Now That Trump's President... (not any more!)

[LimpyLoo]

 

 

- that people who would happily identify as racists and white nationalists do not deserve any of our respect or attention. we should only be paying attention to them in the sense that we need to ensure that they are not harming others. but aside from that they deserve to be isolated because they have made a decision to not co-operate in a globalised and multi-cultural society.

The shame and exile game doesn't work

That's what got us here

The Rogerian proposition is that if you show someone 'unconditional positive regard'...that in itself is therapeutic...and it coaxes people towards humanism and egalitarianism.

no it's not. the shame and exile game on people who didn't necessarily deserve it got us here. not to sound like a massive SJW but stop defending these people and normalising their fucked up beliefs. you know what else got us here? short sighted neoliberal economic policies and business attitudes.

I'm not at all defending or normalizing their fucked up beliefs. I am explicitly advocating a strategy for changing their beliefs.

 

Shame does not make problems go away. It does the exact opposite. It's like the War On Drugs. Becoming more brutal with our shaming is not gonna give us the result we want. You can't strangle them into seeing the light.

[auxien]

You can't rationalize or nice them into seeing the light, either. (For the record we're all speaking in general, there are obviously specific cases to support any perspective.)

 

I'm saying much racism cannot be trained out of those who already feel it, not with any effectiveness. The only hope, imho, is to put literally all efforts towards not allowing children to have it ingrained in them, and hopefully in a few generations, those beliefs and feelings will die off for the most part. All other tactics have proven useless, which isn't surprising given how serious systemic racism is in some places, and how prevalent it is throughout the nation (and honestly the international white/western/first world).

[chenGOD]

 

getting rid of anxiety and feeling more positive about things can't be bad. i think anxiety and fear drive a lot of the hateful and ignorant views we're discussing right now.

 

.

 

The idea I'm advocating is that the way to turn them into egalitarians is to treat them with an excess of humanity and compassion, as this offers them the opportunity to make an egalitarian gesture back.

I'm just curious if you've changed your views on Muslims at all.

[chenGOD]

I take back anything I said about this man's intelligence. He is very smart and I think he will do a good job as long as he sticks to his word.

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/23/us/politics/trump-new-york-times-interview-transcript.html?_r=0

You're being facetious right?

[doublename]

Our new secretary of education is a millionaire charter school shill with no education experience o my lol.

[Adieu]

 

I take back anything I said about this man's intelligence. He is very smart and I think he will do a good job as long as he sticks to his word.

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/23/us/politics/trump-new-york-times-interview-transcript.html?_r=0

You're being facetious right?

 

 

no

[chenGOD]

What in that article convinced you that he has suddenly become smart? Was it the lie about climate change (contrary to his statement, there is near unanimity on climate change); or was it his statement about putting experts in positions of authority within his cabinet (climate change denier as head of EPA, ambassador to UN with zero foreign policy experience, education secretary in favour of defunding public education, and Ben Carson); or was it the change of heart about the electoral college?

[LimpyLoo]

 

 

getting rid of anxiety and feeling more positive about things can't be bad. i think anxiety and fear drive a lot of the hateful and ignorant views we're discussing right now.

 

.

 

The idea I'm advocating is that the way to turn them into egalitarians is to treat them with an excess of humanity and compassion, as this offers them the opportunity to make an egalitarian gesture back.

I'm just curious if you've changed your views on Muslims at all.

Yes

 

 

I have a radically different understanding of religion than I did, say, 6 months ago. I mean most of all, I didn't actually *know* anything, and yet I thought I knew everything.

 

I've really come to despise Scientism, and any worldview that suggests the best and only way to understand reality is as a set of empirical facts about the material world. Reality is much, much better described as a forum for moral action, or perhaps as a stage upon which archetypes interact.

 

The idea I was sold about the Bible and the Koran was that some random idiots sat down and wrote some dumb stories so they could control the people around them (or something like that). Well, that's a really stupid idea. A more accurate idea might be that archetypal moral wisdom gets upvoted, aggregated and proliferated by humanity over thousands of years.

 

One way to see archetypal and religious ideas might be as a highly-sophisticated biological data-compression-algorithm.

 

So for instance, what might a phrase like "if you tend to the crops, God will smile upon you" mean? Well, what if the best way to for an individual to understand the world is to attribute it a singular personality, and then act in order to please it? For instance, what does someone mean when they say "society"? (e.g. "I hate society" or "society is cruel" or "society wants X") They are attributing a personality to the social world, as a sort of data-compression-algorithm, no? Because you can't tell a coherent story about the individual actions of 7 billion people.

 

 

 

Now, where does religion run off the rails?

What is the saying? "When a wise man points to the moon, only a fool looks at his finger." Something like that. Well, religious texts point to the moon, but organized religions worship the finger.

 

Or something like that. I dunno.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Adieu]

What in that article convinced you that he has suddenly become smart? Was it the lie about climate change (contrary to his statement, there is near unanimity on climate change); or was it his statement about putting experts in positions of authority within his cabinet (climate change denier as head of EPA, ambassador to UN with zero foreign policy experience, education secretary in favour of defunding public education, and Ben Carson); or was it the change of heart about the electoral college?

 

Not that he has suddenly become smart. But that he is talking in a way that makes me realize he has potential to do a good job. He has dropped the rhetoric, and he is talking real shit now. 

 

There is no consensus on climate change. There is data, and there are people interpreting that data. In the interview he concedes that humans play a part, to what extent he doesn't fully know yet. This is about as close as you can get to the truth about climate change. We have contributed yes, but to what extent fully? It depends on who you are talking to, and what are the ramifications? Again, it depends on who you are talking to. But the most important thing to consider is that it's much better for our planet to be warm than cold. We've had cooling events, and when it happens lots of people die.

 

Everything he said made sense. If you don't like his appointments that's fine, but what he is saying makes sense.

[LimpyLoo]

 

What in that article convinced you that he has suddenly become smart? Was it the lie about climate change (contrary to his statement, there is near unanimity on climate change); or was it his statement about putting experts in positions of authority within his cabinet (climate change denier as head of EPA, ambassador to UN with zero foreign policy experience, education secretary in favour of defunding public education, and Ben Carson); or was it the change of heart about the electoral college?

Not that he has suddenly become smart. But that he is talking in a way that makes me realize he has potential to do a good job. He has dropped the rhetoric, and he is talking real shit now.

 

There is no consensus on climate change. There is data, and there are people interpreting that data. In the interview he concedes that humans play a part, to what extent he doesn't fully know yet. This is about as close as you can get to the truth about climate change. We have contributed yes, but to what extent fully? It depends on who you are talking to, and what are the ramifications? Again, it depends on who you are talking to. But the most important thing to consider is that it's much better for our planet to be warm than cold. We've had cooling events, and when it happens lots of people die.

 

Everything he said made sense. If you don't like his appointments that's fine, but what he is saying makes sense.

Have you ever seen an X-Y graph of climate vs green-house gas levels? I mean, I believe in coincidences and all, but sheesh...

[joshuatxuk]

and so the backlash begins as Orangeman says he's not going to prosecute Hillary. this is the first walkback of hopefully many, I really hope the scummier supporters of his are faced with the reality of how futile their gesture has been. juicy timez ahead.

Yeah this is a good deveopment, people might actually realize they got played. Its a double edge sword though because it confirms lies and deciet won him voters. That is depressing.

 

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Edited November 24, 2016 by joshuatx

[joshuatxuk]

enjoy the pinnacle of american history.

 

we're fucked

 

This is why the GOP still passes subsidaries.

 

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[psn]

TREMENDOUS TALENT

[joshuatxuk]

Our new secretary of education is a millionaire charter school shill with no education experience o my lol.

Billioniare actually. Super pro voucher and Christian. Basically a Pence appointment. From what I read she likely wont push for religious crap but public school funding will be on the chopping block. She might be benign though, she isnt anti common core which most conservatives think is a liberal mind control conspiracy.

 

I'm glad Nikki Haley was choosen though instead of neocon anti-internationalist Bolton. She's open-minded and fairly moderate.

 

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[ignatius]

 

Our new secretary of education is a millionaire charter school shill with no education experience o my lol.

Billioniare actually. Super pro voucher and Christian. Basically a Pence appointment. From what I read she likely wont push for religious crap but public school funding will be on the chopping block. She might be benign though, she isnt anti common core which most conservatives think is a liberal mind control conspiracy.

 

I'm glad Nikki Haley was choosen though instead of neocon anti-internationalist Bolton. She's open-minded and fairly moderate.

 

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

 

 

 

she's a terrible person. she doesn't believe in public education. 

 

http://www.ifyouonlynews.com/education/trump-hires-christian-fundamentalist-who-doesnt-believe-in-public-schools-as-secretary-of-education/

 

this is from the think tank she worked for

 

http://blog.acton.org/archives/89837-bring-back-child-labor-work-is-a-gift-our-kids-can-handle.html

 

this lady is a fucking asshole. 

[Squee]

So are we getting a recount or what?

[chenGOD]

 

What in that article convinced you that he has suddenly become smart? Was it the lie about climate change (contrary to his statement, there is near unanimity on climate change); or was it his statement about putting experts in positions of authority within his cabinet (climate change denier as head of EPA, ambassador to UN with zero foreign policy experience, education secretary in favour of defunding public education, and Ben Carson); or was it the change of heart about the electoral college?

Not that he has suddenly become smart. But that he is talking in a way that makes me realize he has potential to do a good job. He has dropped the rhetoric, and he is talking real shit now.

 

There is no consensus on climate change.

What? He spends the first quarter of the interview whining that he was treated unfairly, and hints it would be better not to criticize him.

 

And no consensus?

http://www.skepticalscience.com/global-warming-scientific-consensus-intermediate.htm

[KovalainenFanBoy]

even if global warming wasnt caused by human action (which it is), why wouldnt you want to be as eco friendly as possible anyway? "hey it's alright to completely fuck up the environment cause it's not going to kill us all in 50 years"

[goDel]

Wanted to post this earlier: dataviz @ bloomberg about model explaining the various factors influencing climate change (from 1880-2005). Natural factors and human factors. The model seems to explain pretty well the current the actual situation. Especially from the 1950s onward.

 

http://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/2015-whats-warming-the-world/

[usagi]

even if global warming wasnt caused by human action (which it is), why wouldnt you want to be as eco friendly as possible anyway?

cos it cramps my lifestyle, you socialist freedom-hatin' cuck *fires six-shooter from one hand whilst guzzling beer and driving a Chevy*

Edited November 24, 2016 by usagi

[Candiru]

Let's push a religious agenda on a generation that just ain't buying that shit.

 

This is why I'm a liberal that loves guns.

[joshuatxuk]

 

even if global warming wasnt caused by human action (which it is), why wouldnt you want to be as eco friendly as possible anyway?

cos it cramps my lifestyle, you socialist freedom-hatin' cuck *fires six-shooter from one hand whilst guzzling beer and driving a Chevy*

I recall talking to an old guy bemoan that chevy trucks arenr v8s anymore...even though the new v6s have more power and torque, less emissions and better mileage.

 

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[joshuatxuk]

 

 

Our new secretary of education is a millionaire charter school shill with no education experience o my lol.

Billioniare actually. Super pro voucher and Christian. Basically a Pence appointment. From what I read she likely wont push for religious crap but public school funding will be on the chopping block. She might be benign though, she isnt anti common core which most conservatives think is a liberal mind control conspiracy.

 

I'm glad Nikki Haley was choosen though instead of neocon anti-internationalist Bolton. She's open-minded and fairly moderate.

 

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

 

she's a terrible person. she doesn't believe in public education.

 

http://www.ifyouonlynews.com/education/trump-hires-christian-fundamentalist-who-doesnt-believe-in-public-schools-as-secretary-of-education/

 

this is from the think tank she worked for

 

http://blog.acton.org/archives/89837-bring-back-child-labor-work-is-a-gift-our-kids-can-handle.html

 

this lady is a fucking asshole.

Bleh.

 

Yeah i was trying to be delusionally optimistic that she isnt completely terrible.

 

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[vamos scorcho]

identity politics has literally destroyed society. it's hard to believe how bad it has gotten.

[hello spiral]

oh hai OG zeffolia