Cryptocurrency as the next significant stage for computing technology, not just an investment

[pcock]

Well, good luck to you with being a pussy and whatnot. I'm up around 700 percent. I'm also all in with my final 1500 dollars on PLTR at a cost basis of 10.50 though, I really can't be fucked with boomer 7 percent a year compound interest investing. I got into WSBets on reddit pretty hard this year, the mixture of memes and gambling is extremely appealing to me. I'm either going to continue being poor, or luck out and have every year be as insane as this one, because this year I turned 2k into 6.5k, and that includes having my 2k knocked down to 1.2k by the march crash.

Edited January 20, 2021 by pcock

[usagi]

7 minutes ago, pcock said:

I got into WSBets on reddit pretty hard this year

lol, that explains a lot. a guy who pontificated years ago about moving to Scotland to escape the tories and various other liberal takes on social/international issues eventually gets his brains rotted by exposure to the worst 'investor' cesspool on the internet and discards his values in favour of YOLOing his money into the void. I don't care about your numbers, have fun with that shit before the next crash.

[pcock]

I'm still heavily left wing, I've just given up basically. The last 5 years have pretty much turned me full on misanthropic. Stocks have just replaced my propensity for poker. 

[pcock]

Also I only moved to Scotland for Uni, I wasn't trying to escape a regime. I didn't even give a fuck about politics in 2009. My hatred of the tories has just naturally accumulated, like tooth plaque, having been exposed to their actions over their reign of the last decade. 

Edited January 20, 2021 by pcock

[usagi]

whatever, I don't really care what you do or what you believe. you decided to be a cunt and you were spoken to like a cunt, the end.

[zlemflolia]

3 hours ago, usagi said:

because it has no value. it is not tied to any type of "good" that can be measured for growth and thus you cannot develop any type of reasonable long-term investment strategy around it. any gains or losses you make on it are purely on wild speculation and herd behaviour, and a lot of people see that for the ballache it is and say no thanks. I get that for some it's purely a money making opportunity which might be ok (sustainability discussions aside for a moment) if you know what you're doing, if you limit your exposure and say "I'm ok with possibly losing x amount of money I'm putting in", but personally I don't want to spend any of my money propping up this goofy meaningless scheme, at least not in its current stage of evolution. I've got steady work and income, I don't need some asshole yelling in my ear about BEEEKONNAYYYYYYY

what is value to you if bitcoin doesn't have it?  you don't find value knowing that you can memorize a random string and have your money safe inside your neuron patterns?  you don't find value knowing that you can have a backup savings account in case the currency of the country you live in gets devalued or money is seized from bank accounts by the state?  you don't find value knowing that you can own an asset secured by the laws of thermodynamics and game theoretical incentives rather than the whims of the leader of the currency issuer in the country you live in?

as for "beekonay" I assume you mean bitconnect which is a literal scam that has nothing to do with the major cryptocurrencies

[usagi]

I don't, but don't worry, I'm just an outlier. I'm sure this guy found a lot of value in those things. re beekonay, apparently none of you guys read other people's earlier posts before barging in to say whatever's on your mind.

[zlemflolia]

12 minutes ago, usagi said:

I don't, but don't worry, I'm just an outlier. I'm sure this guy found a lot of value in those things. re beekonay, apparently none of you guys read other people's earlier posts before barging in to say whatever's on your mind.

"At the time he was paid, they were worth $2-$6 each. He stashed them away in his “digital wallet” and forgot about them."

His fault he should have understood but he didn't.  Nobody said there aren't risks associated.  It's a tradeoff.  If you can remember it and are okay losing it if you get in a car accident that gives you brain damage, that's a risk you take.

"German-born Thomas has already entered the wrong password eight times, and if he guesses wrong two more times his hard drive, which contains his private keys to the bitcoin, will be encrypted – and he’ll never see the money."

Another mistake.  His security model was just not thought out straight.  If you want to use a hard drive like that, you have to be SURE you remember the password

Basically this guy's a dumbass who didn't care about the money because it was "just" the price of a new car at the time and he didn't think much of it.  Now that it's worth more he wants it back.  If you have the right mindset from the beginning this is avoidable.

With this power of no longer needing banks, there is a large responsibility.  It's not even in the fine print, everyone knows it who actually understands the technology, which you should if you own some.

And what does this article have to do with "beekonay" I'm still missing it

Edited January 20, 2021 by cyanobacteria

[usagi]

so your grand solution then relies on people never screwing up or forgetting things, on not being human basically. which is a perfect reflection on how technological fantasists miss the mark in trying to come up with silver bullet solutions to "wicked problems".

I'm not getting in a pointless argument with you about the technology or the economics or the inevitably messy intersection of the two, because you have a track record itt of describing these things in fantastical rather than realistic terms, and dismissing the human element of any problem in favour of some perfect mathematical answer. I'm just going to point out to you that so long as there are stories like that one across major media outlets, you will not get the public support or traction needed for widespread acceptance of this technology, which does have valuable merits outside of currency.

[zlemflolia]

32 minutes ago, usagi said:

so your grand solution then relies on people never screwing up or forgetting things, on not being human basically. which is a perfect reflection on how technological fantasists miss the mark in trying to come up with silver bullet solutions to "wicked problems".

I'm not getting in a pointless argument with you about the technology or the economics or the inevitably messy intersection of the two, because you have a track record itt of describing these things in fantastical rather than realistic terms, and dismissing the human element of any problem in favour of some perfect mathematical answer. I'm just going to point out to you that so long as there are stories like that one across major media outlets, you will not get the public support or traction needed for widespread acceptance of this technology, which does have valuable merits outside of currency.

the scenario of never forgetting things is for ultimate security against theft and loss of funds with the help of no third parties.  there are solutions with other security tradeoffs like revocable multi-sig timelocked smart contracts which allow things like transactions that automatically go to a backup wallet after a certain amount of time, maybe one with weaker security tradeoffs which are in that case better than losing your coins altogether, or for implementing inheritance, and things like hardware wallets which give strong security guarantees with a few assumptions regarding the qualities of the software and hardware manufacturing process.  you're attacking without really knowing why because your attacks have clear answers

as for widespread public acceptance let's let future material events determine that not theoretical arguments.  but I'm betting I'm right since your words don't seem to have a strong correlation to the technological reality

Edited January 20, 2021 by cyanobacteria

[dcom]

“You can't convince a believer of anything; for their belief is not based on evidence, it's based on a deep seated need to believe.” -- Carl Sagan.

[pcock]

6 hours ago, usagi said:

whatever, I don't really care what you do or what you believe. you decided to be a cunt and you were spoken to like a cunt, the end.

I was actually just joking around, but thank god that's the end.

 

Although having now read back half the thread the anger makes more sense, this is a very prickly thread.

Edited January 20, 2021 by pcock

[zlemflolia]

1 hour ago, dcom said:

“You can't convince a believer of anything; for their belief is not based on evidence, it's based on a deep seated need to believe.” -- Carl Sagan.

thing is id say it applies to you.  so far ive been right. if you look at when this thread was made crypto had far less adoption and market share than it does now and all indicators show it growing in integration into the world of USD denominated markets and others, though more accessibility of financial instruments relating to it.  is there any indication of that slowing down?  so far no.  this is just with regards to market dynamics and price.  it isn't even with regards to the fundamental new technologies enabled by it which I've described and which you've yet to provide methods of implementing those technologies without cryptocurrencies.  if there are some I want to know so I can stop believing in cryptocurrencies as the superior technology but you haven't presented them to me.  i predict you won't do this though

or maybe its just that you dont believe it will come, and thats a possibility.  capitalists love suppressing free and open source software so it's possible that it just doesn't happen. but fundamentally it's an option of what the future can do and if so this thread holds

Edited January 20, 2021 by cyanobacteria

[dcom]

3 minutes ago, cyanobacteria said:

thing is id say it applies to you.  so far ive been right. if you look at when this thread was made crypto had far less adoption and market share than it does now and all indicators show it growing in integration into the world of USD denominated markets, though more accessibility of financial instruments relating to it.  is there any indication of that slowing down?  so far no.  this is just with regards to market dynamics and price.  it isn't even with regards to the fundamental new technologies enabled by it which I've described and which you've yet to provide methods of implementing those technologies without cryptocurrencies.  if there are some I want to know so I can stop believing in cryptocurrencies as the superior technology but you haven't presented them to me.  i predict you won't do this though

I use expletives very sparingly, but fuck you're tedious. You should understand by now from what I've already written that I have no interest in cryptocurrencies - although some of the technologies are interesting and might have other applications - and I'm not interested in providing alternative methods for the things you believe will deliver us from evil. It's in no way in my interests to waste time building a case for you to rescind your beliefs - your hyperbolic language tells me that it would be a fool's errand. This is the last comment I'm going to make on this issue, so enjoy - I'll have none of it.

[zlemflolia]

11 minutes ago, dcom said:

I use expletives very sparingly, but fuck you're tedious. You should understand by now from what I've already written that I have no interest in cryptocurrencies - although some of the technologies are interesting and might have other applications - and I'm not interested in providing alternative methods for the things you believe will deliver us from evil. It's in no way in my interests to waste time building a case for you to rescind your beliefs - your hyperbolic language tells me that it would be a fool's errand. This is the last comment I'm going to make on this issue, so enjoy - I'll have none of it.

i never forced you to start or continue posting in this thread.  thats fine but dont be surprised if i respond to posts within the thread on the topic that i am interested in.  nobody said you have to reply

[mcbpete]

Let's keep this civil, lovelies: we are the music makers - we are not the hate makers.

[dingformung]

Remember that we are all one and part of the great cosmic organism.

[cichlisuite]

20 minutes ago, dingformung said:

Remember that we are all one and part of the great cosmic orgasm.

Ftfy

[zero]

one issue I can see that would prevent regular investing type folk to get on board here is the phrase "crypto." this, IMO, has a somewhat negative connotation, and sounds too similar to the word "crypt" or even "kryptonite." both of those dredge up negative imagery, and can scare people away.

the marketing of cryptocurrencies is absolutely horrible. it seems to be left up to mostly tech people to explain it to the general population. any time it takes more than a few seconds to explain something so another person has that intrinsic "a ha" moment, then it will not take off. FFS, crypto has been in the wild for years now and people still don't know how to explain it in a 10 second elevator pitch all that well. stocks, bonds, mutual funds, real estate investing...all these can be explained and understood reasonably well by most people in just a few easy to understand bullet points.

look at this thread. a complete mess of jabbering. @cyanobacteria you're intelligent man, we get that. but as @dcom pointed out - it is really really hard to understand what you are talking about a lot of the time. too many big words and concepts all mashed together at once do not make your points come across any better. is it possible to explain how crypto (as an investment only) works exactly on maybe say, a high school understanding level?

[zlemflolia]

5 minutes ago, zero said:

one issue I can see that would prevent regular investing type folk to get on board here is the phrase "crypto." this, IMO, has a somewhat negative connotation, and sounds too similar to the word "crypt" or even "kryptonite." both of those dredge up negative imagery, and can scare people away.

the marketing of cryptocurrencies is absolutely horrible. it seems to be left up to mostly tech people to explain it to the general population. any time it takes more than a few seconds to explain something so another person has that intrinsic "a ha" moment, then it will not take off. FFS, crypto has been in the wild for years now and people still don't know how to explain it in a 10 second elevator pitch all that well. stocks, bonds, mutual funds, real estate investing...all these can be explained and understood reasonably well by most people in just a few easy to understand bullet points.

look at this thread. a complete mess of jabbering. @cyanobacteria you're intelligent man, we get that. but as @dcom pointed out - it is really really hard to understand what you are talking about a lot of the time. too many big words and concepts all mashed together at once do not make your points come across any better. is it possible to explain how crypto (as an investment only) works exactly on maybe say, a high school understanding level?

those other concepts have historical precedence and in the beginning the public didn't support them either.  fiat money was rejected at first.  cryptocurrency is the name, it's currency based on cryptography.  it works by having a single piece of paper in the center of the village where people can write "bob gave $50 to john so bob now has $150 and john now has $300" which is constantly being kept watch of by most people in the village to make sure nobody writes down fake entries.  except cryptography, the branch of math for hiding secrets, allows the system to scale to the entire globe and even space

Edited January 20, 2021 by cyanobacteria

[purlieu]

9 hours ago, mcbpete said:

we are the money makers - we are not the hate makers.

 

[Amen Warrior]

Munny bad

 

Fake 'puter munny good

 

 

 

[zlemflolia]

2 minutes ago, Amen Warrior said:

Munny bad

 

Fake 'puter munny good

 

 

 

money in the hands of small groups bad.  money in everyones hands better.  no more money needed even better

[auxien]

14 minutes ago, cyanobacteria said:

money in the hands of small groups bad.  money in everyones hands better.  no more money needed even better

“we need to make more money so that no one needs money eventually” sounds like some serious trickle-down economics style dressing up.

[zero]

19 minutes ago, cyanobacteria said:

it works by having a single piece of paper in the center of the village where people can write "bob gave $50 to john so bob now has $150 and john now has $300" which is constantly being kept watch of by most people in the village to make sure nobody writes down fake entries.

so how do you make money off this then exactly? I understand based on the thread title you are approaching crypto from not just an investment standpoint. but say someone has $1k they want to invest and they're looking at crypto. how do you explain to someone how that $1k could turn into more?