ALIEN / PROMETHEUS / COVENANT - SPOILERS INBOUND!!

[YO303]

This thread need to be deleted forever, the movie was amazing, complain about something else leave this movie alone.

Edited November 11, 2012 by YO303

[Guest Wall Bird]

I hope the sequel consists of Shaw and David making contact with the engineers who then subject them to a hellish series of autopsies and analysis so that they go though some sort of abstract nightmare-odyssey ala Enter the Void, Fantomas' 'Delirium Cordia' or the 'Loving the Alien' issue of Alan Moore's Swamp Thing.

 

I would pay to see that.

[Silent Member]

LOL@ that analysis. I think he missed the point of the opening scene completely when he tries to conclude his analysis. Thank god I never got into Lost.

[Guest fondles the cat]

you can read spaiht's original script here: http://www.scribd.com/doc/112142280/Alien-Engineers

[Guest]

LOL@ that analysis. I think he missed the point of the opening scene completely when he tries to conclude his analysis. Thank god I never got into Lost.

seriously, that religious crap is the worst part of the movie and that bro decided to take a deep dive in it, congs.

[SR4]

LOL@ that analysis. I think he missed the point of the opening scene completely when he tries to conclude his analysis. Thank god I never got into Lost.

seriously, that religious crap is the worst part of the movie and that bro decided to take a deep dive in it, congs.

 

what was the best part of the movie?

 

you guys take this way too seriously methinks.

[Guest]

LOL@ that analysis. I think he missed the point of the opening scene completely when he tries to conclude his analysis. Thank god I never got into Lost.

seriously, that religious crap is the worst part of the movie and that bro decided to take a deep dive in it, congs.

 

what was the best part of the movie?

 

you guys take this way too seriously methinks.

 

I've got to write an essay about Donna Haraway's Cyborg Manifesto (http://www.egs.edu/faculty/donna-haraway/articles/donna-haraway-a-cyborg-manifesto/ ) at the moment, and am trying to relate Prometheus to that text. The Engineers would then kinda sorta resemble ancient Western culture (they sorta look like caricatures of Greek/Roman olympic athletes don't they), and the pair of Shaw/David would resemble a human-machine symbiosis which is a product of that culture but is able to live through it, or something. I'm not saying the film is about that, but there are elements which fit that Cyborg manifesto quite well..

 

This only really works by ignoring all the religious symbolism horsecrap though, so I dunno, maybe not a good idea at all, since the film is filled with it.

 

But looking at Prometheus through this lens is actually kind of fun..

[gaarg]

Prow me thesis

[o00o]

first, pre-Damon Lindelof script (penned by Jon Spaiths) is online:

 

http://io9.com/5959811/read-the-original-script-for-prometheus-right-now

[gaarg]

already one the previous page dude!

[gaarg]

Sorry for the double post, but the script has been removed from the nets, and I only read half of it. Can anyone help me out here?

[Guest]

http://cl.ly/2f1I3R0O2c2V

[o00o]

Sorry for the double post, but the script has been removed from the nets, and I only read half of it. Can anyone help me out here?

 

I saved it as ebook to read later. here you go:

Alien_Engineers.fdx - Jon Spaihts.pdf

Edited November 14, 2012 by o00o

[gaarg]

Thanks a lot, I thought about saving it just because of this but it was too much a first world bother so I didn't.

[Joyrex]

I've been reading it on/off on the bus, and I must say, so far this might have been a better attempt at a "horror" version of Prometheus than the final result, which I consider a good sci-fi movie, but not a "horror" sci-fi say in the vein of the original Aliens. It's interesting too reading the characters (who, barring from a few gender swaps and additional characters) in the context of seeing how they were realized on-screen.

 

FWIW, I still really enjoyed Prometheus, and still am baffled at the amount of nerd rage and hate directed towards it.

[Guest RadarJammer]

Was totally surprised to find out some of the VFX were actually animatronix, and that Anklepants did the work!

 

[SR4]

I've been reading it on/off on the bus, and I must say, so far this might have been a better attempt at a "horror" version of Prometheus than the final result, which I consider a good sci-fi movie, but not a "horror" sci-fi say in the vein of the original Aliens. It's interesting too reading the characters (who, barring from a few gender swaps and additional characters) in the context of seeing how they were realized on-screen.

 

FWIW, I still really enjoyed Prometheus, and still am baffled at the amount of nerd rage and hate directed towards it.

 

agreed. I honestly didn't really take away that Prometheus was a horror movie so much as a sci-fi movie. My biggest criticism is that Prometheus sort of rushed the suspense/buildup that made me love the original Alien movies so much....the talking, the landing of the ship, the scouting long before anything went wrong, etc. etc.

 

But i still enjoyed it as a movie. People seem to hold it to ridiculously high (IMO) standards because the original Alien was seen as such a masterpiece...but seeing Scott's other works he isn't exactly thematically reliable or predictable.

[awepittance]

it's a shame it wasn't just an original scifi movie really and fell into the prequel-itis phenomenon. I think if the movie was exactly the same as it was without the ships from alien or the space jockey costume and sets it would have been a lot stronger. They trap themselves into a corner by trying to do any type of prequel, especially one supposedly very ambitious and intellectual (much more so in theory than the original 2 classic Alien movies)

[goDel]

Los Angeles (January 14, 2011) __ Twentieth Century Fox announced today that Ridley Scott

will direct PROMETHEUS, an original science fiction epic, for worldwide release on March 9,

2012. The initial draft of the script was written by Jon Spaihts (The Darkest Hour) from Scott's

idea. Damon Lindelof (Lost, Star Trek) and Scott have since been working together on the

current version which has expanded the story into new directions.

 

Story details are being closely guarded so as not to spoil surprises for moviegoers, but Scott

explained the outlines of the film and its genesis as follows: "While Alien was indeed the

jumping off point for this project, out of the creative process evolved a new, grand mythology

and universe in which this original story takes place. The keen fan will recognize strands of

Alien's DNA, so to speak, but the ideas tackled in this film are unique, large and provocative. I

couldn't be more pleased to have found the singular tale I'd been searching for, and finally return

to this genre that's so close to my heart."

it's a shame it wasn't just an original scifi movie really and fell into the prequel-itis phenomenon. I think if the movie was exactly the same as it was without the ships from alien or the space jockey costume and sets it would have been a lot stronger. They trap themselves into a corner by trying to do any type of prequel, especially one supposedly very ambitious and intellectual (much more so in theory than the original 2 classic Alien movies)

 

Seems to me they were pretty expliciet about it not being any type of prequel. They didn't put themselves in the box they've been put into.

[awepittance]

but there's no escaping that it is a prequel, the original inception of the script (not sure if you've seen it) makes it even more overt than the redux by Lindelof. They can dress is up any way they like but it is undoubtably and blatantly a prequel, maybe not in the way that the Thing or Phantom menace was but ..it's a prequel. They marketed it as a prequel and they used the Alien franchise as a spring board for viral marketing the film, they are sort of walking a fine line by saying it's not to give it more credence as a stand alone film, i just think they know better behind what they say when making the rounds to promote the film. And i will reiterate here that this new 'grand mythology' they speak about would have been better suited for a stand alone film that had nothing to do with the space jockey or the alien franchise.

Edited November 14, 2012 by Awepittance

[patternoverlap]

I had no problem with the plot of any of the underlying themes. Really, my distaste stemmed from the script itself. They needed someone to step in and say, "Hey, maybe scientists wouldn't react to or say any of this kind of shit." or "Hey, maybe having Weyland hiding on the ship is fucking stupid and pointless and him dying seems anticlimactic so maybe we can touch on the relationship part in a different way"

[Joyrex]

but there's no escaping that it is a prequel, the original inception of the script (not sure if you've seen it) makes it even more overt than the redux by Lindelof. They can dress is up any way they like but it is undoubtably and blatantly a prequel, maybe not in the way that the Thing or Phantom menace was but ..it's a prequel. They marketed it as a prequel and they used the Alien franchise as a spring board for viral marketing the film, they are sort of walking a fine line by saying it's not to give it more credence as a stand alone film, i just think they know better behind what they say when making the rounds to promote the film. And i will reiterate here that this new 'grand mythology' they speak about would have been better suited for a stand alone film that had nothing to do with the space jockey or the alien franchise.

 

Honestly, the Space Jockey in the original Alien had about as much to do with the film as the Xenomorph at the end of Prometheus has to do with it's film - I see Prometheus more as a "shared universe" film rather than any overt prequel. They're really telling two different stories, albeit with shared elements.

 

I imagine the sequel to Prometheus will have more to do with the motivations of the Engineers than formally introducing the Xenomorphs - I could be wrong on that aspect, though. It would be the easiest route for them to take story-wise.

 

I had no problem with the plot of any of the underlying themes. Really, my distaste stemmed from the script itself. They needed someone to step in and say, "Hey, maybe scientists wouldn't react to or say any of this kind of shit." or "Hey, maybe having Weyland hiding on the ship is fucking stupid and pointless and him dying seems anticlimactic so maybe we can touch on the relationship part in a different way"

 

I agree - I thought the "hidden Weyland" (sounds sorta nasty) thing was lame - why not come along, and have everyone aware of th fact, unless he was hiding from Vickers, and not everyone else...

[awepittance]

Weyland hiding on the ship and the petting the alien snake part were both added in by Lindelof after he took the original engineers script, don't ask me why though. I think the only thing i've seen mentioned that people liked that Lindelof added was David's b-ball and solo ship activities in the opening scene, which were actually originally conceived by James Cameron for Bishop to do in an unfilmed (but scripted) sequence from Aliens. In the original script the Space Jockey was 15 feet tall as well (more accurate to what we see in Alien), not the 8 foot version in PRometheus

Edited November 14, 2012 by Awepittance

[baph]

sure is antimetheus in here

 

lol/

[Blir]

It's insulting to say that people who don't like the film are just disappointed because it isn't as good as Alien or were comparing it to Alien - as if their opinions aren't valid, describing it as nerd rage or whatever. Even if they were comparing it to Alien, it's worth comparing. The film is a prequel, it exists in the same universe of a series that has been around since the 70's. A lot of people watched the originals when they were young and it was part of their development, so it's only natural they would care about the outcome of Prometheus.

 

Also the old chestnut of saying dumb shit like "if people hate it so much then why are they coming into the thread?". Well because it's the fucking discussion thread about Prometheus! If somebody created a Prometheus hate thread would that be preferable? No, because it would be a massive circle jerk. How about instead of getting upset that people don't share your opinion you just accept it?

 

I happen to be antimetheus myself. But that's nothing to do with "nerd rage". It's to do with the film having a fucking dumb script with poor dialogue and characters making retarded decisions. The whole "it was just a big, fun sci fi film which we don't get enough of, can't you just enjoy it?" thing is wank too. The film presents itself as this high concept movie with numerous plot strands, it is perfectly valid to criticize poor script and characterization.

 

THAT SAID: It is a gorgeous film to behold. Probably the best CGI I've seen in a film. I just personally found it disappointing otherwise. I'm glad people enjoy it, that's fantastic. Let's just not make assumptions about other peoples capacity to enjoy something because they aren't as satisfied as you.

 

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