wtf is a person supposed to actually do about israel murdering hundreds of innocent civilians.

[Npoess]

lol

[awepittance]

 

hey lets just say that the 'enemy' loves death, that works right?

oh, but they do:

 

Qur'an (4:74) - "Let those fight in the way of Allah who sell the life of this world for the other. Whoso fighteth in the way of Allah, be he slain or be he victorious, on him We shall bestow a vast reward."

 

Qur'an (9:111) - "Allah hath purchased of the believers their persons and their goods; for theirs (in return) is the garden (of Paradise): they fight in His cause, and slay and are slain: a promise binding on Him in truth, through the Law, the Gospel, and the Qur'an: and who is more faithful to his covenant than Allah? then rejoice in the bargain which ye have concluded: that is the achievement supreme."

 

Hi Compson

[Cryptowen]

WATMM is an idm techno musics forum. Our areas of expertise include:

 

-idm techno musics

-weird old synths

-lighthearted shitposting

-whoa man, the universe

 

Note that persuasively arguing opinions on global politics, gender relations, and the artistic integrity of vsts is not on that list

[delet...]

people seem pretty unpersuasive about how unpersuasive that we are, don't ya think.

[xox]

I'm not going to get into it, but you can surely see, even on a layman's reading, that those passages from Deuteronomy are very different from the passages I quoted from the Quran. One is about killing to purify, not out of selfishness. The other is about killing for the reward of paradise. The latter concept does not exist in Judaism or Christianity, but it does in Islam.

 

lol shit! plz shea, that was really a compson show time you did there. also, that's YOUR interpretation of those verses from quran, sorry and only lunatic uneducated and brainwashed fundamentalist (such a wrong word but i'm force to use it in a conversation with uneducated ppl) would agree with you. heh...you even have a long beard, which is one of their trademarks today (thnx to fox news and such/similar sources).

 

to fully understand what they meant and mean you need to read and understand the whole of quran + know what muhammed said about the matter + know the circumstances of that time and place. (maybe someone would understand it just by seeing the verses but i guess you're not of those ppl and i'm not saying that you're stupid but it's the time and place we're living in that i blame)

 

 

a lot of ppl at those early times of islam didn't want to go to war cause in all wars at that time muslims was (attacked and) outnumbered and everybody wanted to kill them since the day one cause they were actively, out loud, propagating unpopular ethics like one state, global justice and global social rights, womens rights (equal rights, rights to divorce, possession of goods, participation in war and every public activity if they want...which they gained after those wars but not all at once) and democracy what was directly against the most influential ppl, leaders and against their economical system of that time (our time too and every time i'd say). if that's the case, isn't fighting for those ethics also a ''fight in the way of Allah''? that's the key moment you have to understand if you want to understand aaany religion, especially the monotheistic ones. (the ''fight'' is not only war but things like educating yourself or having a sex with your wife, so, what ever is good)

so, all eyes was on them and all swards was pointed in their direction, since they were like literary 10 in numbers or even less. them against the whole arabian peninsula, can you imagine that?! they needed to be stimulated in THAT early moments, at times when a human life was worthless and they was the weak, oppressed side. how to stimulate and encourage ppl to fight (better said defend them selfs, those ethics and not to move away, run away or leave the only light of hope for better tomorrow and progress at that time and place) against such force and millions of opposing ppl and let's not forget, angry husbands? we are talking about the darkest time and place in the known history my friend! not about stockholm in 2014. plz wake up!

 

 

ppl just like to copy/paste verses from quran out of the contexts. the most famous one is when it says to kill enemies how ever and when ever one can but leaving the rest of the saying that IF those enemies want a truce with you (like in they don't want to kill you, fuck you, rape you any more or atm!!!) you HAVE TO accept the truce, no matter what! so we can find in the history of muhammed such ridiculous truce agreements (which was let's say 'bad' for muslims) cause he/they was obligated to except them even as a stronger side in a war. so, is that aligned with your interpretation? i *don't* think so!

 

but but but, i mean really, what's really wrong in defending yourself and your family and what's wrong if you fight for greater good at the same time? it's easy to be a pacifist in front of your monitor on watmm forum while photographing your hairy legs but have you ever been in a life threatening situation, physically attacked by a stronger man or by a group of ppl or have you ever been in a situation to defend your gf or your mother? i was and i didnt like it! (we had war over here) quran only talks about ppl who'd run away (and comforting ones who wouldn't), that's all... it's trying to stimulate them in these 3 ways: either by reward/love, by fear or with logic. in those 3 ways we humans operate . it's the way we are. someone is more prone to react in one way another to others. (i react to logic the most, then love, then punishment) we use them on our children, right? when one doesn't work we use another. (good parents know which one to use and when, right?) ...and aren't we all god's children, my dear atheistic friend? lol

so you have to remember this too: quran in 99% of the time is addressing to muslims, so very rarely to non-muslims and almost never to atheists. so better leave it to muslims if you're trying to be such a compson about it. better try instead to read this Muhammad: A Prophet for Our Time. a short book but a kind of liked it. the author at least tries to be objective.

 

 

i know a lot about religions and i could easily defend the other monotheistic religions but now it was only islam that needed it and i hate compsonalizations!

in defense of the bible, it was not meant to be read strictly (cause it wasn't 'strictly' written) but as a broad guidance from the stories. who wants love and niceness he can find them in the bible, he has no excuses for a violence.

second, everybody who knows anything about the bible and quran knows that they was written in different manner and from different kinds of sources. one was written strictly (and) from one source in 23 yrs and was stayed unchanged and the other in more than 1000 yrs from unknown number of sources. this was more science than belief. google it!

 

 

 

regarding isreal/palestine war i have nothing to add to others views. i only believe that good ppl are good no matter what religion (or non-religion), color or race they are.

[sheatheman]

that's YOUR interpretation of those verses from quran

Not my interpretation, theirs. You think the Islamic militants of the Gaza strip have some other interpretation of the concept of Shahid?

 

And I don't think it's compson at all. I don't think quoting the Quaran is the same thing as what compson did.

[sheatheman]

Also, I am not an atheist. What makes you think that?

[LimpyLoo]

I'm in a religion based on Mein Kampf.

 

But one mustn't read Mein Kampf literally, like some sort of fundamentalist. The unpleasant bits are metaphor, of course. The apparent moral barbarism is actually just poetic musing that is totally in line with our present moral understanding, I swear.

 

/Bible-apologist satire

[usagi]

I don't think quoting the Quaran is the same thing as what compson did.

 

pulling various out-of-context quotes from the "Quaran" is exactly what he did, when he wanted to prop up his arguments.

 

those verses were revealed during times of war and apply to times of war (so to people like Hamas locked into a war with Israel, they might seem relevant). verses like those are the ones that are quoted the most when people want to point the finger at Muslims and decry their barbarism, as if you will be literally murdered on the street by one for the chance to get pussy in heaven or something.

 

WATMM's real disappointing these days. think I'll just stick to music discussion and lols for the time being.

[roasty]

[sheatheman]

 

I don't think quoting the Quaran is the same thing as what compson did.

pulling various out-of-context quotes from the "Quaran" is exactly what he did, when he wanted to prop up his arguments.

 

those verses were revealed during times of war and apply to times of war (so to people like Hamas locked into a war with Israel, they might seem relevant). verses like those are the ones that are quoted the most when people want to point the finger at Muslims and decry their barbarism, as if you will be literally murdered on the street by one for the chance to get pussy in heaven or something.

 

WATMM's real disappointing these days. think I'll just stick to music discussion and lols for the time being.

 

I'm not talking about all Muslims tho am I? I'm talking about Hamas. And again, the verses aren't out of context -- these are the verses that members of Hamas look to when thinking about Shahid. Saying that I'm pulling them out of context is such a lame tactic. Does Hamas believe that its fallen members will be rewarded with paradise or not? If not, you would really need to try (but you'd fail) to make that case. If they do believe that, the verses I quoted are the reason why. This is all logical and no cause for disappointment.

 

What you are trying to do is make me out to be attacking Islam as a whole. If that is how I appear, it's much easier to dismiss me.

 

And to limp, you really ought to start an anti christian thread, so whenever that switch goes off that tells you "here is a chance to link Sam Harris videos!!!" you will have an appropriate venue (because anti christian sentiment is totally okay, as opposed to anti muslim sentiment, which is baseless, xenophobic, racist, and hateful).

[Goiter Sanchez]

politics subforum pls.

[Friendly Foil]

politics subforum pls.

[Alcofribas]

And to limp, you really ought to start an anti christian thread, so whenever that switch goes off that tells you "here is a chance to link Sam Harris videos!!!" you will have an appropriate venue (because anti christian sentiment is totally okay, as opposed to anti muslim sentiment, which is baseless, xenophobic, racist, and hateful).

I know I said I was leaving this thread and I promise this will be my last post but I couldn't resist the absurdity of this entire post, especially after your "Muslims are responsible for creating global chaos" bullshit. but the Sam Harris bit was particularly...just pure lol. that you would use Sam fucking Harris in this instance is absolutely hilarious.

 

http://mondoweiss.net/2014/08/defends-silence-slaughter.html

 

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/apr/03/sam-harris-muslim-animus

 

you guys don't even try, it's pathetic.

 

#1,800 gazas dead and counting! 10,000 homes destroyed! go team israel and get those bad guys who hide in every single innocent. in the brick and mortar of every home. and go us for completely pretending to care about something we can't even be bothered to educate ourselves about.

[sheatheman]

Too bad your last post makes no sense. If it were me, I'd want to go out on a succinct note of clarity. Sure you won't reconsider?

 

 

But I'll try to respond as best I can. Limpy has posted Sam Harris vids in the past. That's the only reason I mentioned Sam Harris. But it makes sense that if you would go after Christianity, you would go after Islam too. Funny how people tend to discredit someone based on one thing. I guess I'm weird, but I can respect a person with whom I disagree vehemently. I thought Hitchens had a great wit, and made a lot of sense, even though I am a Christian. I was very sad when I learned he died. I respect him because he never aligned himself with a party line or agenda, and the whole of his views didn't compute for many people.

 

And Global Chaos — sounds like a hefty word huh? Well, lets name a few countries of the globe that have suffered or are currently suffering due militant Islam. Don't say them out loud, just think of them. I can think of several that are currently under siege, and I'm not even using wikipedia. Chaos happening in several places throughout the globe — I think it's fair to call that global chaos.

 

 

[LimpyLoo]

 

And to limp, you really ought to start an anti christian thread, so whenever that switch goes off that tells you "here is a chance to link Sam Harris videos!!!" you will have an appropriate venue (because anti christian sentiment is totally okay, as opposed to anti muslim sentiment, which is baseless, xenophobic, racist, and hateful).

I know I said I was leaving this thread and I promise this will be my last post but I couldn't resist the absurdity of this entire post, especially after your "Muslims are responsible for creating global chaos" bullshit. but the Sam Harris bit was particularly...just pure lol. that you would use Sam fucking Harris in this instance is absolutely hilarious.

 

http://mondoweiss.net/2014/08/defends-silence-slaughter.html

 

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/apr/03/sam-harris-muslim-animus

 

you guys don't even try, it's pathetic.

 

#1,800 gazas dead and counting! 10,000 homes destroyed! go team israel and get those bad guys who hide in every single innocent. in the brick and mortar of every home. and go us for completely pretending to care about something we can't even be bothered to educate ourselves about.

 

 

Sam Harris gets alot of undue flack and his thoughts are very often misrepresented, intentionally or not.

 

http://www.samharris.org/blog/item/why-dont-i-criticize-israel

 

 

and here's a little context to that quote-mine:

 

"The people who speak most sensibly about the threat that Islam poses to Europe are actually fascists. To say that this does not bode well for liberalism is an understatement: It does not bode well for the future of civilization."

[Cryptowen]

It does not bode well for the future of civilization."

vote post-apocalyptic sustenance farmers & warring tribes of bandits party 2k14, let's do this people

[Lane Visitor]

 

 

"The people who speak most sensibly about the threat that Islam poses to Europe are actually fascists. To say that this does not bode well for liberalism is an understatement: It does not bode well for the future of civilization."

 

 

Agreed, and I would also add this relevant line as well:

 

"The people who speak most sensibly about the threat that Zionism poses to the world are actually fascists. To say that this does not bode well for liberalism is an understatement: It does not bode well for the future of civilization."

[sheatheman]

 

It does not bode well for the future of civilization."

vote post-apocalyptic sustenance farmers & warring tribes of bandits party 2k14, let's do this people

 

 

That's me. All the stuff we are arguing in here won't matter p soon. The new skill is quick assessing/rapid adaptation to environmental disruptors. Owen, I can go to your compound or you can come to mine: do we want evil winters or brutal summers?

[Cryptowen]

do we want evil winters or brutal summers?

Still hoping international borders dissolve one of these days so I can go full-nomad November through April. Cuz right now my plan is "spend lots of time at the library so I don't freeze to death"

 

Also if small farming communities develop out of these compounds we'd need a tech guy whose official duty is to repair & construct music gear from scrounged materials.

 

real talk watmm, even if you aren't gunning for the imminent collapse of global society you've gotta admit an analogue synthesizer made from car parts & broken nintendos & an old man hooked to a dialysis machine sounds pretty swig

[Rubin Farr]

Sounds like Palestine is close to joining the ICC, if Israel can be proven to be breaking these conventions, they need to be fully prosecuted. The 20th Century days of them playing the eternal victim are over.

[goDel]

My only hope is that the UN will be more actively involved at this point. Israels playing time should be over. They've proven to be at least as destructive as the parties they are trying to defend themselves against. To say the least. There needs to be some grown up party in this juvenile conflict. And it's an illusion that Israel can play that grown up role.

[chenGOD]

@goDel

UN is mulling a mission apparently.

[goDel]

Yeah, I kinda figured. Mulling is the natural state of the UN. And there's always talk about the UN doing something. I'm hoping the mulling stops and the acting actually starts. And not in a watered down - compromised to death - way. The lack of leadership on both the Israeli and the Palestinian side should be overcompensated to have some positive effect.

[delet...]

muddling a mission more like. UN (management, not the actual countries) is there to play cover for US and pals misadventures around the world.