chenGOD Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 Matt Bruenig writes a lot of great stuff about the scando set up http://mattbruenig.com/2017/07/28/nordic-socialism-is-realer-than-you-think/ I think that's all ok, just to note that working social democracies seem all things considered to be more focused towards providing basic needs for everyone (healthcare, education, jobs etc) and less so towards abolishing free markets and abolishing the private sector (altough for the US and other countries to move towards that I suppose some of that is nessesary..) Markets play an important role in a healthy economy. Completely unregulated markets (which is not what the US has, but what many imagine they want) are not healthy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zkom Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 Scandinavian countries are in no way anti-capitalist or anti-consumerist. It's just more regulation (eg. hard liquor is only sold in government monopolies) and things like free education and universal health care and progressive taxation to balance income differences. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cichlisuite Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 I find it interesting how the Nordic countries maintain that balance between markets and welfare. Is there a tension that creates that balance or is more of an understanding? The dialogue in the US is so warped, basically from center-right to far right, if something is remotely collectivist or government oriented it's labeled commie/socialist (unless it's military spending), like commerce is so desperate to keep any threats away from the bottom line that there has to be this manufactured narrative. (probably not saying anything new here or even coming close to capturing the full picture) If you want to see through the smoke screens and warped dialogue, take this simple example: https://youtu.be/xF2lFGyADtM?t=7m21s The first 20 minutes is Steven vs Yusuf, and Yusuf basically destroys that bully. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markedone Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 Two years in, the image of trump holding ´rallies´ where just preaches to his ardent supporters is no less surreal than the first time.. Him saying horrific shit, people cheering in support, hats being chucked into the crowd. I still have difficulty reconciling with how real it all is.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caze Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 I find it interesting how the Nordic countries maintain that balance between markets and welfare. Is there a tension that creates that balance or is more of an understanding? The dialogue in the US is so warped, basically from center-right to far right, if something is remotely collectivist or government oriented it's labeled commie/socialist (unless it's military spending), like commerce is so desperate to keep any threats away from the bottom line that there has to be this manufactured narrative. (probably not saying anything new here or even coming close to capturing the full picture) If you want to see through the smoke screens and warped dialogue, take this simple example: https://youtu.be/xF2lFGyADtM?t=7m21s The first 20 minutes is Steven vs Yusuf, and Yusuf basically destroys that bully. ugh, why would you want to watch a video with that gobshite? this is much better: it's a bit of a mismatch though, jacobin lady was out of her depth on the details (though that's the case for most socialists I guess, this is a big theme in the video really). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eczem Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 I find it interesting how the Nordic countries maintain that balance between markets and welfare. Is there a tension that creates that balance or is more of an understanding? The dialogue in the US is so warped, basically from center-right to far right, if something is remotely collectivist or government oriented it's labeled commie/socialist (unless it's military spending), like commerce is so desperate to keep any threats away from the bottom line that there has to be this manufactured narrative. (probably not saying anything new here or even coming close to capturing the full picture) If you want to see through the smoke screens and warped dialogue, take this simple example: https://youtu.be/xF2lFGyADtM?t=7m21s The first 20 minutes is Steven vs Yusuf, and Yusuf basically destroys that bully. I lol'd as soon as I realized he was going to try to argue that health care is not a public good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ignatius Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 I find it interesting how the Nordic countries maintain that balance between markets and welfare. Is there a tension that creates that balance or is more of an understanding? The dialogue in the US is so warped, basically from center-right to far right, if something is remotely collectivist or government oriented it's labeled commie/socialist (unless it's military spending), like commerce is so desperate to keep any threats away from the bottom line that there has to be this manufactured narrative. (probably not saying anything new here or even coming close to capturing the full picture) If you want to see through the smoke screens and warped dialogue, take this simple example: https://youtu.be/xF2lFGyADtM?t=7m21s The first 20 minutes is Steven vs Yusuf, and Yusuf basically destroys that bully. I lol'd as soon as I realized he was going to try to argue that health care is not a public good. and later he's talking about how high the corporate tax rate is in the USA even though no one pays that rate because there's a fuck ton of loopholes + offshoring of business. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cichlisuite Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 (edited) ugh, why would you want to watch a video with that gobshite? this is much better: it's a bit of a mismatch though, jacobin lady was out of her depth on the details (though that's the case for most socialists I guess, this is a big theme in the video really). Well I really didn't know about this Change my mind shite until two days ago. I actually thought this was a meme the whole time so...yea, as soon as I watched through the Yusef vs him 'debate' I canceled the video as it was obvious the guy is a hack and most probably a think-tank talking head (like Ben Shapiro and the likes). So, yeah, ugh, I agree completely. However, I linked it to eczem to illustrate a point, a case study if you will, how such debates are set up most of the time, related to his comment about warped dialogue, which I think it's a fair observation. To give an illusion of a democratic, almost Ancient Greek agora discourse, but in reality it is a rhetoric competition, a definition war, a semantics squabble, diverting attention and finally an outright 'time is up buddy' cut. And mostly because Yusef managed to squeeze in very clear and solid arguments that can spur further research... The topic itself is immensely complex, and definitely cannot be resolved easily, nor by a single master mind like in simpler times Marx managed. But there is one thing clear. Both sides of the debate must elevate their perception and include a whole lot more holistic approach to the problem, which means also both sides will have to swallow big chunks of red pills in order to progress the debate and provide any feasible solutions. Edited October 10, 2018 by Godwin Austen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaderpansen Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 (edited) I find it interesting how the Nordic countries maintain that balance between markets and welfare. Is there a tension that creates that balance or is more of an understanding? The dialogue in the US is so warped, basically from center-right to far right, if something is remotely collectivist or government oriented it's labeled commie/socialist (unless it's military spending), like commerce is so desperate to keep any threats away from the bottom line that there has to be this manufactured narrative. (probably not saying anything new here or even coming close to capturing the full picture) If you want to see through the smoke screens and warped dialogue, take this simple example: https://youtu.be/xF2lFGyADtM?t=7m21s The first 20 minutes is Steven vs Yusuf, and Yusuf basically destroys that bully. ugh, why would you want to watch a video with that gobshite? Srsly. Also germany does have minimum wage. The amount's a joke and often worked around but it's there and it's supposed to be raised in 19. Uneducated, pompous shithead. Edited October 10, 2018 by jaderpansen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eczem Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 ugh, why would you want to watch a video with that gobshite? this is much better: it's a bit of a mismatch though, jacobin lady was out of her depth on the details (though that's the case for most socialists I guess, this is a big theme in the video really). Well I really didn't know about this Change my mind shite until two days ago. I actually thought this was a meme the whole time so...yea, as soon as I watched through the Yusef vs him 'debate' I canceled the video as it was obvious the guy is a hack and most probably a think-tank talking head (like Ben Shapiro and the likes). So, yeah, ugh, I agree completely. However, I linked it to eczem to illustrate a point, a case study if you will, how such debates are set up most of the time, related to his comment about warped dialogue, which I think it's a fair observation. To give an illusion of a democratic, almost Ancient Greek agora discourse, but in reality it is a rhetoric competition, a definition war, a semantics squabble, diverting attention and finally an outright 'time is up buddy' cut. And mostly because Yusef managed to squeeze in very clear and solid arguments that can spur further research... The topic itself is immensely complex, and definitely cannot be resolved easily, nor by a single master mind like in simpler times Marx managed. But there is one thing clear. Both sides of the debate must elevate their perception and include a whole lot more holistic approach to the problem, which means also both sides will have to swallow big chunks of red pills in order to progress the debate and provide any feasible solutions. Yeah, that sums it up quite nicely; it's pretty much unbearable to watch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Braintree Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 (edited) Fucking lol at the guy not understanding that particular usage of 'autistic.' It just means separated in that context. Autonomous. It's not an insult and doesn't exactly refer to the condition we call autism. The way he goes about his argument is pretty pathetic and fell into basically every logical fallacy he could find. Talking over someone and asking them to define every single thing isn't good debating and exposes him as an intellectual lightweight. edit: Another thing about the way the debate is set up is that this guy literally set up a fucking table in a park and then demands everyone else defend their position/argument rather than him defending his even though he started that shit. What a turd. Edited October 10, 2018 by Braintree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaderpansen Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 frowning upon being called autstic for least IDM 2018. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaderpansen Posted October 11, 2018 Share Posted October 11, 2018 ok just now he in all seriousness claimed the equivalency of hitler's national socialist ideas being built around hating jews and socialist ideas in general hating the richest 1%... what a completely worthless fucking retarded cunt ass piece of shit. why did i even watch this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zlemflolia Posted October 11, 2018 Share Posted October 11, 2018 frowning upon being called autstic for least IDM 2018. autistic is a compliment to anyone sufficiently aware Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ambermonk Posted October 11, 2018 Share Posted October 11, 2018 Two years in, the image of trump holding ´rallies´ where just preaches to his ardent supporters is no less surreal than the first time.. Him saying horrific shit, people cheering in support, hats being chucked into the crowd. I still have difficulty reconciling with how real it all is.. I feel ya. He knows how to rile up a crowd of inbred backwater tribals. Such are the rallies of the Turd Reich. Question is, is it still possible to abort it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nebraska Posted October 11, 2018 Author Share Posted October 11, 2018 http://www.trumponstern.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
may be rude Posted October 11, 2018 Share Posted October 11, 2018 (edited) https://www.vote.org/am-i-registered-to-vote/ Edited October 11, 2018 by very honest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whosebrian Posted October 11, 2018 Share Posted October 11, 2018 http://www.trumponstern.com/ Sirius/XM ordered TrumpOnStern.com to take down all audio on Oct. 6, 2018. While this audio served a important public service and was clearly fair use, we do not have the resources to prove this in court. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ambermonk Posted October 11, 2018 Share Posted October 11, 2018 https://www.vote.org/am-i-registered-to-vote/ I hear the same kinda shit is going down in TX & ND. GOP bastards already trying to cheat the midterms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
may be rude Posted October 11, 2018 Share Posted October 11, 2018 (edited) 10%... given no notice. they think they're registered, then they show up to vote on voting day and they can't it's a very clearly one-sided issue. the gop can't even use their disinfo smoke grenades. they stop poor people from voting and can't even claim that "democrats do it too." MIT found gerrymandering gives republicans 15% more representation in congress. if the advantage from voter suppression is similar then they should control 40% of congress or less. now they have the supreme court, and they want more power. are they going to right their ways? this looks bad. Edited October 11, 2018 by very honest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YEK Posted October 11, 2018 Share Posted October 11, 2018 so is kanye really crazy, being buddy buddy with trump.. wtf. they'll be meeting soon. i hope it's everything kayne wanted and more Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Candiru Posted October 11, 2018 Share Posted October 11, 2018 Kanye is a mentally handicapped celebrity who is probably in a ton of debt. He will suck Ronald Reagan's decayed dead skeleton dick on C-Span for all to see to get what he needs. He might do it I never gave an actual fuck about Taylor Swift, but I'm glad she did some shit. She's cool in my book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ignatius Posted October 11, 2018 Share Posted October 11, 2018 If the GOP can’t advance its agenda through the democratic process it will abandon democracy and retain power at all costs. Voter suppression, gerrymandering are just the start. If they hold on much longer with trump at the helm they’ll hold all the cards. If mueller doesn’t kick over the right rocks and bring solid overwhelming evidence then we’re just a few steps away from a Russia type of cleptocracy. I wonder how the tech giants will react?? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zlemflolia Posted October 11, 2018 Share Posted October 11, 2018 I wonder how the tech giants will react?? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk I think they benefit from a free country with real democracy. You just accidentally advertised for multiple tech companies through your civil protest online. They don't want to get reigned in and forced to censor things for the government, because their business models will be fucked. I'd like to hope the major tech companies won't be horrible Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
may be rude Posted October 11, 2018 Share Posted October 11, 2018 (edited) If the GOP can’t advance its agenda through the democratic process it will abandon democracy and retain power at all costs. Voter suppression, gerrymandering are just the start. If they hold on much longer with trump at the helm they’ll hold all the cards. If mueller doesn’t kick over the right rocks and bring solid overwhelming evidence then we’re just a few steps away from a Russia type of cleptocracy. the republicans are more corrupt so they are more likely to disassemble democracy. the Trump administration declining to counter ongoing Russian interference in US elections is... what is that? Edited October 11, 2018 by very honest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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