psn Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 Knausgaard's Min kamp Wow, you're really leaping into it! :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alcofribas Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 Knausgaard's Min kamp Wow, you're really leaping into it! :) Yeah I've been reading the last book with a friend who is from Norway so she's been helping me through it. For the others I had the English translations to use (I started reading it like 3 years ago lol). You read it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caze Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 I've printed this thread and read through it multiple times with my legal clerks, I only have one question. What in ever loving fuq are "pinky glasses"? 'rose tinted glasses' obviously Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WNS000 Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 Lol some muslims - the PM of Pakistan is just "some muslim". I suppose the Ulema council are just "some muslims" and their condemnation of honour killings and ISIS don't mean anything. The PEW research shows that there are large Muslim populations that don't support Sharia and honour killings and all the stuff of your nightmares. Further, you have to look beyond answers to polls and actual data. If the belief that stoning was just was matched by actual action then the numbers of actual stonings would be much higher - that they are not suggests something. And yes, I know more than one Muslim, and have talked to them about these issues so I guess I win the battle of anecdotal evidence? And I've lived in countries where the Muslim population is much higher than anything in Europe, and guess what - even my heathen ass made it out of there. But keep living in fear. So you actually believe that PM of Pakistan and Ulema (intellectuals) have influence on normal (often uneducated) Muslim population (often on countryside where stuff like witch hunting still works)? Are you living in a fairy tale? What influence have academic intellectuals on stupid parts of USA for example? Incredible amount of naivity you got there. Please, do some research about behaviour of people. It is not for the first time I advocate looking on psychological, neurological and psychiatric facts. What the hell, man. The whole point is that PEW research clearly shows that a significant number of Muslims believes in inhumane and unacceptable ideals. I don't care that large Muslim population don't support Sharia. I care that there is still a huge number (in some countries overwhelming majorities!) of Muslims that supports it! Also the migrants to Europe are mostly from poor background don't forget. My "anecdotal evidence" was just making of point that even well-situated Muslims with high degree of education can believe in stuff like Sharia, punishment for homosexuals, stoning for adultery and killing of apostates while talking about those stuff as if nothing happened. These problems are widely spread in the whole Muslim world. 1,6 billion Muslims so now take those percents from the PEW research and calculate the number of culturally absolutely incompatible Muslims. It is clearly not a "radical minority" at all. And that is the main point. With such numbers, immigration to Europe from Muslim countries is a huge risk. It will get progressively worse with their numbers increasing in following decades. It is just a pure logic based on the actual data from respected sources. But keep living in fairy tale. Also, don't try to make nationalist and xenophobe from me with your "your country" and "them" arguments in your previous post. I have no problem with tolerant, humane people from different cultures. I just say that the risk with Muslims is huge and data speaks clearly at this moment. I've printed this thread and read through it multiple times with my legal clerks, I only have one question. What in ever loving fuq are "pinky glasses"? 'rose tinted glasses' obviously Precisely. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WNS000 Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 Also, it does not really matter how many of the Muslims are going to actually kill somebody. It is pretty sufficient that a huge number of Muslims would support fundamentalist leaders of their communities in Europe, progressively changing their environment to their liking. The rest is known from the history of 20th century. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psn Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 Knausgaard's Min kamp Wow, you're really leaping into it! :) Yeah I've been reading the last book with a friend who is from Norway so she's been helping me through it. For the others I had the English translations to use (I started reading it like 3 years ago lol). You read it? No, unsure if all the autobiographical details/confessions are something I'll appreciate. Maybe some day! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alcofribas Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 Knausgaard's Min kamp Wow, you're really leaping into it! :) Yeah I've been reading the last book with a friend who is from Norway so she's been helping me through it. For the others I had the English translations to use (I started reading it like 3 years ago lol). You read it? No, unsure if all the autobiographical details/confessions are something I'll appreciate. Maybe some day! yeah, I understand that's not everyone's cup of tea. it's quite a beautiful book though imho Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WNS000 Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 Some European politicians speculate that the recent Munich attack could be an extreme right-wing attack for the 5th anniversary of the Breivik's shooting. If it gets confirmed then we will see another step towards civil conflict in Europe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chenGOD Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 Jev - the risk in your country of Sharia law coming into effect is literally nil. None. This goes for any European country. Estimates from PEW indicate that by 2030 Muslims will make up 8% of Europe's population (and that includes Russia with a huge Muslim population). In Poland, the Muslim population represents less than 0.1% of the population, so yes, keep living in fear. I'd say if anything the president and clerics have a larger influence on uneducated people, as they are more willing to accept orders from on high as it were (see Trump effect). I think if you review the PEW data more carefully you'll find that indeed, the number of total muslims who support it are a minority, and as I've been trying to show, views are changing - not in 30 years but they are changing today. However, you seem determined to believe that Muslims are monolithic group incapable of change. So again, no constructive debate to be found. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 news just showed a new video from earlier today with one of the Munich shooters yelling from a rooftop - sounded like a German guy. btw there was one shooting incident at a shopping mall. Not multiple shooting like reported elsewhere. my gf's mom was at that mall just one hour before the shooting.. I've eaten at the McD where this started in the past, Munich's only useful music gear shoppe is basically next door.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alcofribas Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 my gf's mom was at that mall just one hour before the shooting.. I've eaten at the McD where this started in the past, Munich's only useful music gear shoppe is basically next door.. shit dude that is scary! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salvatorin Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 verdammte Kake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WNS000 Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 Jev - the risk in your country of Sharia law coming into effect is literally nil. None. This goes for any European country. Estimates from PEW indicate that by 2030 Muslims will make up 8% of Europe's population (and that includes Russia with a huge Muslim population). In Poland, the Muslim population represents less than 0.1% of the population, so yes, keep living in fear. Oh, so if it does not happen tomorrow, it is OK, right? Not in my book. Also, I don't care about "global" population of Muslims in the whole Europe. Even one new European state with a significant number of Muslims would be a catastrophe. This logic of yours against shows your naivety about the whole issue. Also, Poland will probably stay clear of Muslims, because they fucking hate them there. What does that change about my arguments? Nothing. Still a huge risk for civil unrest, riots, pogroms and genocides across Europe. I'd say if anything the president and clerics have a larger influence on uneducated people, as they are more willing to accept orders from on high as it were (see Trump effect). If the leader is actually in unison with their opinions though. Intellectuals claiming opposite opinions to idiots is like a guaranteed way to not get elected ever again. Stupid people actually have strong opinions that they keep because they behave mainly according to their instincts (racism, xenophobia, violence, easy solutions) and it is very difficult to change them by presenting opposite opinions (tolerance, understanding, moderation, peace, sophistication). The more intellectual you are for them, the worse. Bad argument and again confirming your naivety in this issue. I repeat, study some psychological theories about human behaviour and intelligence. Also, I recommend living between such people to really understand their thinking. Discussing stuff with your educated friends in cafe does not really count as an experience with stupid masses. Repeated active exchange of opinions with stupid people is extremely valuable experience in human behaviour. I think if you review the PEW data more carefully you'll find that indeed, the number of total muslims who support it are a minority What do you not understand about this graph (and that is only Sharia question)? and as I've been trying to show, views are changing - not in 30 years but they are changing today. However, you seem determined to believe that Muslims are monolithic group incapable of change. I have never said they are a monolithic group incapable of change. When they changed, they can come to Europe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auxien Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 jfc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amen Warrior Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 I have never said they are a monolithic group incapable of change. When they changed, they can come to Europe. That's a lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doublename Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WNS000 Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 I have never said they are a monolithic group incapable of change. When they changed, they can come to Europe.That's a lol You can now explain why. Looking forward to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
usagi Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 take a timeout, dickhead. you're not impressing anyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doublename Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WNS000 Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 take a timeout, dickhead. you're not impressing anyone. Take your pills, mate and enjoy: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amen Warrior Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 I have never said they are a monolithic group incapable of change. When they changed, they can come to Europe.That's a lol You can now explain why. Looking forward to it. It's actually quite a densely packed multilol, but mainly this I have never said they are a monolithic group When they changed, they can come to Europe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WNS000 Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 I have never said they are a monolithic group incapable of change. When they changed, they can come to Europe.That's a lol You can now explain why. Looking forward to it. It's actually quite a densely packed multilol, but mainly this I have never said they are a monolithic group When they changed, they can come to Europe. Yes, "they" is roughly the % in the graph. Should have been more clear. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amen Warrior Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 What the hell is there to argue? It's not the fault of a dogmatic set of principals that are originally inherent in the teachings of the Quran. End of story, the argument of the religion being at fault falls by the wayside. If you've ever skimmed it, it's not all that different from the bible and even a bit more uplifting than the usual Judeo-Christian teachings. All this leads to the point that there are just very angry and reactionary people in the world who twist supposed 'holy' words to fit their weird emotions or craziness. No different than Christian crazies or really any extremist faction. It's the perversion of 'faith' that leads to incomplete people doing atrocious things and has for centuries. How are we still on this topic? Painting in such broad strokes as "it's the religion's fault, bad religion, baaaaad" is completely missing the multitude of other reasons that reactionary and extremest 'terror' groups exist and continue to gather influence in places of the world that are war-torn, undereducated and pissed. For a triple threat like yourself, Jev2.0, I don't know how you're still arguing that point. It's not the suggestion that a religion may be responsible for the acts of shitty people that people can't wrap their heads around, it's more the complete lack of cognition and bigger-picture that someone like yourself must have to spout such nonsense above the multitude of other reasons things like this happen and keep happening. If you mention Sam Harris, I swear to god... I personally know a Muslim guy. Smiling, friendly, university education, no poverty (studying abroad in Europe). Believes in Sharia; absolutely cannot comprehend atheists, homosexuality and free sex; Quran is 100% pure, Muhammad too; European culture is completely opposite to his. I wasn't prepared yet to ask him about stoning for adultery and forced marriages. Anecdotally all my Polish mates are way more (openly) racist, homophobic and violent than any musulmen I know. So fuck? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WNS000 Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 What the hell is there to argue? It's not the fault of a dogmatic set of principals that are originally inherent in the teachings of the Quran. End of story, the argument of the religion being at fault falls by the wayside. If you've ever skimmed it, it's not all that different from the bible and even a bit more uplifting than the usual Judeo-Christian teachings. All this leads to the point that there are just very angry and reactionary people in the world who twist supposed 'holy' words to fit their weird emotions or craziness. No different than Christian crazies or really any extremist faction. It's the perversion of 'faith' that leads to incomplete people doing atrocious things and has for centuries. How are we still on this topic? Painting in such broad strokes as "it's the religion's fault, bad religion, baaaaad" is completely missing the multitude of other reasons that reactionary and extremest 'terror' groups exist and continue to gather influence in places of the world that are war-torn, undereducated and pissed. For a triple threat like yourself, Jev2.0, I don't know how you're still arguing that point. It's not the suggestion that a religion may be responsible for the acts of shitty people that people can't wrap their heads around, it's more the complete lack of cognition and bigger-picture that someone like yourself must have to spout such nonsense above the multitude of other reasons things like this happen and keep happening. If you mention Sam Harris, I swear to god... I personally know a Muslim guy. Smiling, friendly, university education, no poverty (studying abroad in Europe). Believes in Sharia; absolutely cannot comprehend atheists, homosexuality and free sex; Quran is 100% pure, Muhammad too; European culture is completely opposite to his. I wasn't prepared yet to ask him about stoning for adultery and forced marriages. Anecdotally all my Polish mates are way more (openly) racist, homophobic and violent than any musulmen I know. So fuck? Not surprising. Are they also keen on actually killing homosexuals and apostates (meaning would they support such laws)? We are talking Sharia here, not regular idiots having stupid opinions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keanu reeves Posted July 23, 2016 Share Posted July 23, 2016 I personally know a Muslim guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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