depression

[SR4]

definitely a great start, good change of pace.

 

 

if you get a chance it might be worthwhile to take a trip somewhere, change of scenery.

 

and this sounds condescending, but trust me, I don't mean it that way: at your age a lot of these depressive mechanisms seem to come full circle, or intensify...im guessing because of the maturation of the body/horomonal changes begin to level out, etc. But I struggled with depression really badly for the better part of a decade, and I dealt with it via self-medication (HUGE NO NO). Basically became a belligerent, aggressive drunk, and it unfortunately took a huge meltdown in public to realize what I had been doing to myself and those around me.

 

What you are doing is already leaps and bounds ahead of what unfortunately is the simple solution, and that so many people get dragged into its depths. Im glad I made it out....I have had many friends that never quite did the same.

 

I would recommend Nietzsche as that pretty much helped change my life, but I dunno if that will necessarily be helpful in your situation. Just experiment, the process itself ensures that your mind won't have time to linger on the things that have been most bothersome.

Edited August 14, 2012 by Smettingham Rutherford IV

[anonymstol]

me and a buddy of mine are going to a concert in trondheim this saturday. if that's what you're thinking about when you say change of scenery.

[SR4]

mos def!

[Guest A/D]

wow watmm has massively improved in the last couple of years. Now it's 10/1 good advice vs trolling as opposed to the other way around.

 

I'll only add one thing to try. I realized that during almost everything I do I breathe really poorly - infrequent shallow breaths. Focusing on learning to breathe well during everything else has given me a really good feeling. If you feel like you don't breathe right it's worth a shot.

[Guest konxompax]

yeah asking for advice is the first step, well done!

 

sometimes a change in diet helps, eat healthy and go to bed at a reasonable time and get up at the same time. routines etc..

it really does change your mood.

 

we went swimming in the countryside last week and it totally sorted my head out, good to get out of the city

[Guest Roksen Creek]

I'll only add one thing to try. I realized that during almost everything I do I breathe really poorly - infrequent shallow breaths. Focusing on learning to breathe well during everything else has given me a really good feeling. If you feel like you don't breathe right it's worth a shot.

 

This is good advice. It's also very good advice for avoiding anxiety (as is just about all the other advice on this thread regarding depression).

[Guest kokeboka]

Don't forget to address the true nature of what is making you depressed. Acquiring healthier habits, as mentioned, goes a long way to help you feel better - that's the behavioural part of what makes you happy or sad. But you also have work with the cognitive part of your depression: challenge your negative thoughts and beliefs, ask yourself whether your personal expectations are in line with what is reasonable for someone in your situation. Don't dwell on things but also don't run away from depression, try to face it like a scientist. You'd be amazed with the things sometimes we've come to accept as true about ourselves, which in fact aren't at all.

[SR4]

Don't forget to address the true nature of what is making you depressed. Acquiring healthier habits, as mentioned, goes a long way to help you feel better - that's the behavioural part of what makes you happy or sad. But you also have work with the cognitive part of your depression: challenge your negative thoughts and beliefs, ask yourself whether your personal expectations are in line with what is reasonable for someone in your situation. Don't dwell on things but also don't run away from depression, try to face it like a scientist. You'd be amazed with the things sometimes we've come to accept as true about ourselves, which in fact aren't at all.

 

this is really well put, and I think that's what reading Nietzsche did for me (ie. the world not "having a point or meaning" being a potential liberating line of thought)

[Dale]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B-0ETX4z_DU

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=88SM_TGuCL4

[SR4]

"depression is not due to genetics"

 

 

really? I can't begin to tell you how misleading that statement is. False paradigms out the wazoo.

[gmanyo]

Exorcism Exercise helps loads apparently, so it's definitely great that you've started to get out again. And don't post around on forums too much like I and most of us here do; get out and hang with some real-life friends.

Edited August 14, 2012 by gmanyo

[Dale]

"depression is not due to genetics"

 

 

really? I can't begin to tell you how misleading that statement is. False paradigms out the wazoo.

Of course I agree genetic propensities can play a role but they do not cause depression, it takes environmental triggers.

[anonymstol]

Exorcism Exercise helps loads apparently,

i loled

[Guest kokeboka]

"depression is not due to genetics"

 

 

really? I can't begin to tell you how misleading that statement is. False paradigms out the wazoo.

Of course I agree genetic propensities can play a role but they do not cause depression, it takes environmental triggers.

 

Both genetic and environmental triggers can come into play, it's impossible to define how much each factor weighs. The smallest thing, anything, can be a trigger if you have a strong enough genetic inclination. But a family history of depression shouldn't be seen as a predestined fate though, it's the interaction that the mind establishes between genetics and stimuli that will cause depression or other disorders.

[gritbox]

Chimera said everything I wanted to say originally. One thing I would like to add is that all of this stuff is like developing a skill, a way to manage a certain behavior. I have noticed that sometimes I feel myself slipping back into a depression for whatever reason, but having dealt with it in the past I can recognize it and remind myself of all of the things being mentioned in this thread and prevent it from pulling me way down again. Your posts are already sounding more upbeat and I hope this is something you can put behind you very soon and never have to deal with again.

[Dale]

"depression is not due to genetics"

 

 

really? I can't begin to tell you how misleading that statement is. False paradigms out the wazoo.

Of course I agree genetic propensities can play a role but they do not cause depression, it takes environmental triggers.

 

Both genetic and environmental triggers can come into play, it's impossible to define how much each factor weighs. The smallest thing, anything, can be a trigger if you have a strong enough genetic inclination. But a family history of depression shouldn't be seen as a predestined fate though, it's the interaction that the mind establishes between genetics and stimuli that will cause depression or other disorders.

I'd argue that in most instances, the environment has the last, controlling effect on a person's behaviour when it comes to depression and similar types of emotions. I place more emphasis on environment as it can be altered - we cannot have the same approach to genetics. Simply dwelling on genes gets us nowhere. Reconfigure you've environment as best as possible. Try and find things that are reinforcing to your behaviour. I realise this is easier said than done though.

 

When people speak of genetic propensities - it's important to pin down the person on what they mean. What are they saying? That someone carries a mutant gene which inhibits mood regulation? That somebody carries a higher rate of serotonin receptors than another person? Even neuroplasticity plays a dominant role in how neuronal networks are mapped out based on environmental experiences thus manipluating the 'pre-defined' neuronal paths genes might have influenced. I prefer hearing specifics but many who spout the genetic argument have trouble delivering the evidence and piecing it altogether from gene expression to the effect on behaviour. Of course genes play a role in behaviour, but a limited one at best when it comes to certain types of complex behaviours.

[Guest fiznuthian]

I dont know.. I spend probably all 15-20 years of my life in a state of depression and anxiety.. to date I have had zero relationships, gave up every friend I ever made, rarely ever left my house except for food, to buy video games, etc..

 

Once I changed my eating habits almost everything I ever felt crappy about, anxious about, depressed about, you name it.. it lifted like a fog looming over my life. Absolutely vanished.

It's been almost a year and a half now i've been experimenting with the extremes of human diet and since having adhered 100% to ancestral eating patterns I can honestly say I experience a sum total of zero anxiety, zero depression, and 100% motivation to do everything I ever wanted to. I rarely ever get tired and my mood is 100% stable 24/7, 7 days a week.

 

I can't tell you how many people I have told this to (i've since stopped, pretty much noone believes me that food had a part in it) who say "Oh, it's all in your head." Yeah, whatever. If it was just that easy why was I unable to make the appropriate choices before? Why was my nervous system an absolute wreck?

 

People are so convinced these days that there's a "chemical imbalance" in their neural network that makes them depressed and anxious.. If by chemical imbalance you mean malnourishment I would whole heartedly agree.. Western diet has a profound affect on the dopaminergic and serotonergic systems in our brain.. suprise, suprise: almost every anti-depressant and anxiolytic ever prescribed affects both neural systems too.

 

For a while earlier in the year I kept attempting to assign "cheat" days and consume pleasure foods only on those days.. pizza, fast food, snack foods.. things I was convinced I couldn't live without forever.

Each and every time my brain fog and lethargy would come back rapidly, i'd sleep most of the day and feel strange moods and anxiety again.. didn't take long and I would almost say I was depressed again.

Needless to say I stopped.

 

Animals, vegetables, fruit, tubers is it then. :)

 

I don't mean to make any of you feel like your problems aren't real, or suggesting that your drug treatments are ineffective, don't help you, or whatever. I understand that depression and anxiety is a complex thing and not very well understood.. I don't know everything nor do I know what you feel like either. I do feel like my experience isn't unique to me.. I hope it helps one of you maybe.

[Guest kokeboka]

"depression is not due to genetics"

 

 

really? I can't begin to tell you how misleading that statement is. False paradigms out the wazoo.

Of course I agree genetic propensities can play a role but they do not cause depression, it takes environmental triggers.

 

Both genetic and environmental triggers can come into play, it's impossible to define how much each factor weighs. The smallest thing, anything, can be a trigger if you have a strong enough genetic inclination. But a family history of depression shouldn't be seen as a predestined fate though, it's the interaction that the mind establishes between genetics and stimuli that will cause depression or other disorders.

I'd argue that in most instances, the environment has the last, controlling effect on a person's behaviour when it comes to depression and similar types of emotions. I place more emphasis on environment as it can be altered - we cannot have the same approach to genetics. Simply dwelling on genes gets us nowhere. Reconfigure you've environment as best as possible. Try and find things that are reinforcing to your behaviour. I realise this is easier said than done though.

 

When people speak of genetic propensities - it's important to pin down the person on what they mean. What are they saying? That someone carries a mutant gene which inhibits mood regulation? That somebody carries a higher rate of serotonin receptors than another person? Even neuroplasticity plays a dominant role in how neuronal networks are mapped out based on environmental experiences thus manipluating the 'pre-defined' neuronal paths genes might have influenced. I prefer hearing specifics but many who spout the genetic argument have trouble delivering the evidence and piecing it altogether from gene expression to the effect on behaviour. Of course genes play a role in behaviour, but a limited one at best when it comes to certain types of complex behaviours.

 

Of course things like neuroplasticity play a role, but for instance, a genetic propensity you might have may draw to you to interact with certain environments and stimuli, thus increasing its expression on you. Say you have a genetic predisposition that makes you very good at physics; you will feel drawn to acquire more knowledge about it, you'll seek out its instruments and, willingly or not, by furthering your cognitive interest your neural pathways will adjust to maximize your ability at physics. So in that case, there is a certain plasticity of the environment in regards to the genetics. If we're talking about someone who has a genetic predisposition for depression, they might have a tendency to prefer listening to depressing music, gravitate towards other depressed people, inadvertedly seeking out the environments and stimuli that will make them even more depressed. So yes, the environment has a huge influence, but itself is molded by the expression of the genes, so it becomes a chicken or the egg kind of thing.

 

Again, I'm not saying genetics supercedes environment, I'm just saying that to me they both appear to be too dependant on each other to establish that one is more important.

[murve33]

what does that mean?

You’re a nut! you’re crazy in the coconut!

Haha, that was too perfect.

[tokn]

ancestral eating patterns

 

uhm what exactly are and are you not eating now?

[Guest fiznuthian]

ancestral eating patterns

 

uhm what exactly are and are you not eating now?

 

Either some combination of meats, vegetables (pretty much given them up now anyway), fruits, tubers, eggs.. some people do nuts and seeds but I don't like them. I eat offal too. I cook everything in quality animal fat.

[Guest fiznuthian]

Basically barely anything is processed.. no bagged food, nothing in a box, no cereals, or whatever.

Pretty much 95% whole food and then i've experimented with things like chocolate, refined coconut oil, sugar, teas.. Some foods in our food supply are useful and get a bad rap (sucrose, fructose) but most others absolutely wreck me.

 

Eating this way made me a lot healthier, sticking to nutrient dense foods all the time. As a result I ended up exercising a lot more and felt even better. I get sunshine as much as possible, walk my dog, and do things like yoga, meditation,etc... I don't doubt these things helped me too, but I probably never would have started doing any of it if I didn't stop eating like shit and nourish my body with food.

[BCM]

i find the amount of very young people on here who claim to be "depressed" at age 15 or some shit, and are given fucking drugs by doctors to treat their supposed disorder, extremely alarming. seems to be a much worse problem

stateside... i mean, for fuck's sake everyone's depressed about something at 15 - you 're fucking 15! one minute up, the next down...this is called being a teenager. the fact that normal teenagers (who love any excuse to moan and would jump onto a "depression" diagnosis like flies to a fresh turd) are being diagnosed with depression et al, rather than being told to stop moaning and go and mow the lawn, plus being given mood-altering drugs by alleged professionals is absolutely scandalous.

[Guest A/D]

i find the amount of very young people on here who claim to be "depressed" at age 15 or some shit, and are given fucking drugs by doctors to treat their supposed disorder, extremely alarming. seems to be a much worse problem

stateside... i mean, for fuck's sake everyone's depressed about something at 15 - you 're fucking 15! one minute up, the next down...this is called being a teenager. the fact that normal teenagers (who love any excuse to moan and would jump onto a "depression" diagnosis like flies to a fresh turd) are being diagnosed with depression et al, rather than being told to stop moaning and go and mow the lawn, plus being given mood-altering drugs by alleged professionals is absolutely scandalous.

I know for a fact there are some serious cases out there where trying something is not a bad idea. I do think the idea of overmedication is awful and shouldn't be an easy conclusion, but there are some people for whom simply being told to mow the lawn isn't a solution. Also, I disagree that young people are just itching to be diagnosed with a mental disorder. I think you've got a touch of get-off-my-lawn syndrome, grandpa. Why don't you ask someone specifically about their issues instead of publicly decrying them all? Can't be bothered to go outside your own conclusions?

[Guest NZT]

You guys might find this video interesting. It shows you a woman suffering from depression getting a chip implanted into her brain to regulate her mood. She feels instantly better after the operation. Amazing. View from 43 minutes onwards.

 

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=80785608139596344