I'm Ashamed of WATMM Sometimes

[dr lopez]

i think because joyrex realized (4 years too late) his av was a picture of robbie martin? which i guess is against the rules too? didn't know that having an av of an old member who asked to be banned was worthy of a lifetime ban. maybe we should add that to the rules list so other people don't make the same mistake? just a thought

[xox]

2 minutes ago, Gocab said:

I'm more shocked about the antisemitism than the autism tbqf

Towards eugene? Oh cmon! Antisemitism is everywhere in the world but ppl around here only have teased him a bit few times but it was nothing sirius iirc. Why shouldnt ppl be allowed to tease me for being a croat?! It’s much to be tease about and it’s funny really, only maybe it’s a less known about what exactly 

[usagi]

you're missing a lot, xox. of course it doesn't help that entire threads get blasted away now so there isn't any record left.

[Lada Laika]

WATMM: scorched earth edition. Soon there will be no threads, and no users.

[usagi]

^ I support this, in line with the universal law of entropy and the fundamental meaninglessness of any human endeavour.

[YangYing]

4real the not showing who has been banned is p confusing 

[Rubin Farr]

I've never been a fan of negativity on watmm, but as said, it does seem to go in cycles, we've had one generational shift so far, and undoubtedly it will happen again if this forum lives on for decades.  It's just the internets, everyone chill.  Real life is still better, and social media, echo chambers, trolling, it's all something we will look back on without nostalgia.

[Silent Member]

I'm not shocked about the anti-Semitic jokes, just about the banning of our one token Jew and contrarian. I always enjoyed his reviews.

 

Also, sorry about any spectrum jokes, I always felt they were a part of the comradery in here. More a token of approval and pride in being on the spectrum than trying to put anyone down. 

 

Please don't ever ban schlitze, if he goes I go.

[xox]

37 minutes ago, usagi said:

you're missing a lot, xox. 

Yes, i guess you’re right, it’s becoming apparent to me now too.

(Sometimes im missing a week or two cause life and when im here i usually skip threads with lots of empty talk)

[IOS]

Meanwhile...

 

[Joyrex]

Okay, deep breath - here we go...

13 hours ago, dr lopez said:

damn.. if only all the cool people who made this place funny and chill weren't kicked out

Those "cool people" either got themselves banned because they refused to follow the change in rules, or they decided to become martyrs and take some stand against me/WATMM and the way I choose to run MY site. It's not a public utility, ffs.

11 hours ago, Ivan Ooze said:

That's a shame but yeezus, people are so sensitive. We are on an idm forum... a fucking idm forum, think about that for a second before getting offended and didnt the frigging aphex twin say he's got autism?

I don't see what this being an "IDM forum" has anything to do with being more/less sensitive, or that we need to be more or less sensitive. The internet in general requires one to have a thick skin (mine's about three feet thick at this point), but it's just a bit sad that someone - anyone - feels like they have to leave due to the behaviour of others in a community.

10 hours ago, Candiru said:

I hear you on this. There could be people on this forum taking care of someone, taking real responsibility and time out of their lives to to look after a disabled person, and I can only imagine their reaction to the online usage of words relating to autism. It's something to appreciate. But at the same time, I grew up in an extremely politically incorrect environment and the kind of random stuff you could expect to hear was refreshing and aired things out well. Chaos(free speech) is the way to go, even if people say bad stuff. Like Eugene caused some controversy in that Epstein thread, but none of us are worse off for it. We all said what we needed to say, no one's morality was influenced and we reaffirmed our beliefs. No harm done, really. It's a beautiful thing, this free speech. It works itself out in a way that can surprise us and renew our faith.

I too grew up in a very, very un-PC era and environment, so I know exactly what you're talking about. I think in some ways too society/people have become overly sensitive and everything and everyone seems to demand respect and awareness of their beliefs, gender choice, political views, etc. It seems like it's swung in the other direction too many times.

That being said, I think sometimes we forget that while we can laugh off or not be offended by something, does not mean that someone else wants to, or is able to - and being mindful of that I think is the point of this thread.

8 hours ago, yekker said:

lol that this is an actual thread 

I'm a bit disappointed you don't feel this thread is beneficial to yourself or WATMM.

8 hours ago, goDel said:

That's the thing, right? If you're new here and don't know the backstory, that stuff just won't translate well.

Half the board scores well into the aspi-spectrum. And like someone said earlier, I also vaguely remember Rdj suspects he scores high on it as well.  In the Ae subforum, enjoying Ae is basically considered the ultimate autism-test. In the watmm non-clinical meaning, that is. Not sure why, as I imagine a real autist might go into a panic attack listening to Ae. But whatever. And we also have this Ulilila character that's a returning phenomenon on the most IDM yearlist. Was never a fan of that, btw.

So, watmm has had this 'special' relationship with autism for years. Or better, a fascination.

Looks bad from an uninformed outsider. But in all honesty, watmm always had this secret language/culture thing going on where your average outsider will go WTF. So that comes with the territory, imo. Personally I'm not sure whether keeping autism off the banter-list of words will do much. I don't have strong feelings on this. But that's also because for me it's a fairly distant concept. I know some people with kids with autism. That's about it. Don't think they'd be too bothered with it though. If you have a kid with autism, you already have plenty to be worried about. And those kids themselves as well. They're very sensitive to a lot of things. But last of those things is stuff that's being said on the internet.

(I'm ignoring the high-functioning self labeled aspies here, btw. Those actually tend to be the people most sensitive about what is being said. As they have connected their own identity to it. Whether that's justified...I tend to differ btw. But thats another story)

But if we're going down this road though, do we stop listening to windowlicker as well?

Final thought: as this came from someone who is not a part of this community any more, I don't feel an urge for change, tbh. It would be different if he still was and "came out of the closet". It would have been great if he had started a thread about his experience with those kids with autism, btw. If he wanted change, that would have been a way forward, I believe. I'm fairly sure a number of people would have been interested. 

I think this 'relationship with autism' is more perceptual or manufactured than reality. I've no basis for that probably no more than your assertion it does, since I would imagine most who do know they have autism may not be eager to announce it to an online community.

I don't think this thread is meant for us to go down any road per se - it's just to bring awareness to the community that sometimes we get a bit too complacent in seeking the lulz/our behaviour we don't realize what we say can and does genuinely hurt and offend others.

8 hours ago, BCM said:

what a silly sausage. it's always a choice to be offended by something.

WHAAAAAT? What are you on about? Do you actually believe that someone being offended is a choice?

So black people choose to be offended by racist slurs, and immigrants and refugees are choosing to live in fear and terror because angry, insecure white people think it's okay to lock them up like animals and ship them around like livestock?

My guess is that like me you're a middle class white person, who has never been discriminated against, or never knew what it was like to live in fear because of where you're from or who you are or what you believe.

7 hours ago, darreichungsform said:

Insults that don't discriminate groups of people that historically have been mass murdered or enslaved. There surely are insults that aren't ableist, racist, homophobic and such, you faggot

Genuinely Ironic coming from someone who purports living in Germany of all places.

2 hours ago, oscillik said:

"I'm ashamed of WATMM sometimes" — quote from all the featured artists

You're right - I've had more than a fair share of labels and artists saying they did not want to be associated with WATMM because of the community's behaviour or it's perceived stand on many things. 

1 hour ago, dr lopez said:

1. bans cool watmm member for talking about pedophiles

2. proceeds to call another cool member (me) a pedophile

3. makes thread called im ashamed of watmm sometimes that's about name calling

 

can't make this shit up folks

1. eugene wasn't "cool" (at least in my estimation) - he was antagonistic, argumentative and belligerent, and entertained views most would find unsavoury and not what most people would express in public.
2. Again with the whole 'nonce' thing - I stand by my use of the word was akin to an idiot or a fool - I obviously don't live in the UK, so in retrospect I probably should have chosen something else to express my exasperation over your obvious ignorance (deliberate or unintentional). Whether you're cool or not is still up for debate
3. There is a BIG difference between calling someone out for being foolish vs making fun of or discriminating against people with a mental condition - I would hope you would realize that and not have to be explicitly told so

1 hour ago, dr lopez said:

eugene. joyrex has made it look like he hasn't been banned

No, we haven't - this is a result of the forum upgrade, where the developer decided that showing a user's banned status was problematic for communities (likely due to feedback and requests from their clients who asked how to hide a user's banned status as not to cause controversy on their forums), so they removed it from the public view. There used to be a banned user group that on the old system, users would be assigned to when banned, and that is no longer a feature (I could create a banned group and manually put users in there when they get banned I suppose).

We're not covering anything up, and it's just pain fear mongering/antagonistic to suggest so.

55 minutes ago, Blir said:

One message from somebody saying they didn't like the board? I mean law of averages suggests some people won't like any given thing. I don't understand why everything has to try and appeal to everybody all of the time, Joyrex. You have a pretty unique community here that for the most part understands that there is an absurd and sometimes mean tone to discourse here. It's been like that since day dot. Except these days it's a little more punctuated by people having actual beef on here, lol.

Did you say to the guy "Sorry it's probably just not for you." Because if you were making excuses for the community I think you probably went about it wrong.

It wasn't (and hasn't) been just one message or comment - I've gotten plenty of people who have asked for their account to be deleted/removed because of the toxicity of the forums, the use of racist slurs and remarks, and insensitivity to issues like mental health, race, religion, and sexual orientation/preference.

As for appealing to everyone all the time - of course we can't cater to everyone, but we can try and make WATMM as welcoming and inviting to new users who were drawn here because of their interest in electronic music.

As I said, I personally apologized for their experience here, and felt I've gotten enough of these kinds of comments that I wanted to say something to everyone about it.

41 minutes ago, Blir said:

Yeah I figure but I don't think he receives an avalanche of messages like that either.

I get more than I care to, and it's seemingly increased recently.

37 minutes ago, Gocab said:

I'm more shocked about the antisemitism than the autism tbqf

I can't believe after the Holocaust and WW II that in this day and age such an ignorant viewpoint still has a foothold in society. Then again, I think people inherently like to discriminate against one another; some just vocalize and manifest those feelings more than others.

30 minutes ago, dr lopez said:

i think because joyrex realized (4 years too late) his av was a picture of robbie martin? which i guess is against the rules too? didn't know that having an av of an old member who asked to be banned was worthy of a lifetime ban. maybe we should add that to the rules list so other people don't make the same mistake? just a thought

It was brought to my attention - I had no idea who it was in his avatar, etc. However, when it was brought to my attention, I asked him to change it if he didn't have permission from said person to use it - he gave me some bullshit that it was from a Russian Times interview on YouTube and it was 'fair use'. However, his overlaying the gay pride flag was implying that the person is gay (as if that's something wrong) and I have no idea if that person has openly stated as such, etc. The fact he refused to change it plus the culmination of his behaviour here resulted in the mods and I deciding to ban him once and for all.

So, it wasn't just his misuse of someone's image that got him banned - it was a long-overdue buildup of infractions and bad behaviour that ultimately led to his banning.

10 minutes ago, MIXL2 said:

4real the not showing who has been banned is p confusing 

As mentioned above, this is something due to the forum upgrade - I personally don't see any value in publicly shaming someone who's been banned, and if you're curious you can always ask me or a mod and we'll gladly confirm any concerns you may have about a member's status.

[Freak of the week]

2 hours ago, xox said:

Why shouldnt ppl be allowed to tease me for being a croat?!

hahaha

[hello spiral]

lmao weak

[ligma]

joyrex literally just called yek a retard

[hello spiral]

yeah I noticed that too. When you're lashing out at Yek, the most innocent and benign watmmer, something's wrong. 

[jaderpansen]

is this the new WATMM is dying thread?

1 hour ago, Joyrex said:

Genuinely Ironic coming from someone who purports living in Germany of all places.

triggered.

[goDel]

3 hours ago, dr lopez said:

eugene. joyrex has made it look like he hasn't been banned

so, temp ban? don't know the back story. but his account looks normal to me anyways, d-lo.

[dr lopez]

1 hour ago, Joyrex said:

As mentioned above, this is something due to the forum upgrade - I personally don't see any value in publicly shaming someone who's been banned, and if you're curious you can always ask me or a mod and we'll gladly confirm any concerns you may have about a member's status.

how does this work? in my years at watmm i don't think anyone was "shamed" for being banned. we maybe laughed a little at zazbanned and when remy maranthe did that hilarious one-post instaban. If anything, the mods were targeted for banning them. seems convenient that now no one will know if they've been banned or not, certainly eases the heat on yourself. I for one would love a list somewhere accessible on the site of currently banned members. 

 

edit: also big shout out to 420ourange. he was a funny poster and then he got banned and we all kinda forgot about him.

[goDel]

6 minutes ago, goDel said:

so, temp ban? don't know the back story. but his account looks normal to me anyways, d-lo.

nrmnd this post.... ketching-up on the thread. mr j made everything crystal

[Ivan Ooze]

Pooring one out for all the homies that we lost on a friggin idm forum

[beerwolf]

Even Squarepusher before the NTS mix was for years getting a hard time and a lot of negativity, no wonder other artists or labels shit themselves at the prospect of getting a subforum!

I think there's been quite a few new members who have just blended in and been pretty cool imo. 

[Joyrex]

1 hour ago, Joyrex said:

11 hours ago, yekker said:

lol that this is an actual thread 

I'm a bit disappointed you don't feel this thread is beneficial to yourself or WATMM.

 

29 minutes ago, ligma said:

joyrex literally just called yek a retard

 

27 minutes ago, hello spiral said:

yeah I noticed that too. When you're lashing out at Yek, the most innocent and benign watmmer, something's wrong. 

Seriously? You two are getting dangerously close to our definition of flame baiting (let alone harassment).

This is turning more into an agenda against me than anything else - and as guests on my site, you know where the door is. Can't say I would be sorry to see either of you go.

If you'd like me to expedite that process, I will be more than glad to.

[hello spiral]

and you gave me a warning point too, for what reason?

This kinda feels like you're trying to provoke me into 'death by cop' or something. 

[Joyrex]

1 minute ago, hello spiral said:

and you gave me a warning point too, for what reason?

This kinda feels like you're trying to provoke me into 'death by cop' or something. 

No - you flame baited someone (me) as did @ligma, and I gave both of you a temporary warning point each.

It's your decision whether this goes any further or not.

[Ivan Ooze]

Aint no cure for the summertime blues
Joyrex, you are a good guy but chillax. We all just big children having fun, nobody here wants to hurt anyone and we love u
I love watmm and i think it would be a good time now for schlitze to ask jules to get married