Now That Trump's President... (not any more!)

[pyramidpanes]

silver lining: we're seeing some really intense progressive action going on right now, with people rallying to address climate change and bernie sanders helping progressives take over the dnc. we wouldn't have seen those with a clinton presidency, people would have been more complacent.

 

with people rallying to address climate change

 

Trump seeking quickest way to quit Paris climate agreement, says report

 

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/nov/13/trump-looking-at-quickest-way-to-quit-paris-climate-agreement-says-report

 

 

nice progressive action 

[pyramidpanes]

just one more thing 

[Adieu]

You guys are so autistic sometimes

[ignatius]

"Donal Trump to shit right in the environment's mouth"  - is basically what we're gonna get. 

[Adieu]

"Donal Trump to shit right in the environment's mouth"  - is basically what we're gonna get. 

 

Yes, he wants to make america the most dominant super power in the world and to do that he will sacrifice the earth.

[AJW]

Trump has more magnetism in his little finger than both magnetic poles put together, and they know it, even the climate voted Trump.

[pyramidpanes]

 

 

silver lining: we're seeing some really intense progressive action going on right now, with people rallying to address climate change and bernie sanders helping progressives take over the dnc. we wouldn't have seen those with a clinton presidency, people would have been more complacent.

 

i don't understand how you interpreted me saying "people rallying to address climate change" as "donald trump wants to address climate change." i'm referring to progressive organizations, grassroots movements, and world governments. example:

 

 

 

i'm interpreting it with knowledge who you voted for 

 

also 

 

“It was reckless for the Paris agreement to enter into force before the election,” said the source, who works on Trump’s transition team for international energy and climate policy, speaking on condition of anonymity. The Paris agreement went into force on 4 November, four days before last Tuesday’s election.

Alternatives were to send a letter withdrawing from a 1992 convention that is the parent treaty of the Paris agreement, voiding US involvement in both in a year’s time, or to issue a presidential order simply deleting the US signature from the Paris accord, the source told Reuters.

Edited November 13, 2016 by pyramidpanes

[LimpyLoo]

We may take a step back during the next 4 years, but we'll take 2 steps forward after. Then these outmoded values will die with time.

 

 

 

Citation needed, innit.

 

There is no magical law that says things must get better. Humanity spent the 20th century trying to destroy itself with wars and nukes and genocides, and the only reason we wormed our way out of the apocalypse *twice* during the Cold War was dumb fucking luck.

 

It's way easier to break things than to improve and maintain them. Humanity spent many thousands of years with an authoritarian boot on its collective throat, and it seems like some of us are eager to be in that position again.

 

 

But, as Hoodie said, people are mobilizing. People are rallying around Bernie. There is no greater motivator in the universe than pain and negative emotion, and we currently have a massive surplus of that, so we'll see.

[zkom]

Talking about counter-reactions, I'm a little bit concerned that left-wing radical terrorist groups might start to emerge if Trump and the Republicans start going too far. Similar to Weather Underground or Red Army Faction.

[KovalainenFanBoy]

[may be rude]

executive chairmain of (overtly racist "news" outlet) breitbart stephen bannon named chief strategist and senior counselor in trump administration.

Edited November 13, 2016 by very honest

[doublename]

Struggle sessions Gon b lit

Edited November 13, 2016 by doublename

[may be rude]

silver lining: we're seeing some really intense progressive action going on right now, with people rallying to address climate change and bernie sanders helping progressives take over the dnc. we wouldn't have seen those with a clinton presidency, people would have been more complacent.

 

yeah, there will be a number of silver linings like this. we would have spent 4 years futiley fighting an ocean of anti-hillary propaganda if she won, and nothing noteworthy would have happened, unless the democrats took back a significant portion of congress.

 

i'll still never like trump, or even think voting for him was a good idea. far too dangerous, far too much that can easily shift in ways most people couldn't imagine.

 

given my disdain for bigots, and in light of people talking about good things trump might do, i've been wondering what it would take for me to like him. not only would he have to defeat aliens, it would have to be a brilliant victory, like against all odds he came up with some ingenious plan to save humanity from merciless invaders. then i think i would have to hand it to him, and say the racist really pulled it off.

Edited November 13, 2016 by very honest

[koolkeyZ865]

EDIT: Tax dollars hard at work

Edited November 13, 2016 by clarktrent

[ignatius]

honestly need to beat these people back into their caves

 

"A Frank Conversation with a White Nationalist"

 

https://www.revealnews.org/episodes/a-frank-conversation-with-a-white-nationalist/

 

white nationalists are mainstreaming. 

 

Richard Spencer is among the tens of millions of Americans who are excited about Donald Trump’s coming presidency. The 38-year-old white nationalist heads a small organization, called the National Policy Institute, and believes people of different skin color are inherently different, hate each other and should live separately.

 

For instance, Spencer tells Al his long-term dream is an “ethnostate” – a territory set aside for people of European descent.

 

“So that we would always have a safe space,” Spencer says. “We would always have a homeland for us. Very similar to … how Jews conceive of Israel.”

 

Living all mixed together, he suggests, has not worked out that well.

 

Spencer also says he believes that Trump opens the door for white identity politics to become an overt and welcome part of mainstream conversation in America for the first time.

 

 

 

 

[chim]

So 60 minutes just aired this interview with the Trumps

 

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/60-minutes-donald-trump-family-melania-ivanka-lesley-stahl/

 

No major surprises, gracious words about his opponent and predecessor. he's not going to take the $400k salary, he's probably not going to prosecute Hillary. Acting really surprised about the hate crime news, and thinks protesters are "professional protesters". Interview was a bit of a joke, just a sales pitch with no finesse at all. His family all look like reptilians

[doublename]

Professional protestors... buddy is gonna go full Erdogan in no time.

[Brisbot]

LimpyLoo, on 13 Nov 2016 - 3:46 PM, said:

 

 

Brisbot, on 13 Nov 2016 - 12:25 PM, said:

We may take a step back during the next 4 years, but we'll take 2 steps forward after. Then these outmoded values will die with time.

 

Citation needed, innit.

 

There is no magical law that says things must get better. Humanity spent the 20th century trying to destroy itself with wars and nukes and genocides, and the only reason we wormed our way out of the apocalypse *twice* during the Cold War was dumb fucking luck.

 

It's way easier to break things than to improve and maintain them. Humanity spent many thousands of years with an authoritarian boot on its collective throat, and it seems like some of us are eager to be in that position again.

 

 

But, as Hoodie said, people are mobilizing. People are rallying around Bernie. There is no greater motivator in the universe than pain and negative emotion, and we currently have a massive surplus of that, so we'll see.

come on don't be difficult, it's just more a 'hope' thing than anything. Things ARE better than they were in the past... it is just SLOW AS SHIT progress. Not everything is better, but more things are than not. The truth of what I think there is... we won't see a ton of progress by the time we're old. Looking at old peeps now, pop culture has changed more than general morals.

 

Btw, I saw a chart somewhere I wish I could link (I'ma go look for it) detailing that in the category of 18-25 year olds, almost every single state voted democrat.

 

Also looking at other countries besides the USA like the Scandanavian countries.

 

Except environmental issues. Things are just worse, and will likely become worse, even if every single country were on the same page about climate change and made steps to ween ourselves off fossil fuel dependency.

 

Quote

 

white nationalists are mainstreaming.

I wonder how true this is. I imagine they are simply feeling empowered at the moment. Soon their Reagan years will return, and they'll be able to show their true colors. Edited November 14, 2016 by Brisbot

[LimpyLoo]

I'm not trying to be contrarian.

 

I'm just cautioning against the 'things on balance get better' complacency. I think the appropriate attitude for humanity right now is great anxiety

about the environment

and about the recent global rise of extreme right-wing nationalism

(If not outright authoritarianism)

 

Thinking things will always be okay is a "moral hazard"

and it can cause people to make bad situations way worse

 

 

And this is what (at least partly) caused the banking crisis ("no matter what we do, there is a bailout that will protect the system from collapsing")

And this quite possibly contributed to the low voter turnout among Democrats ("the polls say HRC is a lock so it's redundant for me to vote")

 

Likewise with every other possible problem

Including climate catastrophe

and the sorts of problems we already went through in the 20th century (but didn't learn a fucking thing)

 

So no, we shouldn't be hopeful

We should act as if the future depends on exactly what we do

And avoid complacency at all costs

Edited November 14, 2016 by LimpyLoo

[ignatius]

 

Quote

 

white nationalists are mainstreaming.

I wonder how true this is. I imagine they are simply feeling empowered at the moment. Soon their Reagan years will return, and they'll be able to show their true colors.

 

 

reagan years and this white nationalism mainstreaming are different things.. different people. just as one example the KKK didn't put reagan on the front page of their official newspaper and after the election claim that they "had a roll in the victory".

 

we're seeing a green light to the most far right wing racists. the guy in that interview saying he was moving his group's HQ to washington to have more direct influence and become part of the conversation is something to pay attention to. 

 

not that washington has had its share of total racists out in the open but they were old white men dying off.. strom thurmond.. jesse helms etc.. still this is something different.  it's being packaged differently and marketed differently. 

 

 

I'm not trying to be contrarian.

 

I'm just cautioning against the 'things on balance get better' complacency. I think the appropriate attitude for humanity right now is great anxiety

about the environment

and about the recent global rise of extreme right-wing nationalism

(If not outright authoritarianism)

 

Thinking things will always be okay is a "moral hazard"

and it can cause people to make bad situations way worse

 

 

And this is what (at least partly) caused the banking crisis ("no matter what we do, there is a bailout that will protect the system from collapsing")

And this quite possibly contributed to the low voter turnout among Democrats ("the polls say HRC is a lock so it's redundant for me to vote")

 

Likewise with every other possible problem

Including climate catastrophe

and the sorts of problems we already went through in the 20th century (but didn't learn a fucking thing)

 

So no, we shouldn't be hopeful

We should act as if the future depends on exactly what we do

And avoid complacency at all costs

 

well said.  a lot of people always say "well, we had a democrat for 8 years so... it was time for change to keep it balanced" which is doubly dumb this time around since we had republican congress blocking every damn thing mildly progressive and even things they agreed with philosophically to spite the president who was from a different party. 

 

it's partisan horse shit. 

[juiceciuj]

if most jobs can be automated and a few rich people get most of the poor people to kill themselves that's gotta even the global warming shit out pretty good, yeah?

[ambermonk]

I'm in the same boat as Hoodie in that this might be a golden opportunity for the Democratic party to clean house. Can't blame third party voters for Hillary's loss either cos she still got the most popular votes.

No more fake corporate whoring muthafuckas. Time for the Dems to regroup and establish a true progressive platform.

[Brisbot]

Limpy, you are putting too much substance into those words. I literally wrote it in a few seconds. I'm not advocating for complacency. Obviously a bigot running for the white house is an issue that needs to be addressed when it arises.

There are a LOT of reasons for Trump winning. For instance in no particular order: people mistakenly believe he's anti-establishment (lul), people  mistakenly think he'll get money out of politics, people mistakenly consider Hillary the SJW candidate and vote based solely on that (as if no other issues exist to them), conservatives always vote conservative, actual racism, some people think that a women shouldn't be in the white house (sexism), they mistakenly think a business man equals good politics, and lots more tho I am tired and am drawing a blank.

side-topic here, but an interesting article: http://www.latimes.com/politics/la-na-pol-donald-trump-american-voices-20161113-story.html 

As they say, in the south here, it's the opposite, where if you say you're voting for Hillary, people will think a less of you. I'd be lying if I said this topic wasn't somewhat therapeutic since I'm basically trapped on nearly all sides by conservatism. My family probably thinks I need an intervention because I never fell for their conservative crap, well I did till I was about 13/14. A lot of them are just now finding out I'm not a conservative and are 'concerned'. It's actually kind of funny. They just assumed I was a conservative because everyone else is. They also think I believe in God. I wonder how they'll react when they find out I don't. Normal people would be okay with it like I am okay with their beliefs, however authoritative people think differently. 

 

 

 

I'm in the same boat as Hoodie in that this might be a golden opportunity for the Democratic party to clean house.

Not going to happen. The party is kinda already championing Kaine to be the next nominee. I am calling it now. The only thing the establishment will learn is that they need to fake populism, and perhaps not choose a candidate with a semi-bad reputation, whether it's true or not.

I WISH they will clean house, I am just doubtful

Edited November 14, 2016 by Brisbot

[LimpyLoo]

Well, to the extent you were saying things will be fine, I was saying we have no real reason to think that, and thinking that might actually make things worse

[azatoth]

I have little faith that the Dems will realize their problems and address why they got their ass handed to them. They are too deep in the pocket of big money. Reading some of the liberal pundits it seems they completely missed the reason why they lost. The Dems got complacent. The minorities have caught up to them and seen that the Dems don't give a shit about them other than having them as a voting block. And they also forgot the working class, completely ignored them.