How does the World view China these days?

[ignatius]

1 hour ago, cyanobacteria said:

everyone knows "chinese people eat dogs" is a common racist statement. getting into technicalities is entering race realism territory.  american people eat cows.  it's just as bad and nobody talks about it

a lot of people talk about it but generally as part of environmental, ethical, veganism type angles. it's certainly missing from the radar of larger mainstream culture. industrial level factory farms are cruel places. food and where it comes from is largely invisible to many americans. 

america as the center of all things is a common thing for many americans. so, thinking about anything outside of american norms is thought of as "weird" by many americans. 

[chenGOD]

1 hour ago, rhmilo said:

3 hours ago, chenGOD said:

Again, your insistence on using the term non-Han as if that excludes then from being Chinese is what is problematic here.

How does non-Han equal non-Chinese? Those are two different things.

Notice that you yourself also wrote

Quote

China needs to maintain control of the border regions, where the population is largely non-Han. 

You’re claiming that Chinese don’t eat dog because the populations that do are non-Han (i.e. non-Chinese). 
My statement is that non-Han (who are Chinese) live in the border regions. 

[auxien]

pigs are very smart and they are also very tasty (tastiest meat i've ever had tbh). is this a correlation? idk, need some dolphin meat and elephant meat and human meat to compare. 

oh wait what were we talking about? China? that's right

a New Cold War is starting, as someone a page or two mentioned

https://www.wsj.com/articles/u-s-deploys-coast-guard-far-from-home-to-counter-china-11615813220

Quote

The fast-response cutter, operating around 6,600 miles from the continental U.S. and roughly 750 miles from its home port in the U.S. territory of Guam, is part of the Coast Guard’s newest growth area: helping counter China’s growing naval power in the Pacific.

...

The U.S. Coast Guard is building up in the region in response. In the past few months, it based two of its most advanced new cutters in the U.S. territory of Guam, nearly 4,000 miles closer to Shanghai than it is to San Francisco. One more is due to arrive in the coming months. For the first time, the Coast Guard has an attaché to the U.S. Embassy in Canberra, Australia, and another attaché will move to Singapore next year.

 

[prdctvsm]

Chinese Distant Water Fishing FleetUS Coast Guard to net wayward Chinese fishing fleets

[ignatius]

34 minutes ago, prdctvsm said:

Chinese Distant Water Fishing FleetUS Coast Guard to net wayward Chinese fishing fleets

it's only going to get worse because of climate change, environmental destruction. by 2050 there will be more plastic (by weight) in the oceans than fish. over fishing is heavily depleting huge parts of the oceans. some places seem to be holding steady and there are some things that can be done.. like marking huge parts of oceans as no fishing zones etc but it would take mega efforts from all countries and there doesn't seem to be a wilingness to do things like that. 

there are many conflicts just waiting to come to life as the environments degrade and climate change accelerates. once the the glaciers retreate beyond certain borders and melt waters flow in different directions, water supply will dry up in some parts of the world. the Ganges for example is fed from a glacier that's rapidly shrinking and once it goes far enough the rivers that feed the Ganges will be gone. I wonder what china and india will have to say about all that? 

"the coming anarchy" is gonna be rough. technology may ease some of the pressure in some places and for some consequences of climate change but world wide migrations and famines will be ever present and massive adding further pressure. 

 

[zlemflolia]

On 3/22/2021 at 5:21 PM, prdctvsm said:

Chinese Distant Water Fishing FleetUS Coast Guard to net wayward Chinese fishing fleets

ah yes thank you USA for preventing the biggest country on Earth from feeding its people

[zlemflolia]

and if you oppose fishing i suspect you must also be vegan right and support a communist revolution to centrally plan the economy in an ecologically sound way? otherwise what exactly are you complaining about

[brian trageskin]

cummunism

[Limo]

1 hour ago, cyanobacteria said:

ah yes thank you USA for preventing the biggest country on Earth from feeding its people

Bien étonnés de se trouver ensemble.

 

[chenGOD]

9 hours ago, cyanobacteria said:

ah yes thank you USA for preventing the biggest country on Earth from feeding its people

Read the article you blithering ninny. 

[zlemflolia]

https://www.fishwatch.gov/sustainable-seafood/the-global-picture

>The United States mainly imports seafood from China, Thailand, Canada, Indonesia, Vietnam, and Ecuador.

 

http://www.fao.org/in-action/globefish/countries/countries/usa/usa-trade/en/

>The United States of America was the world’s 4^th largest exporter and the largest importer of seafood by value in 2016

interdasting

[chenGOD]

2 hours ago, cyanobacteria said:

https://www.fishwatch.gov/sustainable-seafood/the-global-picture

>The United States mainly imports seafood from China, Thailand, Canada, Indonesia, Vietnam, and Ecuador.

 

http://www.fao.org/in-action/globefish/countries/countries/usa/usa-trade/en/

>The United States of America was the world’s 4^th largest exporter and the largest importer of seafood by value in 2016

interdasting

Not at all interesting. From your first link:

Quote

Today, NOAA Fisheries estimates that the United States imports more than 80 percent of the seafood we eat. A significant portion of imported seafood is caught by American fishermen, exported overseas for processing, and then reimported to the United States.  ...

We further estimate that about half of this imported seafood is from aquaculture.

And on the size of the distant water fishing fleets...

Quote

The Chinese government says its distant-water fishing fleet, or those vessels that travel far from China’s coast, numbers roughly 2,600, but other research, such as this study by the Overseas Development Institute (ODI), puts this number closer to 17,000, with many of these ships being invisible like those that satellite data discovered in North Korean waters. By comparison, the United States’ distant water fishing fleet has fewer than 300 vessels.

So even if you take official numbers, the Chinese fleet is roughly 8-9 times larger than the US fleet. 
 

As well, the US will actually prosecute their own fishermen who get caught fishing in protected waters or overfishing stocks.

[ignatius]

15 hours ago, brian trageskin said:

cummunism

 

[chenGOD]

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2021/3/28/philippines-deploys-air-force-as-fear-over-chinese-ships-mounts
 

Damn the imperialist US fighting the benevolent Chinese...oh wait. 

[ignatius]

52 minutes ago, chenGOD said:

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2021/3/28/philippines-deploys-air-force-as-fear-over-chinese-ships-mounts
 

Damn the imperialist US fighting the benevolent Chinese...oh wait. 

History class 2074: "in 2021 the Phillipine airforce sank 3 chinese fishing vessels.. and thus began the tuna wars..."

[zlemflolia]

 

Edited March 29, 2021 by cyanobacteria

[ignatius]

 

 

[Braintree]

I don't know anything about Max Blumenthal but he's really fighting a losing battle if he thinks it's not real. Just taking a pass through his video, I can see that he's making fallacious and specious arguments. He mentions toward the end that the US was in favor of the ethnic cleansing of Palestinians (heavily loaded language), however can't seem to make the connection that the US doesn't get involved in any human rights violations unless it benefits the US. There's no benefit to not supporting Israel, and there's no benefit to opposing China here. It's that there are many more eyes on China now so they have to finally take a stance.

Revealed: Massive Chinese Police Database

https://theintercept.com/2021/01/29/china-uyghur-muslim-surveillance-police/

Quote

Details of the investigations are contained in a massive police database obtained by The Intercept: the product of a reporting tool developed by private defense company Landasoft and used by the Chinese government to facilitate police surveillance of citizens in Xinjiang.

The database, centered on Ürümqi, includes policing reports that confirm and provide additional detail about many elements of the persecution and large-scale internment of Muslims in the area. It sheds further light on a campaign of repression that has reportedly seen cameras installed in the homes of private citizens, the creation of mass detention camps, children forcibly separated from their families and placed in preschools with electric fences, the systematic destruction of Uyghur cemeteries, and a systematic campaign to suppress Uyghur births through forced abortion, sterilization, and birth control.

That last sentence should be alarming since it's basically included in the literal definition of genocide.

Here's an older article that goes more in-depth about other things done by China before the internment camps were hot news: https://theintercept.com/2018/08/13/china-muslims-uighur-detention/

Quote

As with the U.S. presence in Afghanistan and Iraq, and Israel’s occupation of the West Bank and Gaza, China’s war on terror in Xinjiang risks becoming a self-fulfilling prophecy. But the Chinese — like the Americans and the Israelis — don’t really give a damn about alleged terrorist threats. This has much less to do with security and much more to with politics. Beijing is asserting control over a restless province that borders eight countries — including Pakistan and Afghanistan. Other economic factors come into play, too: Xinjiang is home to the country’s largest reserves of coal and natural gas.

Fighting terrorism, though, has become a useful cover for authoritarian governments around the world. Bequelin, who is the East Asia director at Amnesty International and a former visiting scholar at Yale Law School’s China Center, draws a “direct line” from the Bush declaration of a war on terror in 2001 to the repression of the Uyghurs in 2018. “The war on terror rhetoric immensely benefitted the Chinese,” said Bequelin. “It was a 180-degree turn for the discourse of the Chinese state with respect to its ability in Xinjiang: from minimizing and trying to hide it to casting its efforts and suppression of any form of dissent as ‘counterterrorism.’ So there is a direct line here.”

 

[chenGOD]

Blumenthal is a regular contributor to RT and Sputnik, and has his tongue so far up Putin’s ass he can taste what Putin is eating only seconds after Putin himself. 

From the moderator of the Marxism mailing list: https://newpol.org/max-blumenthal-and-streisand-effect/?print=pdf

[zlemflolia]

so basically the same surveillance the US does to its citizens, significantly better treatment than it gives to regions suffering from terrorism (bombing them all), and the same police treatment the US gives to minorities. so where is the US and NATO outcry against itself

[Braintree]

Your whataboutism is showing.

[ignatius]

31 minutes ago, cyanobacteria said:

so basically the same surveillance the US does to its citizens, significantly better treatment than it gives to regions suffering from terrorism (bombing them all), and the same police treatment the US gives to minorities. so where is the US and NATO outcry against itself

are you saying that the US federal gov't used the drug war as an excuse to lock up a generation of african americans as part of institutionalized racism? or was that just to scare white people to vote for hte law and order ticket? 

also, even if that's true and factual does that mean china gets a pas for locking up people based on race/religion/ethnicity for 're-education' and subjecting them to all the abuses that come along with that.. as well as what's essentially slavery (arguably what happens to prison work forces in the USA).. 

i don't think the surveillance states are comparable. china is an authoritarian state with a multilayered corrupt form of capitalism and a president for life. china is monitoring behavior and influencing it for its own purposes which is obviously to stay in power and make everyone good little citizens. 

we coud list stuff on a big dry erase board about each country and how its people are treated by the government and the list of outrages would be forever long and yet the countries are fundamentally different and very different experiences to live in for the average person. 

no one is saying the US has sunshine flying out its ass or that noam chomsky isn't right (well i'm not anyway). it's clear how the US has acted throughout history to anyone who seriously investigates it. many people don't and believe that the USA is the greates country that god ever gave to free people.. or something. 

china is just as fucked up and has been for a long time and has a pretty intense and at times strange history. 

Edited March 30, 2021 by ignatius

[Braintree]

Serious question, Zeff: do you think this guy was a CIA psyop?

[chenGOD]

25 minutes ago, cyanobacteria said:

the same police treatment the US gives to minorities

Where does the US round up members of an ethnic minority en masse in attempts to “re-educate” them and force sterilization on them? 
 

Which country has show trials with a >99% conviction rate (hint: it’s not the one you live in)?
 

32 minutes ago, cyanobacteria said:

bombing them all

China literally can’t bomb countries/regions that are suffering terrorist attacks, and that description of US foreign policy is as asinine as I’ve come to expect from you. China doesn’t have aircraft carriers in sufficient quantity to project force globally. If they did they would attempt to do so: we can see evidence of this in the Chinese actions around the Spratly’s in the South Pacific. Building artificial islands and installing air bases on them so they can remind SE Asian client states who’s the boss. 
 

 

50 minutes ago, cyanobacteria said:

the same surveillance the US does to its citizens

The US surveillance state is bush league compared to the Chinese one, and the big difference of course is that American news outlets are able to report on it without fear of retribution from the state. Chinese journalists...not so much. 

 

[ignatius]

21 minutes ago, Braintree said:

Serious question, Zeff: do you think this guy was a CIA psyop?

there's some NSFW photos of aftermath of teinnamen square out there that are pretty horrible.