depression

[Guest HokusPoker]

StephenG, I used to value your posts but here you're looking absolutely childish. Just give me one reason why the studies that were cited in those videos were not properly conducted and I'll gladly look at them. So far you haven't.

Instead you post a study that does not even include the word 'depression' or 'depressed'. Great work! As far as I know depression is not one of the “brain disorders characterized by the death of neurons.” (see, this is what a citation looks like) WHICH IS WHAT YOUR STUDY IS ABOUT. READ IT.

But apparently to you, disease is disease. Dis do reduce DA DISEASE, me gots to do dat!

 

Don't just say: PROPAGANDA!!! Be an adult. Tell me why.

 

You're feeling wonderful? Wonderful. Is that the science you would base your diet on though? Some guys on the internet? You choose to ignore studies you don't like and cite your own wellbeing as the ultimate advice for other people. StephenG's body, more accurate than the combined data of all studies indicating positive effects of vegan diet (which, even funnier, has nothing to do with lowfat or carbs per se, but how would you know that).

 

 

Let me cite your study one last time, just because it's funny:

“As the underlying mechanisms become better understood, it will be possible to develop alternative strategies that produce similar or even improved therapeutic effects without the need for exposure to an unpalatable and unhealthy, high-fat diet.”

 

lol. Good work, StephenG, good work.

[Hugh Mughnus]

herp de derp

 

you'll notice I said I was reading some scholarly articles.

 

Some.

 

More than one.

 

You seem to be really hung up on the fact that I posted that article in a thread about depression. I was simply sharing with my friend fiz here that keto diets have been linked to mental health, depression or otherwise. Partially because your vegan propaganda site had a link on the right stating that consumption of meat caused brain inflammation and brain diseases. Hence a response and link contributing evidence to the contrary.

 

And I am healthier than ever on a keto diet, thank you. Doctor says I'm fine. And I've been eating this way for months.

 

But here's a link that might help you.

 

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=ketogenic+diet+to+treat+depression

 

 

I'm not sure where our disconnect is.

Edited January 4, 2015 by StephenG

[Hugh Mughnus]

Lets just be friends hokus pls

[kakapo]

http://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2015/jan/04/depression-allergic-reaction-inflammation-immune-system

[Hugh Mughnus]

flol kak pls

[goDel]

http://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2015/jan/04/depression-allergic-reaction-inflammation-immune-system

Interesting article! Thx for posting.

 

flol kak pls

Forum tourettes?

[Hugh Mughnus]

[Guest HokusPoker]

http://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2015/jan/04/depression-allergic-reaction-inflammation-immune-system

 

That's interesting indeed. As it says in the article, (once this turns out to be a useful theory) it will be interesting to see whether this changes the public perception of depression. Nobody is being looked down upon for having a flu and feeling bad.

[MadameChaos]

hey guys! when friends fight, no one wins.

[Hugh Mughnus]

 

 

 

RE inflammation... It will be interesting to see what comes out of studies over the next several years. Seems to be lots of studies on either side of the fence.

[autopilot]

Those kittens look delicious and full of nutrients.

[Hugh Mughnus]

They are meat after all. mm amino acids... carnosine

[MassfreeKid]

Stop fighting. :) No one said it like Rainer Maria Rilke:

 

“Why do you want to shut out of your life any uneasiness, any misery, any depression, since after all you don't know what work these conditions are doing inside you? Why do you want to persecute yourself with the question of where all this is coming from and where it is going? Since you know, after all, that you are in the midst of transitions and you wished for nothing so much as to change. If there is anything unhealthy in your reactions, just bear in mind that sickness is the means by which an organism frees itself from what is alien; so one must simply help it to be sick, to have its whole sickness and to break out with it, since that is the way it gets better.”

 

-Letters to a young poet.

[Guest HokusPoker]

I'm not quite sure how you got the notion that I unfriended or friended anyone or that I was fighting.

All I was asking for all the time was for StephenG to back his FUD with evidence which he has failed to do so far. Easy as that.

[Adieu]

And these two:

http://nutritionfacts.org/video/plant-based-diet-mood/

http://nutritionfacts.org/video/improving-mood-through-diet/

 

Sorry for double-posting, I couldn't edit my post anymore.

 

A substance called “arachidonic acid” is one of the most abundant fatty acids in the brain, and is crucial your neurological health, since it helps build the cell membranes in your hippocampus, helps protect your brain from free radical damage, and activates proteins that are responsible for growth and repair of neurons in your brain (5). In one study, 18 month old infants who were given arachidonic acid supplements for 17 weeks showed significant improvements in intelligence, and in adults impaired arachidonic acid metabolism or insufficient arachidonic acid intake is linked to brain issues such as Alzheimer’s and bipolar disorder.

In my opinion, it would be silly to supplement with arachidonic acid since it is readily available in food sources, including Tilapia, catfish, yellowtail and mackerel (sushi anyone?), fatty cuts of meat, duck, eggs and dairy. If you want a better brain, you should frequently go out of your way to get your chompers on fatty foods.

Incidentally, this highlights a reason why very active women need to be careful not to let their body fat levels fall too low if they plan on having children. Hip and butt fat are full of the the specific omega-3 fatty acids and DHA necessary for major brain development during the development of a baby, and if women are low on body fat and low in DHA, this will severely compromise intelligence in the baby.

5. Fukaya, T.; Gondaira, T.; Kashiyae, Y.; Kotani, S.; Ishikura, Y.; Fujikawa, S.; Kiso, Y.; Sakakibara, M. (2007). “Arachidonic acid preserves hippocampal neuron membrane fluidity in senescent rats”. Neurobiology of Aging 28 (8): 1179–1186.

http://www.neurobiologyofaging.org/article/S0197-4580%2806%2900182-5/abstract

Previous studies indicate that long-term dietary supplementation with arachidonic acid (AA) in 20-month-old rats (OA) effectively restores performance in a memory task and the induction of long-term potentiation in the hippocampus to the level of young control animals (YC). The present study examined protein mobility using the live cell imaging technique “Fluorescent Recovery After Photobleaching (FRAP)” in YC, old control (OC) and OA neurons in hippocampal slice preparations. Three measures; mobile fraction (Mf), diffusion constant (D) and time constant (τ), were estimated among YC, OC and OA. Each of these parameters was significantly different between OC and YC, suggesting that membrane fluidity is lower in OC than in YC. In contrast, D and τ were comparable in OA and YC, indicating that hippocampal neuronal membranes supplemented with AA were more fluid than those in OC, whereas the fraction of diffusible protein in the bleached region remained smaller than in YC. Long-term administration of AA to senescent rats might help to preserve membrane fluidity and maintain hippocampal plasticity.

The science in this video is bad because it's based on personal assessments of mood in my opinion and not biological markers.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15812447

Growth and development of preterm infants fed infant formulas containing docosahexaenoic acid and arachidonic acid. Abstract

OBJECTIVES:

To evaluate safety and benefits of feeding preterm infants formulas containing docosahexaenoic acid (DHA) and arachidonic acid (ARA) until 92 weeks postmenstrual age (PMA), with follow-up to 118 weeks PMA.

STUDY DESIGN:

This double-blinded study of 361 preterm infants randomized across three formula groups: (1) control, no supplementation; (2) algal-DHA (DHA from algal oil, ARA from fungal oil); and (3) fish-DHA (DHA from fish oil, ARA from fungal oil). Term infants breast-fed > or =4 months (n = 105) were a reference group. Outcomes included growth, tolerance, adverse events, and Bayley development scores.

RESULTS:

Weight of the algal-DHA group was significantly greater than the control group from 66 to 118 weeks PMA and the fish-DHA group at 118 weeks PMA but did not differ from term infants at 118 weeks PMA. The algal-DHA group was significantly longer than the control group at 48, 79, and 92 weeks PMA and the fish-DHA group at 57, 79, and 92 weeks PMA but did not differ from term infants from 79 to 118 weeks PMA. Supplemented groups had higher Bayley mental and psychomotor development scores at 118 weeks PMA than did the control group. Supplementation did not increase morbidity or adverse events.

 

Feeding formulas with DHA and ARA from algal and fungal oils resulted in enhanced growth. Both supplemented formulas provided better developmental outcomes than unsupplemented formulas.

Edited January 9, 2015 by AdieuErsatzEnnui

[delet...]

So we've got to have algal and not fish oil now ?

[Adieu]

So we've got to have algal and not fish oil now ?

 

Nah, just take fish oil. There are three types of omega 3's ALA, DHA, and EPA. You should supplement DHA and EPA. If you want to be super OCD about it supplement with a mixture of fish oil and krill oil. Krill oil contains some shit that is better for certain things, but it isn't in fish oil. I can link you to a video where someone talks about it, but I can't remember the exact mechanism off the top of my head.

[delet...]

cool, cheers mate. Also i'd be super intrested to hear the videosplanation. If it's an hassle though, it's all good, i'll look it up at some point. I need to be more militant about the tablets, there is little doubt to me that i need all the help my brain can get, no matter how marginal.

[Bitraete]

try seeing a psychologist, not a psychiatrist

 

I agree, although be prepared for them to be shit.

 

I feel like finding a good psychologist is as hard as finding "the one".

[Adieu]

cool, cheers mate. Also i'd be super intrested to hear the videosplanation. If it's an hassle though, it's all good, i'll look it up at some point. I need to be more militant about the tablets, there is little doubt to me that i need all the help my brain can get, no matter how marginal.

 

So I think it is this podcast, but I know for sure it is one of the 3 podcasts between Dr. Rhonda Patrick and Joe Rogan.

 

 

 

 

Either way all 3 are very interesting and informative.

 

try seeing a psychologist, not a psychiatrist

 

I agree, although be prepared for them to be shit.

 

I feel like finding a good psychologist is as hard as finding "the one".

 

 

Fuck a psychologist. Fuck a psychiatrist. Go see a nutritionist. Get your blood work done, and talk about it with a qualified person. Then go get a physical therapist.

Edited January 10, 2015 by AdieuErsatzEnnui

[delet...]

thanks, i went through to further into the first vid and had a listen for 40 mins or so. In her area of expertise that woman is quite intresting (i didn't find the omega 3, DHA stuff though), i just couldn't handle rogan. Now i know he's a nice kid, but it's like she had been talking about studies where they were looking the outcomes in the brain's of mice after injecting them with circumin. Patrick had been talking about mice for a while and rogan thinks that she's talking about injecting them into humans and confuses this a couple of times (probably because he's on the lookout for miracle cures that he can use now and so his thinking is driven by this (he did admit to being impulsive so i wouldn't be surprised should he have then jacked a few mg of circumin if she'd said it had been tried in humons)), the second time she corrects him. It's a bit tedious. Then at the end his theory that depressives are all aggressive people which he forces the woman who obviously hadn't thought about it much to agree despite her reservations and trying to intimate that it's more complicated than that.

 

So I looked up and watched a couple of vids on the value of DHA on working memory in children.

 

https://www.youtube.com/user/FABResearch/videos

 

Mostly she's just having to explain the trials (to defend her research which even today as she states is considered 'controversial'), and they don't show the slides which is kind of annoying, but i'm sure if i pursued it i'd find lots more info.

[Adieu]

Second video at 2:10:50 she talks about it some. I think she clarifies more specifics in the 1st video which was the third meeting. I just don't know at one point in that video they discuss it. Joe Rogan is a pretty chill dude. I'm surprised he can bother you that much.

[delet...]

He doesn't bother me per se, he's just so daft. heh. So even though you have a very with it guest, he doesn't follow on with insightful questions. Of course i have a way of phrasing things, which can seem a little dark to some haha. Oh god, i don't want to have offended you as well man, i've ended up on enough watmmr's shitlists from sacred cow tipping already. They're all good or indifferent with me and then one day, i touch that nerve. -sie- / heh .. Anyway, i don't mind the podcast as long as the host stays schtum. But i don't hate the host in any way shape or form, he seems interested in reality (which is good) even as he's baffled by it (as are most of us).

 

I'll have a listen to the bit you recommended thanks for digging it up for me, appreciate. [-;

[marf]

ive read ECT is very effective, if you dont respond to meds.

 

talking to a psychologist is nice to vent to and be a baby around, they compliment the smallest things you do, but i dont see them solving any problems. sometimes talking things out is good, but so much is brain chemistry , how do you talk that out?

Edited January 10, 2015 by marf

[Candiru]

Depression taking on different forms throughout your life and all the inherent mindfuckery is a tough one to explain to your co-workers eh? Hehehehehehehehehrheh *drools, mouths words silently and fondles self*