/2023/05/17/elizabeth_holmes_prison/

[prdctvsm]

[zlemflolia]

On 5/3/2023 at 11:51 AM, randomsummer said:

And there should be a 100% inheritance tax above $1 million (although this would be so easy to get around).

1 million seems a bit low for some places, you can be a working class plumber and bought a house back in 1990 that is now worth over 1 million, and you should be able to give it to your kids via inheritance (houses are personal property not private property)

inheritance tax is liberal reformism.  whats more relevant is preventing excess accumulation, not preventing inheritance across generations, which doesn't even matter if nobody can accumulate 10m+ or whatever

the monetary value of personal property is not relevant.  only the ownership of the means of production matters, such as factories and mines.  not a house or a carefully maintained working class 401k

Edited June 13, 2023 by zlemflolia

[EdamAnchorman]

10 hours ago, zlemflolia said:

1 million seems a bit low for some places, you can be a working class plumber and bought a house back in 1990 that is now worth over 1 million, and you should be able to give it to your kids via inheritance (houses are personal property not private property)

inheritance tax is liberal reformism.  whats more relevant is preventing excess accumulation, not preventing inheritance across generations, which doesn't even matter if nobody can accumulate 10m+ or whatever

the monetary value of personal property is not relevant.  only the ownership of the means of production matters, such as factories and mines.  not a house or a carefully maintained working class 401k

Yes, thank you, I should've specified that I meant 1 million in cash, unrealized gains, etc.  Not personal property.  But again it would be too easy to get around.  Kids don't need more than $1 million in cash inheritance.

[ignatius]

1 hour ago, randomsummer said:

Yes, thank you, I should've specified that I meant 1 million in cash, unrealized gains, etc.  Not personal property.  But again it would be too easy to get around.  Kids don't need more than $1 million in cash inheritance.

what if there's 5 kids?

[auxien]

i was reading about the author of the book that MIXL2 had used that art from for his avatars, Michael Ende, and stumbled across this bit of an idea called demurrage: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demurrage_(currency) i think maybe i'd heard of it before? but long since forgot if so...nonetheless, the idea itself sounds pretty great and would be a wonderful counter to this wealth hoarding of the rich, at least in part.

Quote

Demurrage is the cost associated with owning or holding currency over a given period. It is sometimes referred to as a carrying cost of money. For commodity money such as gold, demurrage is the cost of storing and securing the gold. For paper currency, it can take the form of a periodic tax, such as a stamp tax, on currency holdings. Demurrage is sometimes cited as economically advantageous, usually in the context of complementary currencysystems.

meant to post that when i'd seen it a couple days ago. the idea of a money that rots if held and not used is....well, perfect. it'll never happen in America, but it should. could be a big component in a healthy equality of a capitalist society (if that's even possible).

[zlemflolia]

6 hours ago, auxien said:

i was reading about the author of the book that MIXL2 had used that art from for his avatars, Michael Ende, and stumbled across this bit of an idea called demurrage: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demurrage_(currency) i think maybe i'd heard of it before? but long since forgot if so...nonetheless, the idea itself sounds pretty great and would be a wonderful counter to this wealth hoarding of the rich, at least in part.

meant to post that when i'd seen it a couple days ago. the idea of a money that rots if held and not used is....well, perfect. it'll never happen in America, but it should. could be a big component in a healthy equality of a capitalist society (if that's even possible).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Labour_voucher

[EdamAnchorman]

16 hours ago, ignatius said:

what if there's 5 kids?

Then a cool mill per kid

Edited June 14, 2023 by randomsummer

[iococoi]

[iococoi]

On 6/15/2023 at 8:19 AM, iococoi said:

[prdctvsm]

2 minutes ago, iococoi said:

[iococoi]

2 minutes ago, prdctvsm said:

[prdctvsm]

On 6/18/2023 at 3:10 PM, iococoi said:

[iococoi]

13 minutes ago, prdctvsm said:

#orcauprising

[prdctvsm]

There’s Something Sad About Our Obsession With the ‘Orca Uprising’ , by Samantha Cole (Vice) 

[chenGOD]

On 5/4/2023 at 2:06 AM, auxien said:

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/may/02/bernie-sanders-interview-chris-wallace-tax-rich

truths 

The definition of income needs to include capital gains, taxes on property acquired through loans where the collateral comes from above the billy, etc. etc. Luxury goods such as super yachts should have substantial taxes on them, vacant property taxes. Corporations with assets/gross revenue above a certain amount need to be taxed more heavily as well.

Rent needs to be capped with strictly enforced regulations on maintenance and upkeep requirements. And there needs to be a limit on how much a house's value can appreciate in a year (something like 1% would be appropriate) - and I say this as a homeowner. Houses aren't investments - but we do have to respect that rental stock is necessary (some people move to places for a year or two due to work, life circumstances, etc.) and sometimes people will wish to sell their houses and purchase elsewhere for whatever number of reasons.

 

[EdamAnchorman]

2 hours ago, chenGOD said:

The definition of income needs to include capital gains, taxes on property acquired through loans where the collateral comes from above the billy, etc. etc. Luxury goods such as super yachts should have substantial taxes on them, vacant property taxes. Corporations with assets/gross revenue above a certain amount need to be taxed more heavily as well.

Rent needs to be capped with strictly enforced regulations on maintenance and upkeep requirements. And there needs to be a limit on how much a house's value can appreciate in a year (something like 1% would be appropriate) - and I say this as a homeowner. Houses aren't investments - but we do have to respect that rental stock is necessary (some people move to places for a year or two due to work, life circumstances, etc.) and sometimes people will wish to sell their houses and purchase elsewhere for whatever number of reasons.

 

And corporate taxes should depend on what the company produces. Companies that produce physical goods (manufacturing) should be taxed lower, then service industries a little higher, then companies like banks and hedge funds that just make money with money and don't produce anything should be taxed to the maximum extent.

Edited June 19, 2023 by randomsummer