ALIEN / PROMETHEUS / COVENANT - SPOILERS INBOUND!!

[whosebrian]

[Roo]

Honestly, I adored Covenant. Wasn't expecting to based on the trailer and reception, but this was by far the best thing in the franchise since Alien 3. If you told me it would easily outdo 2017's other sci-fi sequels in 2049, War and (franchise best) Beyond, I would have laughed at the notion, yet that is exactly what happened.

 

The only 2017 films I rate more highly are Phantom Thread, Call Me By Your Name and A Quiet Passion. I've watched Covenant 6 times, even read the two Alan Dean Foster novelisations, can't get enough of it. And to make something of that spirit as one approaches their 80s is rare, hats off to Ridley

 

To each their own though.

Edited February 26, 2019 by Roo

[dr lopez]

you have some wild ass takes dude

[Squee]

Yeah, that flute scene was amazing.

[usagi]

I thought the Yakety Sax routine from the initial infection through to the dropship blowing up and David arriving on the scene was what really made the movie. solid comedy.

[Roo]

Whatever dudes, you'll wake up to this film eventually, someday distant. I anticipate that the cinephile community will grow to appreciate this more unanimously in time. The soul of the franchise is alive and well in Covenant.

 

 

Just some rambling fan observations from my 5th viewing last year:

 

 

I like how Mother warns that the "neutrino burst...could trigger a destructive event", given how Tennessee happens to pick up Shaw's message whilst repairing the damage (coupled with the resultant displeasure to return to hypersleep) and the plot ensues and redirects the fate of the colonists.

 

By the bye, I like how a colony mission is filmed (largely) in Australia (the First Fleet itself a new world colony mission, introduced to the world's oldest geologic continent and human culture).

 

I like how Oram whilst prone briefly mistakes David for Walter, then on recognition is quickly greeted with terror, foreshadowing the ending.

 

Ridley could have dealt with the LV-426 derelict with some minor tweaks, and used subsequent entries to do what he wanted. A space jockey could have been tucked away in hyper-sleep on the derelict, and experimented on by David either before or after the crash. Cole, as the xenomorph's only planetary victim (reportedly killed, but ambiguous on film), could be whisked away to birth an alien queen. Similarly, Walter could still be active in some form, with unknown consequences. I've read the novelisations, and seen Advent, but the similarity between the Planet 4 and LV-426 derelicts might as well be made composite with some plausible minor tweaks.

Given how much of the film Tennessee spends with Ricks and Upworth, his up-close reaction to their resultant slaughter is fairly composed.

 

Daniels getting the xenomorph first try with the crane, with only an axe to protect herself, then later luring the Alien into a compartment trap, and also baiting its impaling, is all very gutsy, quick-thinking steel by heroine standards, juxtaposing her sheer terror at the end as all the more unnerving. And all whilst believably playing someone mourning over James Franco, not an easy thing to muster.

 

Whilst this is a film of couples, you also need those more enigmatic victims to really kick off proceedings, and Ledward (wisely kept in the shadows until called upon with a whiff of lone wolf about him) fills this Kane-esque void.

 

I love Faris's terrified reaction and actions, and Oram's characterisation, which some viewers seem to malign. These are both ideas which follow through with visceral interest. Oram birthing the first xenomorph is a touching moment, and David's blatant lead down the garden path is delicious.

 

David really does resemble a young (80s/90s) Guy Pearce a great deal. There are some early roles where Guy Pearce even sported a similar hairdo to David in Prometheus. Pearce's relative youth in the (seemingly close to Prometheus) prologue would appear a goof, but maybe Charles kept youthful in vain and then collapsed badly with inevitable haste towards the end of his life (as well as a reaction to the maligned make-up on Pearce in Prometheus). And despite the strong influence of those activated prologue props and questions on the Covenant David, it could be read as the earliest product version of David paralleled for the later David 8. I wonder how much mystery about the Charles within David still remains, how much of it is agency and how much a phantom intent/influence. David is a rare chance in cinema to vicariously feel evil, misunderstood and creatively inspiring; the thoroughly articulate and engaging mad scientist with existential torment and creative drive to spare. The Xenomorph and Ellen Ripley are clearly under threat as the best character in the franchise. I wonder if David can continue revamping with interest like those two stalwarts of variant shades.

 

I myself am a fog on little cat's feet. I might have been an assassin or cat burglar in a previous life.

[usagi]

And all whilst believably playing someone mourning over James Franco, not an easy thing to muster.

 

on this we agree.

[dr lopez]

i didn't mind covenant at all (although waterston is box office poison)

 

kenny powers killed an alien and said you're fuckin out it was chill

[Soloman Tump]

Urghh. Maybe I need to force myself to sit through it all.

[Squee]

Urghh. Maybe I need to force myself to sit through it all.

 

 

Nah, you're good.

[Soloman Tump]

[iococoi]

Urghh. Maybe I need to force myself to shit through it all.

 

thatsthespirit

 

 

 

[KovalainenFanBoy]

just opened this thread for the first time ever to check why on earth these 2 movies warrant 150 pages of discussion

[xox]

These movies are like the usual imitations of autechre... technically perfectly executed but with zero artistical relevancy/achievement, like if the autor doesnt have clue whats the thing with ae or any art of that level in the first place.

Edited February 27, 2019 by xox

[Roo]

just opened this thread for the first time ever to check why on earth these 2 movies warrant 150 pages of discussion

Same, and based on the quality of posting on this page alone, I couldn't bear to read back much further lol. Looks like a pile of shtpost drivel long past its burn-by date.

[Guest]

I for one take everything back, especially any negative comments about Ridley. Genius.

[olo]

This page needs more BCM.

[T3551ER]

 

Whatever dudes, you'll wake up to this film eventually, someday distant. I anticipate that the cinephile community will grow to appreciate this more unanimously in time. The soul of the franchise is alive and well in Covenant.

 

 

Just some rambling fan observations from my 5th viewing last year:

 

 

I like how Mother warns that the "neutrino burst...could trigger a destructive event", given how Tennessee happens to pick up Shaw's message whilst repairing the damage (coupled with the resultant displeasure to return to hypersleep) and the plot ensues and redirects the fate of the colonists.

 

By the bye, I like how a colony mission is filmed (largely) in Australia (the First Fleet itself a new world colony mission, introduced to the world's oldest geologic continent and human culture).

 

I like how Oram whilst prone briefly mistakes David for Walter, then on recognition is quickly greeted with terror, foreshadowing the ending.

 

Ridley could have dealt with the LV-426 derelict with some minor tweaks, and used subsequent entries to do what he wanted. A space jockey could have been tucked away in hyper-sleep on the derelict, and experimented on by David either before or after the crash. Cole, as the xenomorph's only planetary victim (reportedly killed, but ambiguous on film), could be whisked away to birth an alien queen. Similarly, Walter could still be active in some form, with unknown consequences. I've read the novelisations, and seen Advent, but the similarity between the Planet 4 and LV-426 derelicts might as well be made composite with some plausible minor tweaks.

Given how much of the film Tennessee spends with Ricks and Upworth, his up-close reaction to their resultant slaughter is fairly composed.

 

Daniels getting the xenomorph first try with the crane, with only an axe to protect herself, then later luring the Alien into a compartment trap, and also baiting its impaling, is all very gutsy, quick-thinking steel by heroine standards, juxtaposing her sheer terror at the end as all the more unnerving. And all whilst believably playing someone mourning over James Franco, not an easy thing to muster.

 

Whilst this is a film of couples, you also need those more enigmatic victims to really kick off proceedings, and Ledward (wisely kept in the shadows until called upon with a whiff of lone wolf about him) fills this Kane-esque void.

 

I love Faris's terrified reaction and actions, and Oram's characterisation, which some viewers seem to malign. These are both ideas which follow through with visceral interest. Oram birthing the first xenomorph is a touching moment, and David's blatant lead down the garden path is delicious.

 

David really does resemble a young (80s/90s) Guy Pearce a great deal. There are some early roles where Guy Pearce even sported a similar hairdo to David in Prometheus. Pearce's relative youth in the (seemingly close to Prometheus) prologue would appear a goof, but maybe Charles kept youthful in vain and then collapsed badly with inevitable haste towards the end of his life (as well as a reaction to the maligned make-up on Pearce in Prometheus). And despite the strong influence of those activated prologue props and questions on the Covenant David, it could be read as the earliest product version of David paralleled for the later David 8. I wonder how much mystery about the Charles within David still remains, how much of it is agency and how much a phantom intent/influence. David is a rare chance in cinema to vicariously feel evil, misunderstood and creatively inspiring; the thoroughly articulate and engaging mad scientist with existential torment and creative drive to spare. The Xenomorph and Ellen Ripley are clearly under threat as the best character in the franchise. I wonder if David can continue revamping with interest like those two stalwarts of variant shades.

 

I myself am a fog on little cat's feet. I might have been an assassin or cat burglar in a previous life.

 

 

Ah, me, my little Minnaloushe-

 

Anyway, I'm a pretty hardcore Prometheus apologist (though I haven't rewatched in ages). There are quite a few moments that seem like missteps that I kind of can explain away when I'm feeling generous (e.g., the scientist who continues to engage the snake-like creature even when it's clear that, by any logical reckoning, this thing is going to fuck you up: this could be a comment on a point in the future of humanity where we have so thoroughly divorced ourselves from nature (and become the ultra apex-predator) that a scientist might not be able to connect with their animal selves. Plus you get the whole garden of eden, apple of knowledge, snake etc). I will admit, these sorts of things probably function best when one takes a "deep dive" approach or does the mental equivalent of squinting your eyes until things soften around the edges a bit. 

 

I think the thing I liked about Prometheus was that it was all-in on what it was. It reached at some pretty heavy ideas, didn't spoon feed the audience AT ALL, had moments of genuine terror, looked amazing, had moments of true, bone chilling horror (the med/pod scene. . . christ). That's why (to me) Covenant was such a friggin' let down. It felt like it was trying to be two different films (heady sci-fi vs action/horror) and ended up being good at neither one. Ironically, I felt like Prometheus did everything better, partly because it didn't give two shits about trying to compromise and "show the monster."  

[colunga]

Has anyone watched any of the fan edits?  https://www.syfy.com/syfywire/fan-splices-together-prometheus-and-alien-covenant-for-epic-sci-fi-odyssey

 

I got Paradise but havent watched it yet

[dr lopez]

agree with T3551ER

[beerwolf]

Prometheus had it's plus points but it hacked to peices with a very blunt axe (swung by a goon) the myth of the Space Jockey. I can't forgive such a travesty.

 

And I'm zero nerd. Something about the Space Jockey which got a hook into me. For decades I wondered about this creature and it's mission. That's a lot of time for somebody who's not a geek to be thinking about such a thing. But Alien pretty much blew my mind apart when I watched it.

 

Anyway the myth of the Space Jockey was destroyed for me. Just a big albino Chelsea football hooligan bald bloke in a space suit. 

 

That is not what I had in my minds eye when I observed the fossilized creature in the first Alien film. 

[Roo]

Id rank them like this personally

1. Alien 10/10

2. Aliens 10/10

3. Alien 3 9.5/10 (either cut)

4. Covenant 9/10

5. Prometheus 8/10

6. Resurrection 7.5/10

 

I grew up with them as my key childhood franchise.

Edited February 27, 2019 by Roo

[xox]

Id rank them like this personally

1. Alien 10/10

2. Aliens 10/10

3.

4.

5.

6.

 

[dr lopez]

 

Id rank them like this personally

1. Alien 10/10

2.

3.

4.

5.

6.

 

[markedone]

I could hardly sit through either prometheus or covenant.  for some reason the 'lore' behind the series is the most boring/convoluted thing ever to me.  i went into covenant thinking it would be some back to basics fun, but as soon as they were in caves delivering soliloquies in robes my eyes were rolling so far back into my head.  at least i have alien isolation which was pure vibe and exactly what i wanted.

Edited February 27, 2019 by Marked x 0ne