VHS Head - Trademark Ribbons of Gold

[oscillik]

I think that he's getting any attention purely on the basis of the records that he's released and nowt else is a damn good thing too. No pathetic OCD perfectionism/sheer laziness or spouting bollocks about unreleased albums to generate any undue hype. It'd be good if this album could raise the profile of Kris Blacow and Neil Scrivin a little too (provided that they are all separate people etc.).

quoted for truth, on all points there

 

This last bit is especially relevant in this discussion, on account of how VHS HEAD actually MIGHT be some daddy in disguise. I can't wait for all the fucking "oh it's just some mediocre glitch" naysayers to find out he's one half of BoC or something and then do all the fucking backtracking and "well, you knoowww, after a couple of listens... yeah.... 2010 ALBUM OF THE YEAR YEAAAAAH".

VHS Head really is Ade Blacow, it isn't anyone else.

 

but i do agree with the rest of your jib, for once, about how this place is kinda turning up on it's own arse end and sucking up the torrent of shit that flows from it's own arse.

[chassis]

It think I now realize what the actual problem is:

 

Its his 1st album guys. You cant go from no one to ultra mega famous.

 

Not saying this is YOUR problem, chassis, as you've had only fair and reasonable things to say on this topic despite not being mindblown.

 

That is to say... OF COURSE YOU CAN DISLIKE THIS, but dismissing this as "bah just more glitch wankery", even though it's so obviously NOT THAT, pretty much qualifies you as a jaded cunt. Which takes me back to the bit that I'm quoting from chassis - i think the very fact that it is his first album is an issue with some, via a very simple, and very very ugly thought process: "he's THIS good, and right off the bat, and on SKAM!? WHY NOT I HAZ CHEEZBURGER?! .... pfff, stupid soulless glitch."

 

And then it becomes fairly obvious why Aphex tried to distance himself from Tuss, why even after being unsuccessful in that endeavor he carries on to officially state that it's not him -> because fanboys will always be fanboys, and for fanboys the only important thing is how much e-peen or idm-peen they can secure via subscribing to something. The whole Tuss debacle was exactly

this bullshit: omg this awesome shit ohmigaws it's awesome, it can't just be some couple from fucknowswhere, it has to be aphex , HAS TO BE, ohmigawd it is because of that synth and i can tell from some of the pixels, ok now i can get behind it and REALLY tout its unabashed glory and, most importantly, NOW i can REALLY like it.

 

Of COURSE reputation influences perception, it does mine as well, of course, i'm not naive, but at least i try to only let it steer me positively, in the sense that i DO tend to follow things that go by the grace of reputation, but i DON'T DISMISS ANYTHING on account of how it hasn't acquired one yet: "it's too early to tell", "not that well known", "not that famous", "not aphex/sean/rob/BoC/tom/ceephax/clark/whatever".

 

This last bit is especially relevant in this discussion, on account of how VHS HEAD actually MIGHT be some daddy in disguise. I can't wait for all the fucking "oh it's just some mediocre glitch" naysayers to find out he's one half of BoC or something and then do all the fucking backtracking and "well, you knoowww, after a couple of listens... yeah.... 2010 ALBUM OF THE YEAR YEAAAAAH".

 

All I know is i found this guy on myspace and i thought (i still do, actually, i don't think he's anyone already famous) that he was just this crazy video aficionado with an immense collection of vhs tapes and ungodly aptitude at repurposing them. And it still blew me away. He may never tour, and i could go with never hearing a peep out of him ever, and i wouldn't care. Still best 2010 album hands-down, still completely not "mediocre glitch wankery". Not up your street/not your cup of tea? Fine, sure. But if you think it's objectively "mediocre glitch wankery" then you're a fucking moron.

 

Good points. While my comments dont suggest Im mindblown, this is definitly one of my favourite album from 2010. If you went back to the start of the thread you could probably hear me raving about it. (I bought the LP, something Im not known for doing regularly )

 

Its pretty clear the reason it didnt get a big massive write up from some of the online critics is because, like you said, when it comes to electronic music if its not aphex/clark/boc etc theyre not interested. Im sure reviewing music for a living you might eventually lose your passion for finding new music. I cant see that happening to me any time soon though.

Edited January 10, 2011 by chassis

[ascdi]

I guess I disagree that this album is definitively not "glitch". Obviously it doesn't sound like r-n or like, fuckin, Aoki Takamasa circa 2002 or something, but there is an element of that same thing to it, to me. Granted, I have only listened to it through I think two times, via YouTube. Because I couldn't get into it I didn't buy it.

 

I'm trying to think of how to describe it. I think what I would say is that compositionally this album reminds me of glitch, while clearly the sounds are different. I mean, this is just my opinion, but if you take a track like 'Brain Damaged', it reminds me a lot of that early 2000s cut-up shit. There's a lot of small-scale detail but I don't find myself latching on to any large-scale structure at all.

 

Maybe I'm just an asshole. I didn't like the Jackson album either really, and this reminds me of that album a lot. In my mind (and I don't mean to offend any fans by saying this), this album is a prime example of 'flippy-floppy' music—I just don't feel like a lot of the busy-ness in the music is very directed or significant.

 

I also personally have a pet peeve, when listening to "cut up" styles of electronic music, with people who do nothing but string a lot of staccato samples together in rhythmic patterns for entire tracks. I like when music has short sounds and long sounds in it, and when a track is made up exclusively of tiny 16th-note-size snippets, your "drum" sounds can be anything. I feel like I don't have any chance to perceive all these supposedly wonderful VHS samples because they're all just 100 ms long bursts of noise and not, you know, music. Also I am an old geezer now so maybe that's it.

 

I would have liked to hear this material resequenced in a way that allowed much more of the original source to shine through. Imagine (and this will really piss you off) this same kinda stuff but put together like Girl Talk did it. So big chunks of old VHS sounds put together and allowed to breathe more. I mean, I know it's not fair to ding the album for what it is NOT, but still. It's an entire album of 16th notes—I dunno how you guys can possibly make it through in one sitting.

[Guest Lube Saibot]

I guess I disagree that this album is definitively not "glitch". Obviously it doesn't sound like r-n or like, fuckin, Aoki Takamasa circa 2002 or something, but there is an element of that same thing to it, to me. Granted, I have only listened to it through I think two times, via YouTube. Because I couldn't get into it I didn't buy it.

 

OK, i understand you point of view, but you seem to equate "glitch" with "cut-up", and while you might discard the differences as "bah semantics", for me "cut-up" conjures up sound collage, musique concrete, hip hop, scratch DJs, french touch, vsnares, etc, while "glitch" conjures up max/msp, microhouse, generative granular rhythmic noise squawks, Raster Noton, Ganz Graf, and sound libraries from Native Instruments with "k"s in their name filled with metallic and sci-fi clicks and bloops and shit. I guess I'm personally a bit less bored of the former rather than the latter.

 

I'm trying to think of how to describe it. I think what I would say is that compositionally this album reminds me of glitch, while clearly the sounds are different. I mean, this is just my opinion, but if you take a track like 'Brain Damaged', it reminds me a lot of that early 2000s cut-up shit. There's a lot of small-scale detail but I don't find myself latching on to any large-scale structure at all.

 

The small-scale is the large-scale, to my ears at least. Nothing to say here, really, this is highly subjective ground we're treading.

 

Maybe I'm just an asshole.

 

Quite possibly.

 

I didn't like the Jackson album either really, and this reminds me of that album a lot. In my mind (and I don't mean to offend any fans by saying this), this album is a prime example of 'flippy-floppy' music—I just don't feel like a lot of the busy-ness in the music is very directed or significant.

 

I can't see how you can find it insignificant to such a degree that you have a derogatory pet name for it, but again, highly subjective area.

 

I also personally have a pet peeve, when listening to "cut up" styles of electronic music, with people who do nothing but string a lot of staccato samples together in rhythmic patterns for entire tracks. I like when music has short sounds and long sounds in it, and when a track is made up exclusively of tiny 16th-note-size snippets, your "drum" sounds can be anything. I feel like I don't have any chance to perceive all these supposedly wonderful VHS samples because they're all just 100 ms long bursts of noise and not, you know, music. Also I am an old geezer now so maybe that's it.

 

Well, ok, point taken, and a pet peeve is a pet peeve, but good job deconstructing and shitting on all fast-paced busy music. Listen to Gianasi, some of the "wanky flourish" samples of guitars are almost a second and half long. Is that long enough?

 

Now say that snare drills in IDM are annoying.

 

And metal is too loud.

 

And goddamn kids with their skateboards and their hippityhop!

 

I would have liked to hear this material resequenced in a way that allowed much more of the original source to shine through. Imagine (and this will really piss you off) this same kinda stuff but put together like Girl Talk did it. So big chunks of old VHS sounds put together and allowed to breathe more. I mean, I know it's not fair to ding the album for what it is NOT, but still. It's an entire album of 16th notes—I dunno how you guys can possibly make it through in one sitting.

 

Well, yeah, but that's, like... slower, softer, not as immediately fun and completely a different genre? I quite like the way Gatekeeper sample, though. And it's exactly the "big chunk" process you describe. Actually, REAAAAAAALLLY big chunks sometimes (Optimus Maximus comes to mind ).

 

I dunno, I'm going to stop being a dick now, it seems that we've had contrarian standpoints on almost every subject ever, ascdi, and from now on I'm going to assume it's just the generation gap.

 

I'm 22, you're like 30 something right? Worlds apart. Who knows, maybe in like 10 years I'll agree with you, lords knows I've had the "oh no I'm becoming my dad" epiphany plenty of times before. Good will to you sir, and respect.

[Guest KY]

i'm in almost total agreement with ascdi, and as a 23-year-old, age doesn't really have anything to do with it. cut-up vs. glitch = splitting hairs methinks.

[ascdi]

Yeah, I mean, agreed on the subjectivity. I'm not saying that this album is bad, I'd probably get to like it more if I kept at listening to it.

 

OK, i understand you point of view, but you seem to equate "glitch" with "cut-up", and while you might discard the differences as "bah semantics", for me "cut-up" conjures up sound collage, musique concrete, hip hop, scratch DJs, french touch, vsnares, etc, while "glitch" conjures up max/msp, microhouse, generative granular rhythmic noise squawks, Raster Noton, Ganz Graf, and sound libraries from Native Instruments with "k"s in their name filled with metallic and sci-fi clicks and bloops and shit. I guess I'm personally a bit less bored of the former rather than the latter.

I agree that the sound palette on this album doesn't remind me of the 'glitch' genre or era or whatever that was, definitely. It's more the construction that reminds me of that kinda stuff.

 

Well, ok, point taken, and a pet peeve is a pet peeve, but good job deconstructing and shitting on all fast-paced busy music. Listen to Gianasi, some of the "wanky flourish" samples of guitars are almost a second and half long. Is that long enough?

I just mean that a mixture of sounds is good. Actually, I think some of the songs on Drukqs are good examples of what I mean. 'Taking Control' for example has a lot of moments where it gets real close to the sound of "a ton of stuff in a blender retriggering in ReCycle" but there are still other elements of the track ringing out or propelling it along. I just think that tends to give tracks more of a grooving, rolling quality.

 

Actually, it's funny you mention Vsnares up above—I think that when Vsnares is real good his tracks get super intense but keep "rolling" along like old school jungle, and when he's bad the tracks are choppy and I don't feel like they flow very well… it just sounds like a bunch of switches flipping on and off and not MUSIC. I think the closer you chop and resequence everything, the harder it is to keep a sense of flowing musicality to the tracks. Old jungle kinda rolls lots of times because there are just a few cuts or retriggers of the break per bar. Just a random thought.

 

I'm 22, you're like 30 something right? Worlds apart. Who knows, maybe in like 10 years I'll agree with you, lords knows I've had the "oh no I'm becoming my dad" epiphany plenty of times before. Good will to you sir, and respect.

Egads, I'm only 29! But yeah, I'm definitely becoming a dad. Not as much of an appetite for musical sensory overload these days.

[Guest Lube Saibot]

My final reply is that this is my favorite track from hudmo out of his entire discog, to give you and idea of my proclivities:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X2CVS_b7-Mc

 

so i guess i really really like the start-stop choppy feel

Edited January 10, 2011 by Lube Saibot

[oscillik]

lol glitch

 

btw, Lube Saibot and i are for once on exactly the same wavelength

[encey]

There's a lot of small-scale detail but I don't find myself latching on to any large-scale structure at all.

Listen to "Sunset Everett." It has a pretty straightforward pop song structure -- ABABCBA or something like that. A main melody, a second bit, a different bridge part, and then a return to the main melody. I agree that some of their tracks seem to just shift about randomly (and I myself don't really mind that), but repeated listens to some of their tracks should convince you there is significant 'large-scale' structure in there.

[mcbpete]

repeated listens to some of their tracks should convince you there is significant 'large-scale' structure in there.

This is exactly it, and exactly the appeal of VHS Head to me. I think I've mentioned before how when I first listened to Video Club that I couldn't even make it through the samples on Boomkat, but something later on played on my mind and I gave the samples another go. I then thought, OK I'll give it a cheeky download - listened to that a couple of times then bought it. So it took me about 5 goes before I got even the little 20 minute EP - this album took me about twice that before I really started appreciating the sheer detail and depth of it all.

 

So yeah, it's an album that does require significant effort but definitely rewards. And as for the age thing earlier, in a few months I'll be 29 so I don't think it's an album exclusively for the early 20s demographic at all....

[ascdi]

There's a lot of small-scale detail but I don't find myself latching on to any large-scale structure at all.

Listen to "Sunset Everett." It has a pretty straightforward pop song structure -- ABABCBA or something like that. A main melody, a second bit, a different bridge part, and then a return to the main melody. I agree that some of their tracks seem to just shift about randomly (and I myself don't really mind that), but repeated listens to some of their tracks should convince you there is significant 'large-scale' structure in there.

Totally agree, that's the standout track on the album in my opinion. At least in terms of songishness

[thief]

still can't get into the 2nd half of this except for 'The Violent Breed'

everything up until and including 'Motions' is superb

[mcbpete]

How 'bout Remote Control ? For me that's my highlight of the album - Takes me back to my C64 days.

[Terpentintollwut]

Yeah, in the beginning, my brain used to call it a day after about half of the album. Probably due to the sheer amount of different stuff on the whole thing. But there are many great bits there to be found as well. The album kinda comes to a slow end with the last three and a half tracks, as opposed to ending with a big Ziggomatic kind of track, but that just makes me want to re-play it more. The overall composition/order of tracks is pretty much perfect anyway.

[beerwolf]

The Wire review certainly doesn't put the whole BoC/VHS Head myth to bed either.

Edited January 10, 2011 by beerwolf

[elusive4]

so why was this mastered so shit

 

always a nice surprise when a vhs head track comes on random and im running at speed to turn the receiver down

[oscillik]

so why was this mastered so shit

 

always a nice surprise when a vhs head track comes on random and im running at speed to turn the receiver down

sounds fine on vinyl

[Tauhid]

I wish this album wasn't so cut up.

[Caretstik]

Surely that BoC bollocks isn't persisting? It's like the Sandisons are the only musicians entitled to be nostalgic about the 80s. And anyway, I imagine osc can debunk that stupid rumour.

[mcbpete]

I know, the constant BoC speculation thing is balls (especially as it's even properly credited on the album who it is). Just to add a spanner to the rumour mill though, do you think Adrian Blacow was in anyway involved in Gescom's latest EP - only reason being I had a playlist on my phone going from Trademark Ribbons straight into A1-D1 and I'd never noticed how similar sounding they are, especially something like B1 which is full of crazy cut ups and film samples. I know Gescom is a bit of a free-for-all Skam love in so was am just speculating....

 

Probably not though

[Caretstik]

You never know, it's a lot more plausible than the BoC nonsense. Mainly because it's based on someone using their ears (i.e. you Pete) instead of fanboi conspiracy theorists jumping to ridiculous '80s samples + Skam = BoC' conclusions. I can certainly see where you're coming from with the B1 similarities.

[oscillik]

Surely that BoC bollocks isn't persisting? It's like the Sandisons are the only musicians entitled to be nostalgic about the 80s. And anyway, I imagine osc can debunk that stupid rumour.

i can attest, on my entire record collection, that VHS Head is nothing to do with BoC.

 

I know, the constant BoC speculation thing is balls (especially as it's even properly credited on the album who it is). Just to add a spanner to the rumour mill though, do you think Adrian Blacow was in anyway involved in Gescom's latest EP - only reason being I had a playlist on my phone going from Trademark Ribbons straight into A1-D1 and I'd never noticed how similar sounding they are, especially something like B1 which is full of crazy cut ups and film samples. I know Gescom is a bit of a free-for-all Skam love in so was am just speculating....

 

Probably not though

heh nah, Ade wasn't involved with A1-B1 / C1-D1

 

edit: Ade wasn't signed to Skam that early

Edited January 11, 2011 by oscillik

[chassis]

I never got why people thought it was BoC in the first place. All the 80s nostalgia shit doesnt take away from the fact that VHS doesnt sound anything like Boards.

[Guest cult fiction]

So yeah, it's an album that does require significant effort but definitely rewards.

 

Haven't folks been listening to shit like Druqks and Confield since 2001? Those of you think this album is any way shape or form challenging have gone soft and need some intense IDM therapy only the late 90's/early 2000's can provide.

[oscillik]

I never got why people thought it was BoC in the first place. All the 80s nostalgia shit doesnt take away from the fact that VHS doesnt sound anything like Boards.

from my personal view, i can see the similarity with BoC in so far as the approach to drum programming, and in particular the use of vocal samples as a percussive element.

 

i had been thinking about this for a while, especially as i was one of the people that thought the rumour might've had some credit. sirch was right all along!