Russia is now bombing Ukraine

[may be rude]

6 hours ago, marf said:

Putin's strongman image is not going to tuck tail and leave. He will go to the brutal end. I worry so much this is going to spill into nato countries and then China get involved. etc etc.. ww3

it's hard to imagine putin giving up already. but there are reports of starving, surrendering and deserting troops. assuming a continued offensive over months, all those days increase the probability of the war expanding.

i'm not sure how long russia can support the offensive, monetarily. 

talks are active. putin will be more and more motivated to reach an agreement as time goes on.

6 hours ago, zazen said:

The Russian people are like a sea being held back by Putins tight control and propaganda. Once the other powers in Russia (oligarchs, mafia) start to turn against Putin, the wall holding the Russian people back crumbles and they will rush in. But it will be the oligarchs and mafia in the background positioning themselves to make sure whatever new government forms will be working for them. So the people will play a part, but probably not get much out of it other than another slightly less bad gangster.

it was after deripaska and another oligarch spoke out against the war that putin made it illegal to call it a war or to criticize the special military operation. it's going north korea. 

Edited March 16, 2022 by trying to be less rude

[zkom]

8 hours ago, ilqx hermolia xpli said:

the text description of the video provides no sources, the video itself is just a bunch of innocuous videos of construction workers with the narrator making all of the claims, then there's some random person wearing a hoody supposedly saying what is being translated.  you'll have to forgive me for not trusting bbc's sparkling record on human rights

Oh looool, it's not like this is a fucking secret. Come on..

Here's the fucking Wikipedia article: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Koreans_in_Russia

CNN piece https://edition.cnn.com/2018/01/15/europe/russia-north-korea-labor-intl/index.html

Le Monde Diplomatique piece https://mondediplo.com/2006/04/08koreanworkers

The Guardian piece https://www.theguardian.com/football/2017/jun/04/like-prisoners-of-war-north-korean-labour-russia-world-cup-st-petersburg-stadium-zenit-arena

The Moscow Times piece https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2017/03/31/north-korean-slaves-building-key-russian-world-cup-stadium-a57602

The Independent piece https://www.independent.co.uk/news/long_reads/north-koreans-in-russia-work-basically-in-the-situation-of-slaves-a7841831.html

South China Morning Post piece https://www.scmp.com/news/asia/east-asia/article/3042820/un-deadline-looms-north-koreas-overseas-workers-return-home

I could go on and on but it doesn't just hinge on one BBC video

[zkom]

8 hours ago, Milwaukeeeee said:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aleksandr_Dugin

https://euromaidanpress.com/2016/01/26/how-alexander-dugins-neo-eurasianists-geared-up-for-the-russian-ukrainian-war-in-2005-2013/

https://www.thedailybeast.com/alexander-dugin-the-crazy-ideologue-of-the-new-russian-empire?ref=scroll

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eurasian_Youth_Union

Dugin  maybe the satanist behind this Putin war nonsense, the guy studied tantric magicians like Julies Évola and stuff. Pure nazi esotericism magicks ideals. The Z and V Symbols are  some clearly hermetic V for Vendetta Aleister Crowley shit

I don't really know how much Dugin is behind Russia's foreign policy in reality but he has some interesting ideas about Russia's old pal China for sure https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundations_of_Geopolitics

Quote

• China, which represents a danger to Russia, "must, to the maximum degree possible, be dismantled". Dugin suggests that Russia start by taking Tibet–Xinjiang–Inner Mongolia–Manchuria as a security belt.^[1] Russia should offer China help "in a southern direction – Indochina (except Vietnam), the Philippines, Indonesia, Australia" as geopolitical compensation.^[8]

 

[usagi]

7 hours ago, zero said:

if Putin ultimately destroys key infrastructure in all the major Ukrainian metro areas, then what? play king of the castle to empty buildings and rubble? he would have to rebuild everything in order to have any sort of chance of gaining control over the remaining hostile population. but with what resources to do so? so then it becomes destroying everything for destructions sake, declaring victory, and then putting in a puppet group of leaders there to be hated. this doesn't seem like much of a long term plan, and will lead to continued conflict until both sides have been ground down morally to a pulp.

again, part of the old playbook. this has been done already in Grozny, which the Russians completely destroyed and then rebuilt from scratch with puppet leaders installed. it 'worked' at the time, I mean the Chechens are fighting for them now. it's another story about whether now, with heavy sanctions and a faltering economy, they have the ability to do that again. Ukraine is proving to be a bit different to their previous fun little adventures.

I don't have a lot of sympathy for ordinary Russians in the motherland tbh. some, on a basic human level. generally I don't want to see ordinary people punished for the actions of their leaders. but I always remember how they've just ignored the untold amount of suffering their nation freely inflicted on innocents in the Caucasus, the Middle East, wherever else. people are shocked now that the Russian military is bombing Ukrainian maternity wards and killing pregnant women but they've always been about that. the targeting of civilians is a deliberate strategy of pain they use to increase the humanitarian cost of war for their opponents, which is the coldest and most inhumane thinking you can adopt in a war. I don't accept that ordinary Russians are all so brainwashed by state media that they don't have some inkling of what's being done in their name. most of them just don't care. maybe they will a bit more now.

[zlemflolia]

18 minutes ago, usagi said:

again, part of the old playbook. this has been done already in Grozny, which the Russians completely destroyed and then rebuilt from scratch with puppet leaders installed. it 'worked' at the time, I mean the Chechens are fighting for them now. it's another story about whether now, with heavy sanctions and a faltering economy, they have the ability to do that again. Ukraine is proving to be a bit different to their previous fun little adventures.

I don't have a lot of sympathy for ordinary Russians in the motherland tbh. some, on a basic human level. generally I don't want to see ordinary people punished for the actions of their leaders. but I always remember how they've just ignored the untold amount of suffering their nation freely inflicted on innocents in the Caucasus, the Middle East, wherever else. people are shocked now that the Russian military is bombing Ukrainian maternity wards and killing pregnant women but they've always been about that. the targeting of civilians is a deliberate strategy of pain they use to increase the humanitarian cost of war for their opponents, which is the coldest and most inhumane thinking you can adopt in a war. I don't accept that ordinary Russians are all so brainwashed by state media that they don't have some inkling of what's being done in their name. most of them just don't care. maybe they will a bit more now.

so do you feel the same carelessness towards ukrainian civilians who stood by as their government murdered so many in disputed eastern border regions?

[usagi]

yeah yeah yeah.

[cichlisuite]

Funny how the sociopathic politicians do a 180 kick-flip benihana over the ramp when they smell their opportunity for shameless self-promotion for the sake of political points and, in our case, pre-election maneuvering. After Salvini's promo trip to Ukraine from which he was deservedly ousted by the mayor of Przemysl, now our prime minister Janša also went to visit Ukraine to show his unwavering support. He even published a picture of himself as the defense minister from 1991, dressed in a military camo uniform, along with Zelensky's picture when he was dressed in a helmet and a body armor, as if they are brother in arms, birds of a feather. It's completely fine and welcome for him to offer support if it wasn't for the complete change of his political narrative that was going on for the last several years: feeling his best among the likes of Le Pen, Meloni, Salvini, Orban, etc, who sympathized with Putin and even received his funds for their political campaigns. He wants us to forget his life work on eliminating free press, meddling in state legal authorities, cleaning up opposition, curtailing personal and political liberties, etc. He will now receive 100,000 Ukranian refugees with an open heart, after he spent years building an argument of a radical nationalism against dark-skinned refugees from Syria, Afganistan, north Africa, etc. The war in Ukraine now became one of his pre-election promotion strategies.

"Heroes don't run, heroes fight." lmao, sure Janša, sure.

[zero]

13 hours ago, ilqx hermolia xpli said:

USSR 2.0?  you really think Russia is heading towards socialism?  I read this post as absolutely absurd.  Russia's population is being lied to?  Yes, every single population gets lied to under privately owned media.  Heading towards socialism?  That would be great, I wish.  Not gonna happen.  The only hope of it happening is if the CPRF takes over when Putin loses power and this would be a great opportunity to do it when the world is cutting them off and forcing isolationism, a problem solved by socialism in one country of the USSR.

shoulda known you'd come swooping in at some point after I rambled away there. probably a good thing you think anything I post in this thread is absurd, as that indicates disagreement - which is correct! I've said before to you, we must agree to disagree, and leave it at that. I've disagreed with just about everything you've posted in this topic, but it's just really not worth the effort to call it all out every single time.

look, when I haphazardly threw out "USSR 2.0" I was using it more or less as a euphemism to what I had just said in like the sentence just before. I was talking about the direction Russia is heading in regards to becoming more closed off to the world, similar to how it was closed off back in the USSR era. it was an off the cuff phrase that I admittingly didn't game plan all the way out, and I really wasn't thinking about the category of "ism" it would be referencing. I really don't know what social or economic philosophy Russia is heading towards, tbh. and I really don't want to get into the weeds over this and go round and round on here with you, as it is just not a constructive use of time.

[zlemflolia]

4 hours ago, zero said:

shoulda known you'd come swooping in at some point after I rambled away there. probably a good thing you think anything I post in this thread is absurd, as that indicates disagreement - which is correct! I've said before to you, we must agree to disagree, and leave it at that. I've disagreed with just about everything you've posted in this topic, but it's just really not worth the effort to call it all out every single time.

look, when I haphazardly threw out "USSR 2.0" I was using it more or less as a euphemism to what I had just said in like the sentence just before. I was talking about the direction Russia is heading in regards to becoming more closed off to the world, similar to how it was closed off back in the USSR era. it was an off the cuff phrase that I admittingly didn't game plan all the way out, and I really wasn't thinking about the category of "ism" it would be referencing. I really don't know what social or economic philosophy Russia is heading towards, tbh. and I really don't want to get into the weeds over this and go round and round on here with you, as it is just not a constructive use of time.

it is not choosing to close off from the world.  it is being closed off by the US sanctions.

[Soloman Tump]

1 hour ago, ilqx hermolia xpli said:

it is not choosing to close off from the world.  it is being closed off by the US sanctions.

And EU sanctions

And UK

And Canada

And Japan, Taiwan, NZ and Australia.

And the massive list of international corporations, sports, and trade federations. 

 

By invading an independent country based on lies and grandiose power dillusions, Russia has chosen to close itself off from (the majority of ) the world.  The economy is crumbling, the army is a farce, and the civilians who are caught in the middle will suffer for decades to come.  You cannot spin that any other way. 

Edited March 16, 2022 by Soloman Tump

[zlemflolia]

 

[dcom]

7 minutes ago, ilqx hermolia xpli said:

 

The Grayzone (Media Bias/Fact Check)

Quote

QUESTIONABLE SOURCE

A questionable source exhibits one or more of the following: extreme bias, consistent promotion of propaganda/conspiracies, poor or no sourcing to credible information, a complete lack of transparency, and/or is fake news. Fake News is the deliberate attempt to publish hoaxes and/or disinformation for profit or influence (Learn More). Sources listed in the Questionable Category may be very untrustworthy and should be fact-checked on a per-article basis. Please note sources on this list are not considered fake news unless specifically written in the reasoning section for that source. See all Questionable sources.

• Overall, we rate The Grayzone Far-Left Biased and Questionable based on the promotion of propaganda, conspiracy theories, and consistent one-sided reporting.

 

[zlemflolia]

11 minutes ago, dcom said:

The Grayzone (Media Bias/Fact Check)

 

media criticism is great but when what's being presented are primary sources, in this case an interview with a retired US military colonel with a history of working with high ranking NATO aligned military generals giving an inside perspective, it's less relevant.  he is clearly not "far left".  turn off the video when the hosts speak.  god knows i dont have any support for this douglas macgregor guy or view him uncritically, he's a piece of shit, and the hosts give disapproval right after the interview ends

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Douglas_Macgregor

now let's repeat your same process of media criticism on another form of media you just posted, mediabiasfactcheck:

https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/left/cnn-bias/

oh look, they consider CNN "left".  rejected LMFAO.

Edited March 16, 2022 by ilqx hermolia xpli

[dcom]

27 minutes ago, ilqx hermolia xpli said:

now let's repeat your same process of media criticism on another form of media you just posted

When did I post something from CNN? Or are you just being obtuse?

[zlemflolia]

Just now, dcom said:

When did I post something from CNN? Or are you just being obtuse?

am i being obtuse? are you? lol

no im showing you how that website is bullshit, look how they rate CNN, clearly CNN is not "left leaning" but they say it is so they are full of shit lmfao

[dcom]

13 minutes ago, ilqx hermolia xpli said:

am i being obtuse? are you? lol

 That's my cue to again avoid any and all dialogue with you lest I go full ad hominem - again.

Edited March 16, 2022 by dcom

[zlemflolia]

35 minutes ago, dcom said:

 That's my cue to again avoid any and all dialogue with you lest I go full ad hominem - again.

I'm sorry you can't have reasonable conversations with people that disagree with you.  Nothing I wrote is wrong.

[dcom]

23 minutes ago, ilqx hermolia xpli said:

I'm sorry you can't have reasonable conversations with people that disagree with you.

This is exactly what I mean: you're ostensibly smart, but also constantly condescending, self-righteous, and disrespectful towards everyone. That's the real reason why I don't want to discuss or have anything to do with you. KTHXBAI.

Edited March 16, 2022 by dcom

[brian trageskin]

hardcore sex

[zlemflolia]

lol

Edited March 16, 2022 by ilqx hermolia xpli

[ignatius]

30 minutes ago, brian trageskin said:

hardcore sex

[zazen]

haha

[zazen]

but

 

Whats the meta-game on peace deals? I suppose both sides have to evaluate it based on what position both sides are left in if the deal gets broken. Or I guess the game is you bludegon your opponent into accepting the deal they dont really want by simultaneously negotiating and fighting. The costs mount day by day until eventually a deal gets made, but the last scraps of trust gets destroyed. So the deal is only worth anything if the rest of the world continues to watch closely. I suppose a lot of ceasefires and peace deals dont last long; they are fundamentally very unstable things.

Edited March 16, 2022 by zazen

[zlemflolia]

ukraine failed to follow Minsk agreements, im sure Putin just wants them to follow the terms this time and move on with life with no more civilians murdered by Azov.  hopefully all the Azov are gone at this point. 

Edited March 16, 2022 by ilqx hermolia xpli

[chenGOD]

Lol https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Douglas_Macgregor#U.S._Ambassador_to_Germany_nomination

Quote

He has asserted that Muslim immigrants (referred to as "Muslim invaders") come to Europe "with the goal of eventually turning Europe into an Islamic state".^[19] Macgregor has argued that the German concept of Vergangenheitsbewältigung, used to cope with Germany's Nazi past and its atrocities during World War II, is a "sick mentality."^[19] Macgregor has also stated that martial law should be instituted on the U.S.-Mexico border and argued for the extrajudicial execution of those who cross the border at unofficial ports of entry.^[19] Macgregor has also made statements in support of Israel having defensible borders, the annexation of the Golan Heights, and the decision to move the U.S. embassy to Jerusalem.^[20] In a column in The Washington Post he was described as "a racist crackpot who is pro-Russia, anti-Merkel, anti-Muslim and anti-Mexican."^[21]

IN the video posted, he starts off by saying the war is decided, except it's not because Putin ordered his troops not commit war crimes, and if only they could commit war crimes, this would be finished faster.