the watmm GAS thread

[exitonly]

6 hours ago, Bubba69 said:

I've always wanted one of this. Isn't this what richard used on fenix funk 5

i always assumed he used a synton fenix

[thawkins]

8 hours ago, xox said:

Why that sampler? Ive never used an MPC and i just wonder why would someone use one in 2021 and why that one with other MPC-s, and other sampler options around?

I have always wanted it and now when I could justify affording it and get one from a known good previous owner, I decided to go for it.

I think I am mostly interested in the combination of the finger drumming pads, and MIDI sequencing without a computer. Sampling is good too I guess, but it's not something that has ever really been a part of my workflow.

Lots of people still use the old MPC series with JJOS too.

And realistically the only alternative is the Octatrack, which goes for twice the price used and (being an asshole now) for me it is mostly associated with some berlin glitch techno rapidly disappearing up their own ass sound design.

[xox]

1 hour ago, thawkins said:

I have always wanted it and now when I could justify affording it and get one from a known good previous owner, I decided to go for it.

I think I am mostly interested in the combination of the finger drumming pads, and MIDI sequencing without a computer. Sampling is good too I guess, but it's not something that has ever really been a part of my workflow.

Lots of people still use the old MPC series with JJOS too.

And realistically the only alternative is the Octatrack, which goes for twice the price used and (being an asshole now) for me it is mostly associated with some berlin glitch techno rapidly disappearing up their own ass sound design.

well if you want finger drumming it’s understandable and NI Maschine is much more costly! But, I saw used MPC Lives and Ones being sold for the same monies as 1000s, which is bizarre! 

Also, it’s possible to find an OT mk1 costing about the same (don’t be afraid of it; i own an mk2 and I don’t make berlin techno  ).

[thawkins]

3 minutes ago, xox said:

well if you want finger drumming it’s understandable and NI Maschine is much more costly! But, I saw used MPC Lives and Ones being sold for the same monies as 1000s, which is bizarre! 

Also, it’s possible to find an OT mk1 costing about the same (don’t be afraid of it; i own an mk2 and I don’t make berlin techno  ).

NI Maschine is not usable stand alone without the computer, right? 

I think the reason why old MPCs are valuable is that at some point AKAI sold out and their newer stuff is not as good, and the same thing really - now you depend on having a computer around in order to have the full feature set (I remember at least one of the new MPCs has this problem).

I really wanted a standalone sequencer with real-time recording and looping for a long time, stars aligned and that's why the MPC1000. Who knows, maybe I will hate it eventually.

[xox]

22 minutes ago, thawkins said:

now you depend on having a computer around in order to have the full feature set (I remember at least one of the new MPCs has this problem).

Not sure about this; never heard of it! Majority of Akai users recommend buying new ones over the old ones, for many many reasons. Only thing that’s better with the old ones is the retro 12-bit sound but for that you need to buy MPC60. What makes newer machine great is that you can export your projects directly to Ableton, and finish you tracks there, if you wish so ( i hate my OT for not having this option or Overbridge or more physical outs), but afaik you are not dependent on computers, of course, I could be wrong about this.

btw… Stand-alone Maschine was released not long ago!

 

Edited June 7, 2021 by xox

[d-a-m-o]

For those who are waiting for the korg modwave :

edit : couldn't care less about the synth TBH I just want the same shirt.

Edited June 7, 2021 by d-a-m-o

[d-a-m-o]

a few other vids from the Synth Fest France

 

[thawkins]

5 hours ago, xox said:

Not sure about this; never heard of it! Majority of Akai users recommend buying new ones over the old ones, for many many reasons. Only thing that’s better with the old ones is the retro 12-bit sound but for that you need to buy MPC60. What makes newer machine great is that you can export your projects directly to Ableton, and finish you tracks there, if you wish so ( i hate my OT for not having this option or Overbridge or more physical outs), but afaik you are not dependent on computers, of course, I could be wrong about this.

btw… Stand-alone Maschine was released not long ago!

 

I mean I got it because a person I know offered to sell it. I did not do any deep market research and I was not going to buy anything new (i.e. not used) anyway.

It won't make logical sense in any way, it was and will be an emotional decision.

[Limo]

2 hours ago, d-a-m-o said:

I just want the same shirt.

Come to Holland. Lots of people wear those over here.
 

Synth sounds terrible, btw.

[TubularCorporation]

6 hours ago, xox said:

well if you want finger drumming it’s understandable and NI Maschine is much more costly! But, I saw used MPC Lives and Ones being sold for the same monies as 1000s, which is bizarre! 

Also, it’s possible to find an OT mk1 costing about the same (don’t be afraid of it; i own an mk2 and I don’t make berlin techno  ).

For sequencing, the Octatrack doesn't even come close to an MPC.  There are a few things it does really well (x0x style step sequencing, trig conditions, parameter locks) but over all it's not even in the same league. And this is comparing it to the MPC I have, which is a 2000xl.  The sequencer in the 1000 with JJOS is a lot more powerful than the 2kxl.

 

The only reason the 2kxl isn't still the center of my setup is table space and some routine repairs it needs that I keep putting off.  When I had everything sequenced on it I was way more productive than I ever was been before or since, because the sequencing workflow is so efficient and intuitive for me, and since I stopped using it as much I also mostly stopped sequencing MIDI since I haven't found anything else that worked nearly as well for me.  These days I might have one or two free-running sequencers in a track but I mostly play stuff in live.

The Octatrack is great for audio mangling of course, and I use it a LOT, but the MIDI sequecing is really pretty limited.  It's great for live use if you only need a few tracks and don't need linear sequencing or true polyphony. The LFOs and arpeggiator are nice.

 

[xox]

1 hour ago, thawkins said:

It won't make logical sense in any way, it was and will be an emotional decision.

Hey i understand that very well!  imo the most important aspect of using a gear is to like/love the gear! Everything else will follow! 

3 minutes ago, TubularCorporation said:

For sequencing, the Octatrack doesn't even come close to an MPC.  There are a few things it does really well (x0x style step sequencing, trig conditions, parameter locks) but over all it's not even in the same league. And this is comparing it to the MPC I have, which is a 2000xl.  The sequencer in the 1000 with JJOS is a lot more powerful than the 2kxl.

 

The only reason the 2kxl isn't still the center of my setup is table space and some routine repairs it needs that I keep putting off.  When I had everything sequenced on it I was way more productive than I ever was been before or since, because the sequencing workflow is so efficient and intuitive for me, and since I stopped using it as much I also mostly stopped sequencing MIDI since I haven't found anything else that worked nearly as well for me.  These days I might have one or two free-running sequencers in a track but I mostly play stuff in live.

The Octatrack is great for audio mangling of course, and I use it a LOT, but the MIDI sequecing is really pretty limited.  It's great for live use if you only need a few tracks and don't need linear sequencing or true polyphony. The LFOs and arpeggiator are nice.

 

I was also interested in an MPC but im not sure i need it bc i have OT and Mnm and im not running away from computers but id like to try it one day. Just to try the workflow. …

would probably try the One

[TubularCorporation]

6 hours ago, xox said:

Not sure about this; never heard of it! Majority of Akai users recommend buying new ones over the old ones, for many many reasons. Only thing that’s better with the old ones is the retro 12-bit sound but for that you need to buy MPC60. What makes newer machine great is that you can export your projects directly to Ableton, and finish you tracks there, if you wish so ( i hate my OT for not having this option or Overbridge or more physical outs), but afaik you are not dependent on computers, of course, I could be wrong about this.

btw… Stand-alone Maschine was released not long ago!

 

The last friend I had who worked for Akai got a better job around when the Live was released, and this (standalone mode being feature restricted) was very much a design choice made to encourage professional users to buy the more expensive model. I was told they actually did similar stuff with the 1000 vs the 2500 (I honestly forget the details but there were a few transport features that had been standard on all previous MPCs and were used a lot in performance, but when the 1000/2500 came out they were supposedly left out of the 1000 OS on purpose to nudge serious users toward the 2500.  JJOS makes that irrelevant.

 

I don't know anything about any MPCs newer than the Live, though, and I don't even know much about the Live - those touchscreens don't do anything for me.

Edited June 7, 2021 by TubularCorporation

[xox]

1 minute ago, TubularCorporation said:

The last friend I had who worked for Akai got a better job around when the Live was released, and this (standalone mode being feature restricted) was very much a design choice made to encourage professional users to buy the more expensive model. I was told they actually did similar stuff with the 1000 vs the 2500 (I honestly forget the details but there were a few transport features that had been standard on all previous MPCs and were used a lot in performance, but when the 1000/2500 came out they were supposedly left out of the 1000 OS on purpose to nudge serious users toward the 2500.  JJOS makes that irrelevant.

No wonder the jjos is so popular, among other reasons 

[TubularCorporation]

4 minutes ago, xox said:

Hey i understand that very well!  imo the most important aspect of using a gear is to like/love the gear! Everything else will follow! 

I was also interested in an MPC but im not sure i need it bc i have OT and Mnm and im not running away from computers but id like to try it one day. Just to try the workflow. …

would probably try the One

It's a different style of working (and the new MPCs are different again - the one I use doesn't have a piano roll or anything, it's only event list editing.  The MPC is more like sequencing on a DAW, the Octatrack is a groovebox type step sequencer.  They work well together, because step sequencing is what the MPC (at least the older ones I know best) are worst at, but the Octatrack sequencer is overall a lot more limited than the MPC (but it's really good at what it does do).

[thawkins]

I am not running away from computers for good, I am just thinking that having a standalone sequencer would help me grow better musically.

I really really detest the recent trend of having to depend on some software running on a computer in order to use your gear to the fullest. More often than not this ends up being some shoddily made stuff that falls out of the support window pretty much instantly once the vendor releases some new and shiny thing. Unless of course you shell out $$$$ for the top of the line pro model that costs 2x the price of a new laptop. It always leads to some DRM fueled push to try and make people pay for subscriptions or pay for additional software that makes your device useful.

I mean the AKAI MPK Mini I have can not even get a basic MIDI sync going without insanely drifting. Yet the old MPC series has legendary MIDI timing, so something must have happened in the meantime.

[TubularCorporation]

2 minutes ago, xox said:

No wonder the jjos is so popular, among other reasons 

Nobody can really prove it, but since the JJOS developer was also one of the main devs of the 1000/2500 factory OS there's also some speculation that he may have deliberately made the stock OSes a bit less good than they could have been because he already knew that he was going to quit at the end of the dev cycle and release his own alternative.  Or it could be that JJOS is closer to what he wanted the factory OS to be like.

 

Anyway, this is all hearsay from people who didn't come on to staff until around the 5000/Renaissance/Rhythm Wolf low point, and they seem to be doing a lot better at actually designing decent products again these days, people seem to like them. 

[thawkins]

JJOS guy is the Cenk of AKAI.

Also he is probably also the mysterious author of bitcoin, Satoshi Nakamoto.

[TubularCorporation]

Hopefully there will be another run of kits soon and I'll have the money to get one:

I really like the Chroma Cauldron Wavecomber, and this thing looks like it would be a really good addition to my little composite video processing setup.

 

The rest of the parts for the Lyra 8 are now backordered until March 2022 because of the bi global silicon shortage, and the FFG colorizer parts aren't due for a few more months either, so this would be a good (and useful) project in the mean time.

[Bubba69]

On 6/6/2021 at 9:49 PM, nikisoko said:

i always assumed he used a synton fenix

no he's talking about the city in arizona

[sweepstakes]

On 6/7/2021 at 12:08 AM, thawkins said:

I have always wanted it and now when I could justify affording it and get one from a known good previous owner, I decided to go for it.

I think I am mostly interested in the combination of the finger drumming pads, and MIDI sequencing without a computer. Sampling is good too I guess, but it's not something that has ever really been a part of my workflow.

Lots of people still use the old MPC series with JJOS too.

And realistically the only alternative is the Octatrack, which goes for twice the price used and (being an asshole now) for me it is mostly associated with some berlin glitch techno rapidly disappearing up their own ass sound design.

Yeah it really sounds like the right choice. Some people are MPC people and it sounds like you might be one. I think the sampling workflow on the MPC is unparalleled, at least for a more cut-up (i.e. 90s hip hop or big beat, 00s house) workflow. 

FWIW I find the newer MPCs hideous and I have no interest in using one, looking at one for more than 30 seconds, or bringing one into my home.

You're not wrong about the Octatrack either. The sequencer is kind of fun for some things but as you get bored it's too easy to just throw LFOs, retriggering, and effects on everything. Also I find it pretty awkward for melodic work unless you just use it as a MIDI sequencer. It has a lot of benefits for coming up with drums quickly, though.

[TubularCorporation]

The obvious solution is to have both.

[xox]

1 hour ago, sweepstakes said:

I find the newer MPCs hideous

What exactly? Looks?

[sweepstakes]

5 hours ago, xox said:

What exactly? Looks?

Yes. The layout, the gross light-up pads, and the color touch screen like a smart phone. And look and feel matters when it comes to gear. If you truly don't care about look and feel and you fancy yourself a very practical goal-oriented music-maker, then in general software + cheap MIDI controllers are the tools for you.

[thawkins]

39 minutes ago, sweepstakes said:

Yes. The layout, the gross light-up pads, and the color touch screen like a smart phone. And look and feel matters when it comes to gear. If you truly don't care about look and feel and you fancy yourself a very practical goal-oriented music-maker, then in general software + cheap MIDI controllers are the tools for you.

Yeah except don't buy cheap AKAI MIDI controllers either - well at least not bottom dollar stuff that you want to use for something more than sending pitch and CC data.

For anything that needs to handle timecode, arpeggiator, velocity sensitivity you need something better than the cheapo products.

 

Edited June 9, 2021 by thawkins

[chim]

Why are you even bothering with linear timecode stuff outside of a DAW? The classic way to do it was ride a bunch of mixer faders. You're not going to get much more precision than that outside of a programmable DAW.